New GRRM Interview

[mushroomshirt]

"yes, I always had plans, what Tyrion's arc was gonna be through this, what Arya's arc was gonna be through this, what Jon Snow's arc is gonna be. I knew what the principal deaths were gonna be, and when they were coming."

I´m wondering what´s up with the past tense on Tyrion´s and Arya´s arc (and the principal deaths) against using the future in Jon´s case...

I really hope it´s just a lapsus.

Some internet people are making a big deal out of this and saying that it is confirmation that Jon is not dead or at least that his arc will continue. (I think most here are 90% sure that his character will go on in some capacity) One article I read said "MAJOR WINDS OF WINTER SPOILER" and referenced this line.

However I think it just as likely that this was transcribed incorrectly from GRRM's response. He could easily have said "was" instead of "is" and they just wrote it down wrong.

[TheRedStag]

Nice interview.

As if we didn't know before but at least we now for sure John lives.

[mushroomshirt]

Nice interview.

As if we didn't know before but at least we now for sure John lives.

I think this could easily have just been an honest slip. I don't think it is real confirmation that Jon lives. (but I am 90% sure he will continue in some way - just not based on was vs. is in a transcribed interview)

[TheRedStag]

Meh even if it was a slip.

John lives.

He's one of the main characters. He's not getting killed off like that. We all know he'll be back.

[mushroomshirt]

He's one of the main characters. He's not getting killed off like that. We all know he'll be back.

agreed

[The Night's Prince]

Thanks for posting this.

When he's talking about Jon/Dany and Aaragorn and ruling, I'm sure he's talking about Jon as LC and Dany as Queen...

In all likelihood, yes.

[SeanF]

OP-

I am surprised Martin felt he wanted to discuss Dany as a ruler. We really don't see that. He only treats with the socio-economic state of Mereen in passing. Its also really silly to expect serious consideration of this with only a few months. Economic policy is judged in years. He also ignores the possibility of social conflict and declining support for Dany among the slaves; indeed he pretty much acts like they aren't there at all. He spends far longer on Danys inner daemons and this just becomes 1000 pages of the plot throwing things at Dany. Considering he claims to read a lot of history I found Mereen a ridiculous and unrealistic situation. All he does is say that Dany is a shit ruler for a 1000 pages. Necessary? No.

Martin speaks like none of his previous books had both character and plot advancement. Its disingenuous for him to imply that one should come at the expense of the other. He got the balance right before, why he had to write two books to describe pretty limited character development is beyond me.

Cliffhangers. Are. Terrible. What made Martin think that ending on the eve of three major battles and all our

characters fates in doubt was a good idea is beyond me. After so little plot advancement to end like that was insulting. The only reason for a cliffhanger is to build hype for the next installment and keep interest. Do Martin and his editors seriously believe interest in the series would decline without the cliffhangers due to the long wait?

Martins comment feel like he is playing down or dismissing the issues many readers had with Feast n Dance.

He also seems to have been indulgent in wanting to talk about things like Aragon being King and what he thought would be cool. If I want to know the real nitty gritty then I'll read China Marchs West or some other academic world where there is value in doing that. In fantasy its just boring and he doesn't even manage to pull that off. Drama is life with the dull bits cut out. He should have cut the dull bits out of the series but refused to do so coz he thought it was cool.

I've never understood the objection that some people have to cliff-hangers. I thought that Jon's and Dany's stories ended very well in ADWD.

My only issue with ADWD is that Dany's story could have been told in half as many chapters, leaving room for the battle of Mereen. Other than that, I thought it a fine novel

[SeanF]

A good granddaughter she is (and knowing Olenna this speaks volumes) - but a shrewd player like her Grandmother or any other player at the moment? I don't know - remember that LF deemed her almost innocuous. (not that we should trust LF, but he is keen to spot a player sooner than later). And that business regarding Moon tea... Not a stellar player.

I am guessing that GRRM reacts well to female confidence on screen.

/off topic sorry

You gotta love the way he names Victarion a dullard :lol:

At the very least, she knew of the plot to poison Joffrey, and went through with the wedding and banquet, while giving nothing away, and then gave a sterling performance as a grieving widow.

[shearstone]

I've never understood the objection that some people have to cliff-hangers. I thought that Jon's and Dany's stories ended very well in ADWD.

My only issue with ADWD is that Dany's story could have been told in half as many chapters, leaving room for the battle of Mereen. Other than that, I thought it a fine novel

People's objections might stem from unlike a TV show where the cliff hanger is usually resolved in a few months, the books take years to come out that's an annoyingly long time to wait and even worse if god forbid the series is never finished.

[Free Northman]

In all likelihood, yes.

Being in command of 900 outcasts - only about a third of which are warriors - and living in a derelict Castle on the edge of nowhere is not really what I'd call being a "ruler".

The guy Roose Bolton left behind to guard the Trident ford with 600 archers had twice as many warriors as the entire Night's Watch.

The captain of a large Royal warship probably has almost as many warriors under his command as the entire Night's Watch.

Heck, there are landed knights that have more men than the entire Night's Watch.

Jon learning to "rule" a prison colony with 300 stewards, 300 builders and 300 warriors is not worth spending 5 years of "training montage" on.

Sorry, but this period of "training" was intended to be but a stepping stone to ruling far more than just the Alcatraz of Westeros.

[SeanF]

People's objections might stem from unlike a TV show where the cliff hanger is usually resolved in a few months, the books take years to come out that's an annoyingly long time to wait and even worse if god forbid the series is never finished.

One just has to be patient. Pleasure deferred is pleasure enhanced.

[MachoGrande]

Also keep in mind that GRRM originally wanted to include either the Battle of Meeren or the one in Winterfell in ADWD (can't remember if he said which).But he was dissuaded by his editor because the book would be too big to publish, if I remember correctly. So I think it's unfair to accuse Martin of some cheap move he made only for raising the sales in the next installment; as if he forgot that his previous books had done well without it.

[Neumond]

Some internet people are making a big deal out of this and saying that it is confirmation that Jon is not dead or at least that his arc will continue. (I think most here are 90% sure that his character will go on in some capacity) One article I read said "MAJOR WINDS OF WINTER SPOILER" and referenced this line.

However I think it just as likely that this was transcribed incorrectly from GRRM's response. He could easily have said "was" instead of "is" and they just wrote it down wrong.

Major Spoiler? That´s hilarious :).

As I said I hope (and believe) it´s nothing important at all. But thank you for the reply.

Poor George... He has my fullest appreciation for still giving interviews :).

[LordofLight1]

Pardon me for my lack of quote but my phone wouldn allow me to copy an paste for some reason. I jus found it interesting that he says he knew what tyrions and aryas arc WAS goin to be but also says he knows what Jon snows arc IS goin to be. Surely meaning that Jon did not die?? Thoughts??

[total1402]

I agree with some of your criticisms (though not all), but why do you feel the need to question his claims of having read about history? Do you actually doubt it is true?

History books like China Marches West that consider the economic and social policies of rulers measure these changes in years if not decades before they could bear fruit. Only in the long run can you really judge a rulers success or failure on these points. So its simply ahistorical for Martin to show Dany in the immediate aftermath of the siege and act like she could resolve all these problems in the space of a few months. I can't judge Dany as a ruler with only a few months given to her ruling and most of her material is about her personal daemons or the coming slaver invasion. Its a very shallow depiction of what should be a very complex problem. But Martin breaks it down into "city poor, Dany faces resistance". He doesn't consider that in the immediate aftermath the plunder from the city (which is conveniently forgotten about from ASOS) should outweigh the lack of taxation and he doesn't consider the repercussions of a few nobles antagonizing the majority population with its attacks. Never mind that more people should be dying from disease and hunger everyday in a city that size. But, no, its a serious threat and we're supposed to judge Danys economic policy after a few weeks...

[total1402]

I've never understood the objection that some people have to cliff-hangers. I thought that Jon's and Dany's stories ended very well in ADWD.

My only issue with ADWD is that Dany's story could have been told in half as many chapters, leaving room for the battle of Mereen. Other than that, I thought it a fine novel

You do realize that's a contradiction right?

@MachoGrande

I think Martin knows the limits of what is publishable well in advance and given the slow writing process could have easily cut irrelevant material out if he had wanted or aimed to write a certain number of chapters. He chose not to. Thats still on him.

[Nacht en Ontij]

I think Martin knows the limits of what is publishable well in advance and given the slow writing process could have easily cut irrelevant material out if he had wanted or aimed to write a certain number of chapters. He chose not to. Thats still on him.

with

AFFC and ADWD were not finished. A book without an ending isn't a book.

Oh. I'm pretty sure they were finished when I was done reading, holding them in my hands instead of still residing unpublished on mr. Martin's harddrive and all that. What your posts in this topic mean to say is that it is your personal opinion that the last two books weren't to your liking. Which is fair enough but to try and employ real-life socio-economic and political theory regarding a fantasy series to prove that the bits that weren't to your liking are actually bad things is perhaps something best left to the overwhelming fandumb out there.

Another post reeking of 'finish the books George!' *Sighs*