Littlefinger - the next Kingmaker?

[bpsae325]

"The gods alone know what game Littlefinger is playing" I don't remember if that was from the books or the tv show or both, but it is a great line. I think he will be the kingmaker, it would serve his needs the best. The Lannisters are going down fast, Stannis would take his head for assisting the Lannisters, so his only option is to help Aegon, (or Dany, if she ever decides to come to Westeros) or hide in the Vale forever.

[RhaenysBee]

no!

everyone here seems to think sansa is going to out maneuver littlefinger...while everything is possible....have you guys forgotten what happens in this series in regards to the "good guys" beating all odds to bring down the oppressive villains!? i really hope sansa doesnt out maneuver LF, and while i believe she could become the next great player in her own right...she wont outdo LF anytime soon, or anytime period

of course she won't. that's why someone needs to kill LF. And sooner, rather than later.

[David Selig]

I thought he had already been a Kingmaker for a while.

[ImpinAintEasy]

she wont outdo LF anytime soon, or anytime period

not so sure of this, many times the student surpases the teacher, plus by knowing a good deal about his schemes she's got him by the littlefinger

[space]

the series would not be the same without littlefinger! in a weird way il honestly be more disappointed if he is killed off in the next book moreso than any other character besides maybe tyrion or arya...but i really hope the series ends with him at large in one manner or another...hes done some horrible things, but for every horrible thing he has done, he has done so in a brilliant manner; and keep in mind...he did orchestrate jofferys death!

[bpsae325]

^ good point

[Jojen Dayne-Reed]

i personally hope and believe the next Kingmaker will be Jaime, when he crowns Jon. We already know he feels extremely guilty that he couldn't protect Elia, Aegon, and Rhaenys, so if he finds out Rhaegar has a legit son left then he'll try to "atone" for it.

I actually agree and hope this happens. But Jamie can only bring 1 great house to his side. Sansa can get the rest to agree on Jon. (Just like Sam did with the lc position (foreshadowed!))

I hope Jamie gets his big redemption moment. But I don't think he can bring any kind of peace by himself. Sansa can bring most everyone to the table.

[littleRickon]

no!

everyone here seems to think sansa is going to out maneuver littlefinger...while everything is possible....have you guys forgotten what happens in this series in regards to the "good guys" beating all odds to bring down the oppressive villains!? i really hope sansa doesnt out maneuver LF, and while i believe she could become the next great player in her own right...she wont outdo LF anytime soon, or anytime period

I agree that it does seem to be against what we have been served so far. But Sansa still has her "magic" hairnet from the PW, the one with the strangler crystals, and I would also be very surprised if she ended up never using that at all. It was her one big self-motivated move in that whole affair, the one time where she as a piece "refused to make the moves" that the player LF meant for her, and he still seems to be totally unaware of this fact. It seems very much set up that this point that Sansa still having the hairnet will come back to haunt LF sometime soon.

[Petyr Patter]

I'd Say Sansa doesn't need to outmaneuver Littlefinger to beat him, she just needs to kill him. Or at least frame him.

I mean, that is what Joffrey taught her on the steps of Baelor's Sept, that it only takes one impulsive action to throw the careful thought plans awry.

[Blackfish Tully]

I'd Say Sansa doesn't need to outmaneuver Littlefinger to beat him, she just needs to kill him. Or at least frame him.

I mean, that is what Joffrey taught her on the steps of Baelor's Sept, that it only takes one impulsive action to throw the careful thought plans awry.

The big question about Sansa killing Littlefinger is why at this point would she consider killing him? Littlefinger saved her from Kings Landing and almost certain execution. She's the most hunted person in Westeroes besides Tyrion and he has protected her so far so she would have to have a pretty good reason to kill him and throw away that protection. The North is in chaos, the Riverlands have surrendered to the Lannisters and she was betrayed by the Tyrells so she has nowhere else to go. Don't forget that the Vale Lords stood by and did nothing while Ned Stark was executed and Robb and her mother were murdered by the Freys so I doubt that she will trust that the Vale Lords will stand up to the Lannisters and Tyrells now if she reveals herself to them. Sansa has serious trust issues,reinforced by Littlefinger at every opportunity (why else would he tell her about Lyn Cordray working for him), so as horrible as Littlefinger is she is not going to try to kill him unless she has a really good reason.

[juanml82]

But does Sansa really want to play the game?

Well, hers would be a boring story arc if she doesn't. She didn't like being called a piece, that's for sure.

The big question about Sansa killing Littlefinger is why at this point would she consider killing him? Littlefinger saved her from Kings Landing and almost certain execution. She's the most hunted person in Westeroes besides Tyrion and he has protected her so far so she would have to have a pretty good reason to kill him and throw away that protection. The North is in chaos, the Riverlands have surrendered to the Lannisters and she was betrayed by the Tyrells so she has nowhere else to go. Don't forget that the Vale Lords stood by and did nothing while Ned Stark was executed and Robb and her mother were murdered by the Freys so I doubt that she will trust that the Vale Lords will stand up to the Lannisters and Tyrells now if she reveals herself to them. Sansa has serious trust issues,reinforced by Littlefinger at every opportunity (why else would he tell her about Lyn Cordray working for him), so as horrible as Littlefinger is she is not going to try to kill him unless she has a really good reason.

I agree. I don't see Sansa turning on LF until the second half of TWOW or ADOS, if at all.

Sansa can't deliver the Vale to Aegon if she doesn't marry HtH, and she can't marry Aegon if she's married to HtH. It's also unkown if she can rally the North. Even disregarding Rickon, the Freys still have hostages and Bolton rules the North so far.

Even more, I don't think Littlefinger will go against Daennerys' dragons.

[The Meeraculous Third Reed]

Sansa will kill Littlefinger.

Let's hope not. It would cheapen everything about the Great One if he were brought down in such a hack manner.

[Petyr Patter]

The big question about Sansa killing Littlefinger is why at this point would she consider killing him? Littlefinger saved her from Kings Landing and almost certain execution. She's the most hunted person in Westeroes besides Tyrion and he has protected her so far so she would have to have a pretty good reason to kill him and throw away that protection. The North is in chaos, the Riverlands have surrendered to the Lannisters and she was betrayed by the Tyrells so she has nowhere else to go. Don't forget that the Vale Lords stood by and did nothing while Ned Stark was executed and Robb and her mother were murdered by the Freys so I doubt that she will trust that the Vale Lords will stand up to the Lannisters and Tyrells now if she reveals herself to them. Sansa has serious trust issues,reinforced by Littlefinger at every opportunity (why else would he tell her about Lyn Cordray working for him), so as horrible as Littlefinger is she is not going to try to kill him unless she has a really good reason.

Sansa has several reasons to off Littlefinger, plus those circumstances you listed can change very quickly.

• For starters, the reason she's one of the most wanted 'criminals' in Westeros is because Littlefinger framed her. She wore the murder weapon to the feast, and he arranged her escape on the same night cementing her guilt in the opinions of many. If he just wanted her free, he could have arranged her escape weeks before the wedding/death of Joffrey and remover her from suspicion. He did not.
  
• He murdered her Florian right in front of her. Why? Because he couldn't be trusted to keep his mouth shut... or at least that is what Littlefinger claims. The fact remains, he played his part, he was promised money, but Littlefinger reneged because he was no longer useful. This is going to become a problematic trend.
  
• He killed Lysa Arryn in front of her, and quickly framed Marillion for the crime, and punished Marillion for the death by lifetime imprisonment in the sky cells... with 'lifetime' being not very long because its a sky cell. While on one hand this is villains getting what they deserve, on the other, its Littlefinger killing his wife without a second thought.
  
• Before Lysa Arryn died, she confessed to killing Jon Arryn for Littlefinger, and telling Catelyn the Lannisters are to blame. Are we starting to see a pattern emerge?
  
• Littlefinger is arranging a marriage for her, planning on using her claim to mobilize the Knights of the Vale. Sansa has grown to loathe marriage and being used for her claim.
  
• Little Rober Arryn is almost being straight out poisoned by Littlefinger, and Sansa is slowly becoming aware of this.
  
• Unwanted touching. No further comment necessary.
  
• Finally, Sansa cannot beat Littlefinger in the "game." He shields and clothes her for the time being, but she has to realize if his plans for her need her in jail, dead, or worse, that will be her fate. Unless she is proactive. Hence, my she doesn't need to beat him, she just needs to kill him. Then worry about the pieces.
  

I think Sansa is realizing, and there is evidence of this in her chapters, that Littlefinger is feeding her lies, because he feeds everyone lies. He also leaves a trail of bodies in his plans. Now, if there should be news of a restored Winterfell with a Rickon Stark seated there... she might decided to follow a different course.

[Light a wight tonight]

The big question about Sansa killing Littlefinger is why at this point would she consider killing him? Littlefinger saved her from Kings Landing and almost certain execution. She's the most hunted person in Westeroes besides Tyrion and he has protected her so far so she would have to have a pretty good reason to kill him and throw away that protection. The North is in chaos, the Riverlands have surrendered to the Lannisters and she was betrayed by the Tyrells so she has nowhere else to go. Don't forget that the Vale Lords stood by and did nothing while Ned Stark was executed and Robb and her mother were murdered by the Freys so I doubt that she will trust that the Vale Lords will stand up to the Lannisters and Tyrells now if she reveals herself to them. Sansa has serious trust issues,reinforced by Littlefinger at every opportunity (why else would he tell her about Lyn Cordray working for him), so as horrible as Littlefinger is she is not going to try to kill him unless she has a really good reason.

If she finds out that LF was instrumental in Ned's death and in starting the War of the Five Kings she just might decide that he does need killing.

[Illyrio Mo'Parties]

But Sansa still has her "magic" hairnet from the PW, the one with the strangler crystals, and I would also be very surprised if she ended up never using that at all. It was her one big self-motivated move in that whole affair, the one time where she as a piece "refused to make the moves" that the player LF meant for her, and he still seems to be totally unaware of this fact.

Eh?

She didn't like being called a piece, that's for sure.

Eh?

Let's hope not. It would cheapen everything about the Great One if he were brought down in such a hack manner.

I don't know, it could be deliciously ironic. Recall if you will the manner of Omar's fall on The Wire...