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Tyrion is a Targaryen (His Siblings may be as well)


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#1 mattah84

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 10:02 AM

There are a lot of characteristics about Tyrion Lannister that make you stop and question whether or not he is really One Hundred Percent a Lannister. I think that he could be a Targaryen, and over the course of the books the evidence only seems to grow stronger.

The first of these is his hair color being more White rather than the typical Lannister Gold. "so blonde it looks almost white."

The second one, which I think alludes to Tyrion being a Targaryen more than his hair color, are his mismatched eyes, one of them black and one of them green. The only other character I can think of that had two different eye colors was a Targaryen, Shiera Seastar. Sheira was one of Aegon V’s children.

The next few pieces of evidence that we have linking Tyrion to potentially being a Targaryen, are his dragon dreams which he confides to Jon Snow. This could be a Red Herring put into the books by GRRM, but it is from the very beginning in A Game of Thrones when Tyrion goes to the North so I don’t necessarily think that is the case.

Also, Danaerys has a vision in the House of the Undying of a White Lion running through Grass Taller than a Man. This seems to allude to Tyrion, though it could signify Jaime as well as he has a White Kingsguard Cloak. But I think that the grass taller than a man part of it, seems more likely that it is Tyrion as he is a Dwarf, and it would be much easier to find grass that is taller than him as opposed to Jaime.

Next there is the attraction or lust which we are led to believe that Aerys Targaryen had for Tyrion’s mother Joanna Lannister. This coupled with Tywin telling Tyrion that he cannot prove that he is not his son so he is able to walk around with the Lannister name, further insinuates that Tyrion may not be Tywin’s. A lot of people argue that Tyrion not being Tywin’s would take away from the dynamic of their scenes together, but I think it would only serve to enhance it. Tyrion turned out smart as hell because he was nurtured and raised by Tywin Lannister (a very cunning individual), but the difference is Tyrion’s knack for compassion. He didn’t just help Bran because he was a crippled boy, because he helped Sansa in Kings Landing to when Joffrey was humiliating her. Sansa is not a bastard and doesn’t have a deformity, so Tyrion’s compassion seems to extend beyond Bastards and those with deformities.

Also, maybe it could be something where Joanna Lannister was actually part Targaryen herself, or the Lannister line comes from the Targaryens. Joanna was Tywin’s cousin and they got married. This to me sounds a little bit like the Targaryens marrying each other to keep bloodlines pure. Also, we don’t have a real clear picture of where the Lannister bloodline came from or where the house originally started. All we know is that Tytos was Tywin’s father, and that Tytos had three siblings. Besides that, we don’t really know how House Lannister originated. We can trace the Stark lineage back to the Age of Heroes, and the Targaryen lineage back before the Doom of Valyria, but we can only trace the Lannisters back a small percentage of that time.

Another thing that has left me wondering about Tyrion’s bloodline since it happened, is when he fell into the water well traveling to Essos. We heard about so many people getting sick from Grey Scale from either falling in the water, or coming into contact with it. However, when Tyrion falls in and is saved from the water, NOTHING happens to him. So Tyrion seems pretty invulnerable to disease so far.

Finally, there is a pretty interesting link between Danaerys, Jon Snow, and Tyrion (All Possible Targaryens). Danaerys is definitely a Targaryen, and Jon Snow is most likely a Targaryen, as he could be Lyanna and Rhaegar’s child. Tyrion we know is at least part Lannister, however as I stated we don’t really know how the Lannister Blood Line originated as we only go so far back as Tytos (Tywin’s father), so he could in fact be part Targaryen. There is the both Lannister Blood Line that we don't know one hundred percent about, and there is the lust that we are told Aerys had for Tywin's wife. Dany’s mom died while giving birth to her, Lyanna probably died giving birth to Jon Snow, and Joanna Lannister died giving birth to Tyrion. It is wierd that GRRM would write it this way and have it be a coincedence, but maybe it is. Plus, all three of their moms dying at birth is something that we find out about in AGOT so it is something that he had planned from the beginning of ASOIAF obviously.

This is definitely kind of crackpot to say that Tyrion is Targaryen, and maybe other Lannisters as well, but when you list all of the different hints and evidence out together, it really starts to add up and make some sense.

#2 TalalOfDorne

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 10:07 AM

This has been discussed a lot of times before, and even though Im not happy about the possibility of this coming true I have to say I cant deny some of the hints.

#3 Visen

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 10:13 AM

I don't know but I hope not. I enjoy Martin's work but I do get wearisome of secret Targaryens and dead people who don't really die.

Thanks to the seven for Ned and his head who both stayed dead.

#4 -Ghost-

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:25 AM

There is like a 20 something page thread from like 2 weeks ago about this that you can read.
It will provide you with a lot more info than I can at the moment.

Lancel has sandy blonde hair, which is different from other Lannisters. Tommen is also described as having white blonde hair.

Euron Greyjoy has mismatched eyes. 1 blue and 1 black.

As I understand it, Dragon dreams are prophecy dreams, like Dany and a character from the WoW sample have. Tyrion hasnt had these type of dreams that come true. He just had a dream about a dragon, which doesnt really mean anything.

Targaryens arent immune to disease. Egg and Aemons brother Daeron died of a pox he cought from a whore.

Edited by -Ghost-, 03 April 2013 - 11:34 AM.


#5 DaveSnow House Stark

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:32 AM

I'm not usually fond of this type of secret siblings but it is hard to ignore the comparisons. One thing that seems odd though, if Targ characteristics are so strong then why is Jon so Stark looking? It's stated that he looks more like Ned than any of his other children?

#6 Woftis

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:35 AM

I'm open to the possibility, after all, we'll need a third head of the dragon if Aegon turns out to be a fake.

#7 DarkSnow

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:39 AM

The Lannisters were founded by Lann the Clever who took Casterly rock from the Casterlys. The field of fire was King Loren Lannister of the Rock and King Mern of the Reach against the Targayens (Aegon) their not related.

Edited by DarkSnow, 03 April 2013 - 11:40 AM.


#8 King of Winters

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:40 AM

Personally I'd hate it if Tyrion was a secret Targ. I'm all in for twists and turns in ASOIAF but I'd really hate it if he was a Targ.

#9 Son of a Harpy

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:42 AM

If Jamie and Cersei are Targs, so is Tommen, a.k.a. TPTWP.

#10 Mladen

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:42 AM

First to OP, well done, now if you would make acquaintance with `search engine` you would find out that there are more than one thread with the same topic. Last one reached 400 posts, and that was last week, I think

And this is the proof that newbies have no fresh ideas.

As for the end, why are you so determined to see three riders of dragons. The prophecy has been told by a very unreliable man, someone who misinterpreted prophecies not once, than twice. We don`t need 3 heads of dragon. We need one, wise, psychologicaly sane head.

#11 Woftis

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:44 AM

First to OP, well done, now if you would make acquaintance with `search engine` you would find out that there are more than one thread with the same topic. Last one reached 400 posts, and that was last week, I think

And this is the proof that newbies have no fresh ideas.

As for the end, why are you so determined to see three riders of dragons. The prophecy has been told by a very unreliable man, someone who misinterpreted prophecies not once, than twice. We don`t need 3 heads of dragon. We need one, wise, psychologicaly sane head.


Very possibly you're right, but there's no point completely disregarding the idea.

#12 King of Winters

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:47 AM

First to OP, well done, now if you would make acquaintance with `search engine` you would find out that there are more than one thread with the same topic. Last one reached 400 posts, and that was last week, I think

And this is the proof that newbies have no fresh ideas.

As for the end, why are you so determined to see three riders of dragons. The prophecy has been told by a very unreliable man, someone who misinterpreted prophecies not once, than twice. We don`t need 3 heads of dragon. We need one, wise, psychologicaly sane head.

A bit of sarcasm there. Nice.
I agree about the prophecy thing. It may be misinterpreted and I would think this is one of those that has been.

#13 mattah84

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:48 AM

First to OP, well done, now if you would make acquaintance with `search engine` you would find out that there are more than one thread with the same topic. Last one reached 400 posts, and that was last week, I think

And this is the proof that newbies have no fresh ideas.

As for the end, why are you so determined to see three riders of dragons. The prophecy has been told by a very unreliable man, someone who misinterpreted prophecies not once, than twice. We don`t need 3 heads of dragon. We need one, wise, psychologicaly sane head.


I don't necessarily think that the Dragons have to be ridden. Three Heads of the Dragon doesn't necessarily have to mean three dragon riders. I for one think the Three Heads of the Dragon are probably just Drogon, Viserion, and Rhaegal, and part of the Azor Azai prophecy was fulfilled when she pulled them from the fire.

Also, the Dragons could potentially be warged instead of ridden. The warging of Dragons probably caused the mini-doom at Hardhome.

However, three is a number that is synonomous with the Targs. Three heads in their sigil, aegon the conqeror and his two sisters had three dragons, and now Dany has three dragons. Quaithe says the number three will be very important for Daenarys in one of their conversations.

Edited by mattah84, 03 April 2013 - 11:51 AM.


#14 mankytoes

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:53 AM

I just think, assuming Jon is a Targ, having another secret one would be bad writing, espeically with the maybe-Targ Aeron. I'd probably prefer Jaime and Cersei to be secret Targs if anyone has to be.

#15 King of Winters

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:55 AM

I just think, assuming Jon is a Targ, having another secret one would be bad writing, espeically with the maybe-Targ Aeron. I'd probably prefer Jaime and Cersei to be secret Targs if anyone has to be.

If anyone had to be I'd want it to be Jon and only Jon

#16 Light a wight tonight

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:55 AM

Also, Danaerys has a vision in the House of the Undying of a White Lion running through Grass Taller than a Man. This seems to allude to Tyrion, though it could signify Jaime as well as he has a White Kingsguard Cloak. But I think that the grass taller than a man part of it, seems more likely that it is Tyrion as he is a Dwarf, and it would be much easier to find grass that is taller than him as opposed to Jaime.

To me the white lion, if it is Tyrion, would be an indicator that he is in fact a Lannister. If he was a Targ he'd be a dragon, no?

#17 mattah84

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 11:57 AM

The Lannisters were founded by Lann the Clever who took Casterly rock from the Casterlys. The field of fire was King Loren Lannister of the Rock and King Mern of the Reach against the Targayens (Aegon) their not related.


Forgot about Loren Lannister. So House Lannister was definitely around before the Targaryens came to Westeros.

The question I would have at this point is, do we know what the lineage of House Lannister was starting with King Loren Lannister and moving through Jaime, Cersei, and Tyrion to say for sure that none of Tywin's kids are part Targ?

#18 mattah84

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 12:00 PM

To me the white lion, if it is Tyrion, would be an indicator that he is in fact a Lannister. If he was a Targ he'd be a dragon, no?


That definitely signifies that he is at least part lannister. I am saying that he could also be part something else. Tywin married his cousin, much like the Targs marry their own family members. Also, King Loren Lannister knelt and swore fealty to Aegon and his sisters after the Field of Fire, but I don't think we know the Lannister Lineage stretching from King Loren Lannister all the way through Tywin's kids.

#19 Ame

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 12:02 PM

Stop telling people "there has been a thread on this already" if they missed it so what? I'm here a lot and I'm not in every thread.

Tyrion as a Targ is just a conspiracy theory; his personality and manner of rule and how he thinks is the same as Tywin according to one of our most reliable witnesses, and honestly if he wasn't Tywin's son Tywin wouldn't shower him in the gold he needs for his decadent lifestyle/to escape trouble.

Think about it; Tyrion wastes his money routinely and needs more form somebody named Tywin who doesn't like him; the same Tywin who starts a treasonous war for him and plans to commit suicide for house Lannister by kidnapping Eddard Stark to get him back (but was rescued from that by Jaime wounding Ned). We also know Tywin doesn't like Tyrion.

If Tyrion was living proof of his wife's infedility Tywin would have washed his hands of Tyrion long ago.

#20 mankytoes

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Posted 03 April 2013 - 12:05 PM

Just checked the dates, and Tywin was hand for eight years after Tyrion's birth. I think that's fairly conclusive, I don't see Tywin for hanging around that long after Aerys raping or seducing his wife, or Aerys successfully hiding this from him.