Why Coldhands is Bran's monster

[Night'sQueen]

My pet theory is CH is a wight inhabited by the spirit of Bran's dead uncle and namesake Brandon Stark whose spirit was freed from his crypt when Bran and company removed his sword.

I love that! I really want those old Kings of Winter to be out and about, and I just don't care how LotR that may be.

:cheers:

[Howling Mad]

That's a good one.

I actually like that theory! :)

they took three sword ,right? then we have 2 other loose spirits i bet one of them is inhabiting Darkstar :lol:

I love that! I really want those old Kings of Winter to be out and about, and I just don't care how LotR that may be.

:cheers:

Thanks. I came up with this theory during my recent rereading of ADWD.

[binga]

I believe Coldhands is the Night's King named Brandon Stark. Bran could influence the past but I think it would be more subtle. Also the conversation is interesting between them. It can be interpreted in multiple ways.

[Rubacava]

"Your monster" is kinda evil. Releasing some spirits by removing the swords in the crypts is not evil. With that theory Jojen/Meera should also have monster because they also took swords.

[mindchap]

If you go back and read the entire "your monster" dialog, he is describing Bloodraven, not himself:

Meera’s gloved hand tightened around the shaft of her frog spear. “Who sent you? Who is this

three-eyed crow?”

“A friend. Dreamer, wizard, call him what you will. The last green-seer.” The longhall’s wooden

door banged open. Outside, the night wind howled, bleak and black. The trees were full of ravens,

screaming. Cold-hands did not move.

“A monster,” Bran said.

The ranger looked at Bran as if the rest of them did not exist. “Your monster, Brandon Stark.”

“Yours,” the raven echoed, from his shoulder. Outside the door, the ravens in the trees took up

the cry, until the night wood echoed to the murderer’s song of “Yours, yours, yours.”

“Jojen, did you dream this?” Meera asked her brother. “Who is he? What is he? What do we do

now?”

“We go with the ranger,” said Jojen. “We have come too far to turn back now, Meera. We would

never make it back to the Wall alive. We go with Bran’s monster, or we die.”

Personally I think CH is just a dead Brother warged by Bloodraven because Bran would be more comfortable following a brother of the NW than a dead Wildling.

[Tywin Smokin a Blunt]

Hey everyone,

It's a new crackpot theory and lets make it short.

In one possible world Bran becomes powerful after BR's trainings or any other way. He becomes a great greenseer and somehow sends Coldhands from future to find him and help younger Bran at the wall.

That's why Coldhands says that he's Bran's monster.

Did I miss something? When did Bran become Jon Connor?

[Roadside Rose]

I like your sci-fi theory. Quoting the passage.

Cold-hands said nothing. "Who are you? Why are your hands black? "

The ranger studied his hands as if he had never noticed them before.

"Once the heart has ceased to beat, a man's blood runs down into his extremities, where it thickens and congeals." His voice rattled in his throat, as thin and gaunt as he was. "His hands and feet swell up and turn as black as pudding. The rest of him becomes as white as milk."

Meera Reed rose, her frog spear in her hand, a chunk of smoking meat still impaled upon its tines. "Show us your face."

The ranger made no move to obey.

"He's dead." Bran could taste the bile in his throat. "Meera, he's some dead thing. The monsters cannot pass so long as the Wall stands and the men of the Night's Watch stay true, that's what Old Nan used to say. He came to meet us at the Wall, but he could not pass. He sent Sam instead, with that wildling girl."

Meera's gloved hand tightened around the shaft of her frog spear.

"Who sent you? Who is this three-eyed crow?"

"A friend. Dreamer, wizard, call him what you will. The last green-seer." The longhall's wooden door banged open. Outside, the night wind howled, bleak and black. The trees were full of ravens, screaming. Cold-hands did not move.

"A monster," Bran said.

The ranger looked at Bran as if the rest of them did not exist. "Your monster, Brandon Stark."

"Yours, " the raven echoed, from his shoulder. Outside the door, the ravens in the trees took up the cry, until the night wood echoed to the murderer's song of "Yours, yours, yours. "

"Jojen, did you dream this?" Meera asked her brother. "Who is he?

What is he? What do we do now?"

"We go with the ranger," said Jojen. "We have come too far to turn back now, Meera. We would never make it back to the Wall alive. We go with Bran's monster, or we die."

In the passage, Bran refers to Coldhands has a monster twice. So when Coldhands says, "You monster.." I believe he is just repeating what Bran says. But what surprises me is when Coldhands says "Your monster, Brandon Stark". Either he is just referring to Bran as Brandon Stark or maybe Coldhands real name is Brandon Stark. A certain Brandon Stark had given 'Brandon's gift' the stretch of land south of the Wall to the Nights Watch. The Maesters believe it was not Brandon the Builder but some other Brandon. I believe this could be the same Brandon, who could be Coldhands.

[Cersei of the Kingsguard]

that's what most people are basing the CH is Benjin stark theory on

look we've been over this

BRAN knows how BENJEN looks like !!!! he would say "Hi uncle Benjen" and not "You are a monster" !

[KingInTheCave]

look we've been over this

BRAN knows how BENJEN looks like !!!! he would say "Hi uncle Benjen" and not "You are a monster" !

Bran did not see his face.

[mindchap]

Bran did not see his face.

His mouth is covered nothing else Bran looks right into his eyes. I have to think he would still recognize if it was Ben.

[The Dornishman's Wife]

[...] But what surprises me is when Coldhands says "Your monster, Brandon Stark". Either he is just referring to Bran as Brandon Stark or maybe Coldhands real name is Brandon Stark. [...]

While that's a clever thought, it doesn't work when you factor in that their conversation is spoken, not just written. And spoken out loud, "Brandon Stark" as addressing Bran sounds vastly different than "Brandon Stark" as self-identification of Coldhands (totally different intonation). Read the whole sentence out loud, and there's no possibility of confusing those two meanings.

Considering that Bran didn't answer with "WTH, your name is identical to mine?!", we can be quite sure which of the two intonations Coldhands used: Namely the one that refers to Bran with "Brandon Stark".

His mouth is covered nothing else Bran looks right into his eyes. I have to think he would still recognize if it was Ben.

They've remarked often enough that his face is hidden and demanded that he show it, which he refused at spearpoint. The whole point of hiding one's face is so that people can not recognize it.

[Rubacava]

They've remarked often enough that his face is hidden and demanded that he show it, which he refused at spearpoint. The whole point of hiding one's face is so that people can not recognize it.

Or people do not freak out of seeing a dead man face.

[mindchap]

Don't get me wrong, I would love for it to be Ben, just to give his character some finality, but I think this is just one of those things we have looked at for too long and made too much of, the murder of ravens just has BR written all over it.

[The Dornishman's Wife]

Or people do not freak out of seeing a dead man face.

CH is pretty open about being dead though, e.g. not only showing his hands but also readily explaining the black blood pooling in them after death to turn them black and all that.

[Cersei of the Kingsguard]

While that's a clever thought, it doesn't work when you factor in that their conversation is spoken, not just written. And spoken out loud, "Brandon Stark" as addressing Bran sounds vastly different than "Brandon Stark" as self-identification of Coldhands (totally different intonation). Read the whole sentence out loud, and there's no possibility of confusing those two meanings.

Considering that Bran didn't answer with "WTH, your name is identical to mine?!", we can be quite sure which of the two intonations Coldhands used: Namely the one that refers to Bran with "Brandon Stark".

They've remarked often enough that his face is hidden and demanded that he show it, which he refused at spearpoint. The whole point of hiding one's face is so that people can not recognize it.

look im not gonna disagree but if u sit down next to ur uncle with covered face for couple months u will recognize him

[The Dornishman's Wife]

look im not gonna disagree but if u sit down next to ur uncle with covered face for couple months u will recognize him

Oh yes, I strongly assume that if CH is indeed BJ (which may or may not be, there are sensible arguments to be made in both directions after all), we should find out sooner or later.

OTOH, if CH is a random NPC who just hides his face for the lulz (also possible), it's quite likely that nothing more will be said about his id at all.

[KingInTheCave]

I don't think it's Benjen either, but it is possible that it's him and Bran didn't recognize him.

Maybe Benjen's fate is going to remain a mystery when the story ends, he was lost and we never heard from him again, deal with it. If a place like that (beyond the wall/always winter) existed in the real world and someone disappeared there, what is the chance that people will find him years later?

[mindchap]

I don't think it's Benjen either, but it is possible that it's him and Bran didn't recognize him.

Maybe Benjen's fate is going to remain a mystery when the story ends, he was lost and we never heard from him again, deal with it. If a place like that (beyond the wall/always winter) existed in the real world and someone disappeared there, what is the chance that people will find him years later?

Exactly, personally I would rather it be a mystery than for him to just show up as a Ben-sicle somewhere down the line.

[Cersei of the Kingsguard]

Oh yes, I strongly assume that if CH is indeed BJ (which may or may not be, there are sensible arguments to be made in both directions after all), we should find out sooner or later.

OTOH, if CH is a random NPC who just hides his face for the lulz (also possible), it's quite likely that nothing more will be said about his id at all.

its alright u have right to ur opinion but i think BR is a straight up guy and tells everything how it is (more so then Stannis - he is 150 years old he has no time for bs and flattery )

dont see why he would say "he died long ago" ( 3 years isn't long ago )

instad of saying "its Benjen Stark"

[KingInTheCave]

dont see why he would say "he died long ago" ( 3 years isn't long ago )

instad of saying "its Benjen Stark"

Did he say that? Leaf, the child of the forest said "They killed him long ago", but I don't recall BR saying the same thing. Either way, I agree it's probably not him.