Stark Revenge Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Not sure of this had been discussed before or not, but he we go. I know that many people don't believe that Aegon is real and is in fact a Blackfrye imposter. I personally think that he is real. I've heard people use the argument that Aegon is long dead as when the Lannisters came into the RK Elia fought like a tigress to protect him. Now I think that the reason for this is that she fought because she was convinced that the baby was Aegon not an imposter because Varys didn't tell her. Due to his little birds he probably knew that the Lannister host was coming towards KL before most people. He didn't trust them, realized the king most likely wouldn't listen to him and decided to take precautions. He swapped babies without alerting anyone including Elia. Think explains why she did her utmost to protect her 'son'. Any thoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Direwolf of the Starks Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 I'm pretty sure a mother would know if her baby was switched Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 She couldn`t recognize her own son while nursing him? No way... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Revenge Posted May 31, 2013 Author Share Posted May 31, 2013 Well exactly how old was Aegon supposed to be when it happened? If he was young enough then I don't think that even a mother could've told the difference apart. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlefingers In The Air Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Well exactly how old was Aegon supposed to be when it happened? If he was young enough then I don't think that even a mother could've told the difference apart. you have no idea of the connection between a mother and her child Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Direwolf of the Starks Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Well exactly how old was Aegon supposed to be when it happened? If he was young enough then I don't think that even a mother could've told the difference apart. A mother has a sixth sense about those sort of things they know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Well exactly how old was Aegon supposed to be when it happened? If he was young enough then I don't think that even a mother could've told the difference apart.He was around one year old, but still that doesn`t change the fact his own mother, the woman that spends every day woth him wouldn`t recognize him. It`s absurd to think that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 A mother has a sixth sense about those sort of things they knowAnd I see that every time when we bring mothers to the nursery in the hospital. They always know which one is theirs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Revenge Posted May 31, 2013 Author Share Posted May 31, 2013 He was around one year old, but still that doesn`t change the fact his own mother, the woman that spends every day woth him wouldn`t recognize him. It`s absurd to think that.To say she spent every day with him is wrong. She was the wife of the crown prince. No doubt she was needed to be at important social functions/events. I'm sure they had a wet nurse and maids that looked after him. Perhaps Eila didn't spend as much time with her children as others did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinterKing Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 To say she spent every day with him is wrong. She was the wife of the crown prince. No doubt she was needed to be at important social functions/events. I'm sure they had a wet nurse and maids that looked after him. Perhaps Eila didn't spend as much time with her children as others did.Are you confusing today's monarchies with medieval ones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 To say she spent every day with him is wrong. She was the wife of the crown prince. No doubt she was needed to be at important social functions/events. I'm sure they had a wet nurse and maids that looked after him. Perhaps Eila didn't spend as much time with her children as others did.Perhaps she didn`t, but I bet that she could recognize if her child is switched. Also, it was time of war, there were no social functions at that time. Further more, he was a future King, and I bet she was especially diligent in taking care of him/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stark Revenge Posted May 31, 2013 Author Share Posted May 31, 2013 Perhaps she didn`t, but I bet that she could recognize if her child is switched. Also, it was time of war, there were no social functions at that time. Further more, he was a future King, and I bet she was especially diligent in taking care of him/Ok I see your point. But what if Varys switched them only hours (possibly minutes but that's cutting it too close) before the sack then it is possible that in the confusion and chaos that followed Elia was busy elsewhere. She did have another child to take care of as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djinn Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 This event happened in the nursery, so Varys could have switched the babies while Elia wasn't there, just before Gregor arrived. Then Elia becomes aware that there are enemies inside, runs off to the nursery, gets there just about the same time as Gregor, but doesn't have enough time to realize the switch since Gregor gets in and goes straight to the baby(specially if he was crying, we know how Gregor reacts to that), smashes it, then turn to Elia.A baby that could pass as Aegon under Elia scrutiny is unlikely, but if Elia doesn't have the possibility to look it up close, then it's possible. It all depends on the timing of the switch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Ok I see your point. But what if Varys switched them only hours (possibly minutes but that's cutting it too close) before the sack then it is possible that in the confusion and chaos that followed Elia was busy elsewhere. She did have another child to take care of as well.The problem with the switch is that Varys would have to anticipate many events that can`t be predicted. He should have found a child similar to Aegon on appearence with his silver hair, then he would have to go on exact right time, hoping that Tywin`s forces didn`t sack the city and switch the baby. You have to admit, it`s not just bizarre, it`s crackpot to believe Varys actually managed to do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djinn Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 The problem with the switch is that Varys would have to anticipate many events that can`t be predicted. He should have found a child similar to Aegon on appearance with his silver hair, then he would have to go on exact right time, hoping that Tywin`s forces didnt`t sack the city and switch the baby. You have to admit, it`s not just bizarre, it`s crackpot to believe Varys actually managed to do that.Well, Varys actually suspected of Tywin intentions before he got inside KL. In fact, after the Trident, it would make sense to take some measures to protect the heir, and lookalikes are hardly unheard in history. He could have found child after the Trident and waited for the right moment to do the switch. Jaime memories imply that the Red Keep didn't fell immediately, and Varys has access to the tunnel/passages system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted May 31, 2013 Share Posted May 31, 2013 Well, Varys actually suspected of Tywin intentions before he got inside KL. In fact, after the Trident, it would make sense to take some measures to protect the heir, and lookalikes are hardly unheard in history. He could have found child after the Trident and waited for the right moment to do the switch. Jaime memories imply that the Red Keep didn't fell immediately, and Varys has access to the tunnel/passages system.Yes, perhaps but that would imply that Varys knew he would have needed change. And that`s just absurd. He could have organized escape route for Elia and her children and secure them. But, no, he had gone to find a child that resembles Aegon and switch him. I mean, in the chaos, he didn`t go to find Elia and make sure they are safe, he went on exchanging babies? Not just not likely, it`s illogical. Unless he didn`t do that, then he just had already a baby across Narrow sea with appropriate blood to claim the throne when the time comes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarkAndFullOfTurnips Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 The problem with the switch is that Varys would have to anticipate many events that can`t be predicted. He should have found a child similar to Aegon on appearence with his silver hair, then he would have to go on exact right time, hoping that Tywin`s forces didn`t sack the city and switch the baby. You have to admit, it`s not just bizarre, it`s crackpot to believe Varys actually managed to do that.All he'd have to predict was that the rebellion would prevail and thus the babies would be killed. In fact Varys advises against allowing Tywin into KL. Granted it makes it easier when the baby's head is smashed, but even a baby killed with a dagger could be any baby, and I don't think it would be predictable that Tywin would present the dead babies as he did for other people to look and say "That dead baby isn't Aegon!"Sneaking Elia, Rhaenys and Aegon all out is much harder than swapping a baby few people knew enough to recognize, and I think telling a woman I can save your son but not you may incline someone to trust, even if she would be reticent to give her son to a creep like Varys, it's pretty reasonable that you would at least try to have your son saved if no one could save you or your daughter along with it. Plus Tywin would ask where the hell Elia is and Varys would've lost his head among others.I actually think Aegon is a Blackfyre but to say this was an impossible feat, to me, is not really true. In fact if it's so crackpot then George is not a great writer. The whole point of this story is that you don't really know either way (yet) and while evidence favors him being fAegon, it's still remotely possible he's the real kid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kahl Trollo Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 Well exactly how old was Aegon supposed to be when it happened? If he was young enough then I don't think that even a mother could've told the difference apart.As a father (of twins) I cannot say how utterly wrong that idea is.Maybe if you swapped him when he was a zygot, she MIGHT have a chance of being fooled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stannis Eats No Peaches Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 Elia would have known. There was no baby switch. Varys couldn't have known that Aegon would have his head smashed in (ugh that's a horrible image). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Littlefingers In The Air Posted June 1, 2013 Share Posted June 1, 2013 Just to think about what Gregor did to those two turns my stomach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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