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Maybe Rhaegar was obsessed with Lyanna?


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240 replies to this topic

#1 Nami

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 12:44 PM

Knowing how the madness runs in the Targaryen family, maybe Rhaegar became obsessed with Lyanna Stark?
Maybe she went willingly (or maybe not) and then wanted to leave, because she found out about her family situation, Rhaegar didn't let her. And in a messed up way of dealing with everything, tried to please her, showering her with blue winter roses.
Anyone think it's unlikely for GRRM to go with the tragic love cliche?

#2 SaltpansResident

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 12:55 PM

I like it, but I'm afraid I'm thinking of it as more of a Handmaid's Tale sitch. Blue roses are symbolic of Winterfell, and the petals are blackened because they're so old.

#3 Groat

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 12:58 PM

The blue roses were used to create the crown that Rhaegar gave Lyanna at Harenhall when he crowned her queen of love and beauty.

Edited by Groat, 31 July 2013 - 01:00 PM.


#4 Jon's Queen Consort

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 12:59 PM

I like it and this is how I believe that it happened

I like it, but I'm afraid I'm thinking of it as more of a Handmaid's Tale sitch. Blue roses are symbolic of Winterfell, and the petals are blackened because they're so old.

I think that br are symbolic of Lyanna not WF

#5 Light a wight tonight

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:05 PM

A 15 year old girl changing her mind? That's just crazy talk. /rolleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

Rhaegarstiltskin keeping her locked up in the Tower of Joy? Actually not a bad theory. So were the King's Guardsmen there to protect Rhaegar's son or to prevent Lyanna from escaping?

#6 lareine

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:08 PM

Knowing how the madness runs in the Targaryen family, maybe Rhaegar became obsessed with Lyanna Stark?
Maybe she went willingly (or maybe not) and then wanted to leave, because she found out about her family situation, Rhaegar didn't let her. And in a messed up way of dealing with everything, tried to please her, showering her with blue winter roses.
Anyone think it's unlikely for GRRM to go with the tragic love cliche?


I've always strongly suspected this. Thank you for being brave enough to say it.

#7 Nami

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:21 PM

A 15 year old girl changing her mind? That's just crazy talk. /rolleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

Rhaegarstiltskin keeping her locked up in the Tower of Joy? Actually not a bad theory. So were the King's Guardsmen there to protect Rhaegar's son or to prevent Lyanna from escaping?


First time I read the book, and actually in AGoT, you understand that they were preventing her from escaping.
Reading theories in the internet it's what got me thinking that maybe they really had a love affair and the KG were there because of Jon

Edited by Nami, 31 July 2013 - 01:25 PM.


#8 Light a wight tonight

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:27 PM

First time I read the book, and actually in AGoT, you get the feeling that they were preventing her from escaping.
Reading theories in the internet it's what got me thinking that maybe they really had a love affair and the KG were there because of Jon

Must have been Jon because Lyanna wasn't in any condition to leave.

Really, early on we mostly get Robert's opinion of the situation. Ned recalls a few facts but doesn't reveal his feelings.

#9 Magjee

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:30 PM

Lyanna was the Knight of the Laughing Tree

Rhaegar was impressed and crowned her Queen of Love and Beauty

???

Jon Snow

#10 Nami

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:34 PM

I have hard time imagining Lyanna simply standing by while knowing what happened to her family, pregnant or not. And she knew about it, because she told she wanted to buried next to them, according to Ned.
Everything fits if:
1- Rhaegar kept her from leaving. She was determined to leave and Rhaegar, obsessed, prohibited.
2- She realized she would probably be killed (at least) as well because she was pregnant with a Targ baby while the North was fighting on the enemy side (looking from a Targ perspective). She couldn't simply show up heavily pregnant in Winterfell. Either she came with conclusion herself or Rhaegar made her see. Thus leading her to stay locked up in the tower until eveything was resolved.

Edited by Nami, 31 July 2013 - 01:37 PM.


#11 Pikachu101

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 01:55 PM

I think he was more obsessed with Aegon's prophecy than anything else /smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />

Lyanna was probably just a means to get Visenya and because she's a Stark, her family can aid Aegon in the fight against the Others.

So much better than a lame love story /biggrin.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':D' />

#12 lareine

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:04 PM

A 15 year old girl changing her mind? That's just crazy talk. /rolleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

Rhaegarstiltskin keeping her locked up in the Tower of Joy? Actually not a bad theory. So were the King's Guardsmen there to protect Rhaegar's son or to prevent Lyanna from escaping?


Rhaegarstiltskin! Well, she would have had to promise him her first born child for him to let her out of the tower /thumbsup.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':thumbsup:' />

#13 Jon's Queen Consort

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:05 PM

A 15 year old girl changing her mind? That's just crazy talk. /rolleyes.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':rolleyes:' />

Rhaegarstiltskin keeping her locked up in the Tower of Joy? Actually not a bad theory. So were the King's Guardsmen there to protect Rhaegar's son or to prevent Lyanna from escaping?

both maybe?

#14 Mad Monkey

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:05 PM

Lyanna was the Sansa of people who aren't Sansa. The obsession theory is very plausible.

#15 Pikachu101

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:31 PM

Rhaegarstiltskin keeping her locked up in the Tower of Joy? Actually not a bad theory. So were the King's Guardsmen there to protect Rhaegar's son or to prevent Lyanna from escaping?


This is actually an interesting theory /smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />

Say at the beginning Lyanna did willingly run off with Rhaegar, but then found out about Brandon and Rickard's deaths obviously she'd try and contact her family.

If Rhaegar saw it as a threat and he'd lose his Visenya maybe he trapped her in the ToJ. She's pregnant so it's not like she could do a runner

Edited by Pikachu101, 31 July 2013 - 02:31 PM.


#16 Ned's Epic Beard

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:41 PM

Ned did say to robert that "You avenged Lyanna in trident". Why would he say something like that if she wasn't being held against her will.

#17 Corvo Attano

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:46 PM

Lyanna was the Sansa of people who aren't Sansa. The obsession theory is very plausible.

Wut? /lol.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':lol:' />

I like this theory, because it does seem pretty unlikely that Lyanna ran away with Rhaegar willingly and apparently made no attempt to contact her family or even let anybody know what was going on. Also, running away from his wife and kids out of the blue seems like a very un Rhaegar-like thing to do, but could happen if he had a major obsession with another woman.

#18 Pikachu101

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 02:54 PM

I like this theory, because it does seem pretty unlikely that Lyanna ran away with Rhaegar willingly and apparently made no attempt to contact her family or even let anybody know what was going on.

Maybe she convinced herself what she was doing wasn't wrong or maybe they assured her contact had already been made.

And by the time she realised her mistake it was too late. She was pregnant and Rhaegar was hell bent on fulfilling Aegon's prophecy

Also, running away from his wife and kids out of the blue seems like a very un Rhaegar-like thing to do, but could happen if he had a major obsession with another woman.


Personally I think it's very Rhaegar-like to abandon his wife and kids in the hopes of fulfilling his kids' prophecy.

It's not about being obsessed with a woman, it's about being obsessed with a prophecy to point where you'd be willing to let a civil war start just so you can get your third head /dunno.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':dunno:' />

Edited by Pikachu101, 31 July 2013 - 02:54 PM.


#19 lareine

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 03:54 PM

This is actually an interesting theory /smile.png' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':)' />

Say at the beginning Lyanna did willingly run off with Rhaegar, but then found out about Brandon and Rickard's deaths obviously she'd try and contact her family.

If Rhaegar saw it as a threat and he'd lose his Visenya maybe he trapped her in the ToJ. She's pregnant so it's not like she could do a runner


I remember thinking this when I first read the books; that Lyanna went willingly, but that finding out about her brother and father's death would break whatever romantic spell they were wrapped up in, especially on her end.

I could also see her having second thoughts before she got the news about Brandon and Rickards deaths too. Don't get me wrong, I'm sure the first month was seriously EPIC; being whisked off on horseback from her unwanted, impending marriage to a magical tower by a devastatingly handsome silver haired prince professing his love and assuring her that everything will be peachy (seriously, I'd run away with him too and I'm old enough to know better!)

After about three or four weeks of non-stop, 24 hour a day "sexy time" in the tower however, reality begins to sink in. This guy is married, he has kids, he's moody. She's homesick and realizes her family's probably worried sick about her. It also wouldn't surprise me if he just happened to "forget" to fill her in on his whole prophecy/baby agenda until after he got her out to the TOJ and it would be too late to for her to change her mind or leave.

I could see her waking up one morning and thinking, "OMGS, what have I gotten myself into? I'm stuck in some decrepit old tower in a blazing hot desert in the middle of nowhere with this nutty married man and his bodyguards with nothing to do all day but listen to him play the harp and talk about how I'm going to help him fulfill his destiny. What have I done?"

Edited by lareine, 31 July 2013 - 04:08 PM.


#20 King of Winters

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Posted 31 July 2013 - 03:57 PM

If Rhaegar had mistreated Lyanna, don't you think Ned would have remembered him badly?