I'm no friend of Balon Greyjoy, but he had no obligation to accept Robb Stark's alliance

[Starfell]

Yes, he thought that if he crowned himself, the Iron Throne would swallow it meekly, and let him have the North to boot. How did that work out, I wonder?

Well, isn't this why we call him "The King Who Lost The Plot"? Having said that, I can hardly blame him for making this assumption, if there's anything that everyone knows about Tywin, it's how forgiving he is of rebels

[Beorn Snow]

I agree Balon had no obligation to do the sensible thing.

But he was an idiot. Before crushing the north I´d at least try to establish a Lannister alliance. (If you are good at something never do it for free).

[Fetch me a block]

Hmm, Robb Stark killed 2 of Balon's sons and held a 3rd captive? I seem to recall men who were not Starks, and one who was not even a Northmen, killing Balon's sons and Robb returned the hostage. So yes, the man who offers me the new job is not even related to those who killed my 2 sons, and returns my 3rd son to me, yes I would take the job offer.

Balon still holds grudges against the Starks though

[eggs]

Thats all true op, but he's still an idiot.

[Fetch me a block]

after what theon did i think balon wimped out afraid that the north would retaliate angrily so he ran to tywin tail in hand for protection

i hate the greyjoys if not already evident

Agreed

[Fetch me a block]

Thats all true op, but he's still an idiot.

Yes

[The Frosted King]

Balon had no obligation to accept Robb's terms, but they were the only thing that made his ultimate dream a possibility.

Balon would only survive as king as long as he was a third or fourth priority.

The second the mainland issues were ironed out(not punny), the Iron throne would smash the ironmen in their backwater base.

And likely take Balon's head and familial seat in the process, considering this would be his second rebellion.

The truth is that as long as Robb was growing stronger in power, Balon would be growing stronger in his shadow.

Balon offering terms to Tyrion as a king would never sit well with the south, and his method was the height of stupidity.

Why would the lions fight the direwolves for the north if they'd be prepared to cede it to the hated, disdained squids?

*Hint* They wouldn't.

Balon had no chance on his own, and doomed his side in his pettiness.

Not obligated to be Robb's ally, but he's not obligated to be respected either.

And he proved it so, and Tywin discarding his terms sealed it.

[PrimeRhaegar]

damn where is the retweet button when you need it i agree. same way i couldn't fault aerys not wanting rhaegar to marry cersei politically great move but he was also in his right to not accept it.

[BloodyGoatHoat]

Balon should have taken Theon's suggestion. Theon should have spilled Balons guts on the floor for refusing.

:agree:

Except Theon should have drowned him with his bare hands (Damphair would've backed him 100% after that).

[TheCasualObserver]

I've made it no secret that I think Balon's decision to invade the North is one of the weaker parts of ASOIAF's narrative, a necessary plot point which facilitates the ruin (and eventually rise I hope) of the Starks. However, I do agree that Balon had no obligations to answer Robb's letter. It was written from a position of weakness (even though at that point Robb was winning) and the Iron price does not accept anything that is given, especially crowns. In ACOK, Balon remarks on the dangers of attacking the Lannisters and the might of Tywin, even though that doesn't strike me as a particularly Ironborn thing to say, but when he attacks the North and declares himself King he makes an eventual enemy of Tywin anyway, not to mention an enemy of the man who tried to befriend him. Instead of attacking Lannisport, a city with no navy and few men to defend it (especially after the battle of Oxcross) Balon decides to become a Kingdom builder (instead of going back to the "Old Ways" of raiding) and seizes land he can't realistically hope to hold in the long term. And THEN he sends a letter to the Lannisters, apparently unaware that his letter is remarkable similar to the one Robb sent to him and which he laughed away. It's not so much the actions of a stupid leader as the actions of a man incapable of rational thought. That, or simply lazy writing.

[BranBrokeLegs]

I agree with everything that's been said. Balon was well within his rights to contemptuously reject Rob's offer of a crown, but the guy is still probably the biggest idiot in the series.

His plan for conquering the North had zero chance of success. Winterfell is only taken with Theon's inside knowledge. White Harbor, Dreadfort, Last Hearth, Barrowtown and most of the North were never under any threat from the Ironborn. And we see that the North despite being emptied of fighting men pretty easily takes back all the Ironborn's conquests despite Ramsay killing off a bunch of other Northmen.

Whereas plan B (attacking Lannisport and other Westerlands coastal cities) could have generated more plunder than the ironborn had seen for almost 300 years.

[lannistergold]

In essence: Robb trusted Balon to be rational. He should have known better.

[JLE]

Balon was lucky to be *alive* after his previous rebellion. He and nobody else is responsible for the death of his other sons, and for Theon being a "ward" (and, not entirely officially, a hostage) at Winterfell. And Theon was treated pretty well, all considering: he could have been kept chained in a dungeon and fed on bread and water, like many hostages...

Although Robb's most sensible move with him would have been to keep Theon by him in the war, "in a place of honour" - perhaps giving him the honour of going with Catelyn's deputation to Stannis and Renly - and do absolutely nothing, in the hope that the Lannisters, with Robb himself raiding the westerlands, would be the ones dumb enough to offer Balon an alliance. At which point Balon would have seen *them* as being the weaker side for daring to seek his aid, and raided Lannisport instead...

[Fat Mac]

:agree:

Except Theon should have drowned him with his bare hands (Damphair would've backed him 100% after that).

Well, thinking about this more in depth..... no way would Damphair support him. If Theon killed Balon, no matter how he did it, he would be a kinslayer.

[danm_999]

Yes, Balon had no obligation to Robb. That said, he should have taken the deal. As Rodrik points out to Asha, the Old Way only works if the Ironborn are one kingdom amongst many. If Westeros was unified, they've got no hope in getting away with reaving long term.

Hence Balon really should have been supporting Robb's secession, since that pattern being repeated across Westeros is the only way his beloved lifestyle would be feesible.

[Batman]

He went with heart over head.

[BloodyGoatHoat]

Well, thinking about this more in depth..... no way would Damphair support him. If Theon killed Balon, no matter how he did it, he would be a kinslayer.

I was just poking fun at Aeron's obnoxious obsession with drowning.

[Ser Creighton]

Well first off Balon started the last war, and he lost. He then agreed to peace and they did their treaty signing and all that. Balon is lucky nobody took his head. The man waits and attacks, he had no reason too, he didn't learn the first time either. All they can do is raid, they can't get into a land battle or hold any lands for very long. Basically he is just being a dick. What is complete BS is acts like the Iron Born just do whatever they want. They take period, they don't make deals. Then he makes a deal.

Robb Stark was asking for his help not ordering it, and Ned had the right idea to begin with, don't let Theon out your site. Robb offered a deal, Balon said no. Balon was a nut, he lived under some belief that he could do whatever he wanted and there should be no repercussions. He would attack people and get mad when they counter attacked. Why? Shouldn't you kind of expect that. Guy was a walking temper tantrum.

[sansa's sworn sword]

I agree. but still balon is an idiot

[Usrnmhsnomning]

So murdering your father (and becoming detested by all) is the right thing to do when he doesn't agree with your plan?

As opposed to betraying the man you called your brother and agreeing with wanton rape, murder, and pillaging? Yeah, Theon should have put his dagger through Balons heart and sailed back to the Oldstones while the Ironborn flustered amongst themselves over a new leader.

What makes you say that? Then Theon would be a kinslayer, accursed in the eyes of gods and men.

So?

Robb: Is your father on our side?

Theon: No, I killed him.

Robb: What? You're a kinslayer!

Theon: It was kill him or let him ravage the North and cost you the war. You've been more family to me than he has.

Robb: Oh. No worries then!

And been cursed as Kinslayer ? I dunno if he was quite that suicidal. Vic and Euron would have had him for lunch if he did that.

And attacking Winterfell wasn't suicidal? Let's ask Reek how that's turned out for him. Oh right, castrated, flayed, crippled, and a captive to a man intending to burn him alive. Yep, what Theon did was MUCH better.