Weariness of the White Walkers

[Prince of Dragonstone]

Is anyone else starting to get a little weary of whatever GRRM has coming up with the White Walkers? One aspect of the series that I think most of the fans really enjoy is the realism and realpolitik storylines...the War of the Five Kings, the inter-familial drama, the political intrigues of King's Landing, the mysteries of the Citadel etc.

GRRM is wonderful with taking common fantasy tropes and subverting them, which gives me hope for whatever he has in store for the White Walkers, but if it is just another demon/zombie invasion and all the Houses of Westeros have to drop whatever their doing and join forces against the "Big Bad" , it's going to feel incredibly cheap and unfitting for what has been a pretty untypical story thus far.

I mean, what will be the point for us to get invested in these stories...for us to invest in certain families and characters if all of that is going to be erased by this other-worldly force? I used to really like the concept of petty lords fighting petty wars while a much more dangerous force loomed in the background, but as we get closer to this force coming, I am getting more tired of it.

The careful planning of characters like Littlefinger and Varys, the machinations of Dany and (F)Aegon, whatever the hell Archmaester Marywn is brewing at the Citadel...what becomes the point of all this if the last book becomes a battle against zombies?

I'm more concerned with Arya getting her revenge, Dany invading Westeros, Jon and Stannis setting the North to rites, the fate of the Boltons and Freys. The internal power struggle between the Lannisters and Tyrells. I want to focus on this, not ice zombies. I just hope that the White Walkers don't come to dominate too much of the story going forward. Quite frankly, I think that whole subplot had it's moment and has lingered on too long to the point that I no longer care for it.

[Fat Mac]

Well I don't mind the Others as a storyline in general. I would rather have the Others storyline localized to the North, as the final part of the NW and Jon's storyline, and maybe Stannis' as well. All of Westeros joining hands to defeat them is way too corny for my tastes.

[King Stannis' Man]

Is anyone else starting to get a little weary of whatever GRRM has coming up with the White Walkers? One aspect of the series that I think most of the fans really enjoy is the realism and realpolitik storylines...the War of the Five Kings, the inter-familial drama, the political intrigues of King's Landing, the mysteries of the Citadel etc.

GRRM is wonderful with taking common fantasy tropes and subverting them, which gives me hope for whatever he has in store for the White Walkers, but if it is just another demon/zombie invasion and all the Houses of Westeros have to drop whatever their doing and join forces against the "Big Bad" , it's going to feel incredibly cheap and unfitting for what has been a pretty untypical story thus far.

I mean, what will be the point for us to get invested in these stories...for us to invest in certain families and characters if all of that is going to be erased by this other-worldly force? I used to really like the concept of petty lords fighting petty wars while a much more dangerous force loomed in the background, but as we get closer to this force coming, I am getting more tired of it.

The careful planning of characters like Littlefinger and Varys, the machinations of Dany and (F)Aegon, whatever the hell Archmaester Marywn is brewing at the Citadel...what becomes the point of all this if the last book becomes a battle against zombies?

I'm more concerned with Arya getting her revenge, Dany invading Westeros, Jon and Stannis setting the North to rites, the fate of the Boltons and Freys. The internal power struggle between the Lannisters and Tyrells. I want to focus on this, not ice zombies. I just hope that the White Walkers don't come to dominate too much of the story going forward. Quite frankly, I think that whole subplot had it's moment and has lingered on too long to the point that I no longer care for it.

I agree

I hope there is some kind of twist with them, like idk being the ice equivalent to dragons maybe

[Prince of the Green]

I have not been a big fan of the political maneuverings of the first five books. I find politics to be a very banal subject matter. It's kind of like professional sports in a way. Who cares what happens at the end of the season? Pay the right people to do the things you want them to do and the same result comes to light.

Also, it encourages people to be assholes to one another when that course of action can only lead to hate.

[Ser Leftwich]

GRRM has had a story in mind. A overwhelming zombie invasion seems unlikely, given the "subversion of tropes" generally practiced by GRRM. We don't know what is going to happen, that is the best part.

Also, in the immortal words of Big Bucket Wull:

“I want to live forever in a land where summer lasts a thousand years. I want a castle in the clouds where I can look down over the world. I want to be six-and-twenty again. When I was six-and-twenty I could fight all day and fuck all night. What men want does not matter." ADwD p.561

[Humble Hedge Knight]

Is anyone else starting to get a little weary of whatever GRRM has coming up with the White Walkers? One aspect of the series that I think most of the fans really enjoy is the realism and realpolitik storylines...the War of the Five Kings, the inter-familial drama, the political intrigues of King's Landing, the mysteries of the Citadel etc.

GRRM is wonderful with taking common fantasy tropes and subverting them, which gives me hope for whatever he has in store for the White Walkers, but if it is just another demon/zombie invasion and all the Houses of Westeros have to drop whatever their doing and join forces against the "Big Bad" , it's going to feel incredibly cheap and unfitting for what has been a pretty untypical story thus far.

I mean, what will be the point for us to get invested in these stories...for us to invest in certain families and characters if all of that is going to be erased by this other-worldly force? I used to really like the concept of petty lords fighting petty wars while a much more dangerous force loomed in the background, but as we get closer to this force coming, I am getting more tired of it.

The careful planning of characters like Littlefinger and Varys, the machinations of Dany and (F)Aegon, whatever the hell Archmaester Marywn is brewing at the Citadel...what becomes the point of all this if the last book becomes a battle against zombies?

I'm more concerned with Arya getting her revenge, Dany invading Westeros, Jon and Stannis setting the North to rites, the fate of the Boltons and Freys. The internal power struggle between the Lannisters and Tyrells. I want to focus on this, not ice zombies. I just hope that the White Walkers don't come to dominate too much of the story going forward. Quite frankly, I think that whole subplot had it's moment and has lingered on too long to the point that I no longer care for it.

Yeah, as I said in another thread, having the Others essentially be this caricatured evil for which everyone forgets their differences and joins together to fight would be way too classic good vs. evil for Martin. What that would amount to is essentially Tolkienesque high fantasy with evil being represented by demonic non-humans with no redeeming qualities, and with good being manifested in every human forgetting their now seemingly "petty" differences in order to face the true evil.

It won't happen, and I laugh at those who think that all the Westeros political maneuvering and whatnot was just a prelude to some epic good vs. evil showdown. It wasn't; there is not going to be any epic good vs. evil showdown with the White Walkers raining blood and terror, and Dany swooping in with her dragons to save the day at the head of some combined Westerosi army. That's just silly.

The dragons are more likely the yin to the Others' yang; the world in which they live seems to be quite Manichaean, and I wouldn't be surprised to see the dragons wreak more havoc on the people of Westeros than the Others.

[The Faceless Wolf]

I have not been a big fan of the political maneuverings of the first five books. I find politics to be a very banal subject matter. It's kind of like professional sports in a way. Who cares what happens at the end of the season? Pay the right people to do the things you want them to do and the same result comes to light.

Also, it encourages people to be assholes to one another when that course of action can only lead to hate.

I'm really struggling to understand what you mean by this.

On topic: I predict some more of the same, high lords laughing at the prospect of the Other's coming until it's too late and then they get destroyed. I think it's more likely there will be a Dany (Or Bran IMO) saves the day as opposed to everyone uniting as one to destroy the Others.

[roxWolfox]

The whole reason I dove into this tale was for the final confrontation of the walking snowmen and fire-breathing dragons, so there are times I'm sad that we still haven't gotten to that point; but, I still have time on my hands, so I wait and wonder, like everyone else.

[The Red Pope]

I feel the opposite. I've had enough of King's Landing and the Red Keep by far. I'm almost starting to think it was a shame Aerys didn't get to burn it down.

The Others however represent the mysterious and unknown.

[Winterz]

I feel the opposite. I've had enough of King's Landing and the Red Keep by far. I'm almost starting to think it was a shame Aerys didn't get to burn it down.

The Others however represent the mysterious and unknown.

:agree:

I'm sick and tired of the likes of Cersei and Littlefinger and their games.

[Mad Monkey]

Oh God, what if Daenerys has to marry the Great Other in order to make peace between the humans and the Others? That's going to happen, isn't it?

Wait, what if R'hllor turns out to be a dragon, and Dany has to ride him to Westeros?

[Night'sQueen]

I couldn't disagree more. The entire series begins with a confrontation between the NW and the Others. Everyone thinks magic has all but died (e.g., snide references to snarks and grumpkins), but it is on the rise for some reason. This, IMO, is the central mystery of the story. I would never say it is as simple and predictable as a showdown between good vs. evil. If the series has an overarching theme I suspect it is about balance.

And if we weren't invested in Jon and Dany and Stannis, etc, etc, and all the various intrigues of their lives, why would we bother to care about the forces that drive or may forever change their world? I would liken the story to an intricately woven tapestry that is fascinating in minute detail and as a whole.

Also, if I see the word "trope" again I am going to vomit. No offense intended to any "trope" users in particular, just could someone please find a synonym to use once in a while...

[Theda Baratheon]

Nope. I am so fucking interested in the Others I swear to God I NEED TO KNOW WHO THEY ARE, WHAT THEY'RE DOING, WHY THEY'RE DOING IT, WHERE THEY'RE FROM, EVERYYYTHING

[Dire Rabbit]

I think there will be some complexity to the others not yet foreseen. If it was just a matter of a zombie demon invasion, why hasn't it happened already? They have legions of dead followers to attack the Stone Age people of the north with, yet they seem to prefer guerrilla style tactics apart from their assault on the fist of the first men. Why haven't they already overrun the lands beyond the wall entirely? I think we will see some interesting developments in the WoW.

It seems also that the very title of the series points to an inevitable dragons vs white walkers showdown, possibly with some kind of Jon Snow-Daenerys hookup, but would you put it past the author to have just laid another snare for us common folk, the readership?

[Theda Baratheon]

Exactly, the Other's have their own language, I'd be interested if they had their own culture and history too.

[The Great Walrus]

I personally think George hasn't handled the Whitewalkers very well. We've had five books with virtually no useful information other then how they can be killed, and their supposed to be the big threat that everyone in Westeros is supposed to be preparing for...

[Prince of Dragonstone]

I think there will be some complexity to the others not yet foreseen. If it was just a matter of a zombie demon invasion, why hasn't it happened already? They have legions of dead followers to attack the Stone Age people of the north with, yet they seem to prefer guerrilla style tactics apart from their assault on the fist of the first men. Why haven't they already overrun the lands beyond the wall entirely? I think we will see some interesting developments in the WoW.

It seems also that the very title of the series points to an inevitable dragons vs white walkers showdown, possibly with some kind of Jon Snow-Daenerys hookup, but would you put it past the author to have just laid another snare for us common folk, the readership?

First, welcome to the boards! Second, I agree with pretty much everything you said. I'm interested in the White Walkers in the sense of my curiosity about their purpose. But if that story arc is just going to devolve into a simplistic matter of them breaking the Wall down and hordes of the undead spilling forth into the North, I think it will be disappointing. The fact that they do seem to use guerrilla tactics rather than full frontal assaults (the only one being the Battle of the Fist of the First Men) is a clue into their overall strategy. But until WoW and ADoS I guess it's all just speculation on our parts.

[Theda Baratheon]

I personally think George hasn't handled the Whitewalkers very well. We've had five books with virtually no useful information other then how they can be killed, and their supposed to be the big threat that everyone in Westeros is supposed to be preparing for...

hmmmm, on one hand i agree, on the other they are super mysterious and wow i am so intrigued

[Mark Antony]

they are super mysterious and wow i am so intrigued

:agree:

I kinda love that we don't really know anything about them yet, The Prologue of GOT is definitely one of my favorite chapters to re-read.

[TheMysteriousOne]

I think it should be pretty clear that the Others aren't some Sauron/Melkor type of evil, although I do believe that they are the closest thing we have to evil in the series, eventually we'll learn more about them and why they act the way they do. GRRM has stated that he does not like to write of stories in which there are clearly good and evil sides.