GRRM: "Walter White vs. Westeros most evil"

[A Northman]

I don't believe Walter is evil, just a man who stops at nothing to protect his family and gets carried away with it. Reminds me a lot of Tywin Lannister, almost built his empire from the ground through intelligence and fear. I think to some extent Walter is Misunderstood but not as selfish as Tywin. I am team Jessie however haha!

He also reminds me a lot of Michael Corleone. Both of them tried to protect the family but lost them along the way.

[AemonEightstrings]

Walter White >>>>>>>>>>>>> Littlefinger

Walt is a much more complex and well written character than any of GRRM's bad guys. He is a true anti-hero and multifaceted bad guy and he does not need to be tortured and lose body parts and go through a 'redemption arc' to make him an interesting and likeable character. The awesome writing does that. One minute I am cheering for him, the other I want him to die slowly. Great character.

I think BB and Asoiaf both have great moral complexity with their characters. I agree that Walter White is probably more of a complete character than LF or other Asoiaf bad guys and maybe that extra dimension is what GRRM was getting at. The fact he's a more believable monster just in itself, might make him scarier.

[Alhazred]

GRRM is plugging HBO.

[Alhazred]

"Who is more evil" competitions do not interest me. What is more interesting is that GRRM does acknowledge that Walter White is evil or a "monster". In short, GRRM (unlike many posters here) does not equate certain level of "humanity" with "not evil".

[Florina Laufeyson]

GRRM is plugging HBO.

Dude, even i know that Breaking Bad is on AMC.

[High Septon Ramsay]

Walt can justify anything he does to himself, no matter how heinous. This makes him, not a "bigger" monster per se, but perhaps a more dangerous one, in a way. Ramsay, Joff, Gregor, they know what they do is wrong, but they don't care. This makes them kind of predictable in a sense. Walt's more like Cersei. Someone who can make excuses for the things he does, even though he knows it's wrong deep down. Those people are scary.

[The Ned's Little Girl]

Walt is like Cersei if Cersei was really really smart.

THAT is scary.

[PhoenixFlame]

Hai, im Florina and have never seen a single episode of Breaking Bad. I also give fuck all in the way of spoilers for that show. So...like wtf is GRRM talking about? Was he being sassy? Or is this Walter White chucklehead really that much of a dick? To out-asshole Ramsay is a pretty big step here....

It's sass that's not entirely without merit. Walt's a different kind of evil than Rammers.

He's an emasculated but ridiculously over-qualified chemistry teacher who can barely support his family. He's diagnosed with terminal cancer and freaks out about his family's future. Through a series of events he is reacquainted with a former student and they start cooking the best meth on the market, but get caught up in all the local (and not so local) crime rings. Walt starts out as someone you root for, before it becomes clear there's a ton of rage, bitter pride, and a huge persecution complex that's been buried all along. That gets unleashed and Walt goes from awesome badass nerd to scary-as-fuck monster with glimmers of humanity. It's not the money that keeps him going, it's smashing his opposition and feeling validated. He maintains the excuse "it's for my family" but that becomes increasingly flimsy--also not entirely untrue, but not wholly true either. The writing's excellent--I personally have not rooted for him in a long time, but it's still amazing the stuff he pulls off.

Walt is like Cersei if Cersei was really really smart.

THAT is scary.

Was JUST going to say that. If Cersei was a genius meth cook, she'd be Walter White.

[AemonEightstrings]

"Who is more evil" competitions do not interest me. What is more interesting is that GRRM does acknowledge that Walter White is evil or a "monster". In short, GRRM (unlike many posters here) does not equate certain level of "humanity" with "not evil".

Touch, touchy, Alhazred. You're obviously much more intelligent than everyone in this discussion :bowdown:

Mama always told me, evil is as evil does :devil:

[Dicer]

The fact he's a more believable monster just in itself, might make him scarier.

He's a more believable monster because he's a more relatable one. He is the central character and so we see things from his POV. Every decision, every moral dilemma, every conflict makes sense.

We don't have anyone like that in ASOIAF. I think LF is overrated as a bad guy. He wants to bring chaos? Seems like he is just insane and most of his plans work because of luck. Once we got Cersei's POV, she was reduced to a one dimensional, cackling evil person. Jaime and Theon's POVs were full of self pity and wanting to turn over a new leaf which I find to be rather dull. Ramsay and Gregor are basically the sadistic killers. Tywin was interesting, but we never got his POV and he got killed off too soon.

We don't have the Walter White equivalent of a bad guy in Westeros. It will be interesting to see if one of the 'Good guys' starts doing questionable things for selfish reasons and then start to like the power and then greed comes into the picture. For example we see Jon abusing his power as LC in his last chapter for personal reasons (Arya). What if he starts sliding further down that slippery slope. Or Arya herself starts to actually like the power of a FM. Or Dany being a ruthless dragon raining down blood and fire. Tyrion is a good candidate for a future Walter White. He is halfway there.

[Mark Antony]

Walter and Tyrion are pretty much even

[Lord of Beyond the Wall]

I like villains and WW is a great villain and a very likeable at that. WW is like Tywin Lannister or Cersei whom would do anything for their family and power. WW is not worst than Ramsay who like skinning women, or The Mountain shatterskull, or Stannis the burning men.

[thecryptile]

Walter and Tyrion are pretty much even

Yup- Tyrion is the WW equivalent... Arya isn't smart enough, and all of the other baddies are people you'd never root for in a million years. Tyrion is a sympathetic character initially, and like WW he's known for his intelligence.

[Net-Viper X]

Sounds like he is basically saying the guy is a bigger asshole than even Ramsey, so he is going to have to make some characters that make both Ramsey and Walter look like saints. I can't wait to meet them!

[AemonEightstrings]

He's a more believable monster because he's a more relatable one. He is the central character and so we see things from his POV. Every decision, every moral dilemma, every conflict makes sense.

We don't have anyone like that in ASOIAF. I think LF is overrated as a bad guy. He wants to bring chaos? Seems like he is just insane and most of his plans work because of luck. Once we got Cersei's POV, she was reduced to a one dimensional, cackling evil person. Jaime and Theon's POVs were full of self pity and wanting to turn over a new leaf which I find to be rather dull. Ramsay and Gregor are basically the sadistic killers. Tywin was interesting, but we never got his POV and he got killed off too soon.

We don't have the Walter White equivalent of a bad guy in Westeros. It will be interesting to see if one of the 'Good guys' starts doing questionable things for selfish reasons and then start to like the power and then greed comes into the picture. For example we see Jon abusing his power as LC in his last chapter for personal reasons (Arya). What if he starts sliding further down that slippery slope. Or Arya herself starts to actually like the power of a FM. Or Dany being a ruthless dragon raining down blood and fire. Tyrion is a good candidate for a future Walter White. He is halfway there.

Great comparison and commentary. Since Asoiaf isn't centered on the arc or POV of one specific character it makes it near impossible to develop that kind of intimate moral complexity that BB has created around Walter White's character, but you make a good argument on how Tyrion, Arya, or Dany could all make a transformation for the worse and take on the darker or more self serving qualities of WW by the end of the series.

[Joseph Nobles]

There is also the impact and range of evil a character can affect. Think about how much evil has spread through the Breaking Bad universe because of Walter White. The airplane collision over Albuquerque isn't the tenth of it. The violence his product has caused in the underworld, the lives his product will naturally have destroyed, the empowerment all his money will give to the white supremacist movement...

I can't think of a single character that will have the same sort of impact in the world of Westeros as Walter has had in his. Now all you real fans will come out and start listing them off. :D But the only openly evil character I know of who had this kind of impact is the Mad King. And he's already dead in ASoIaF.

[Balerion06]

I`m not sure the context in the quote, nor have I seen the latest episode of Breaking Bad yet but I think GRRM might mean that Walter White is a special kind of monster. This man has put his life and the life of his family on the line and doesn`t seem to have a single of amount of remorse about it. He`s willing to sacrifice everything - including the friendships and lives of his closest family member - to meet his own ends.

What? :shocked:

[Florina Laufeyson]

It's sass that's not entirely without merit. Walt's a different kind of evil than Rammers.

He's an emasculated but ridiculously over-qualified chemistry teacher who can barely support his family. He's diagnosed with terminal cancer and freaks out about his family's future. Through a series of events he is reacquainted with a former student and they start cooking the best meth on the market, but get caught up in all the local (and not so local) crime rings. Walt starts out as someone you root for, before it becomes clear there's a ton of rage, bitter pride, and a huge persecution complex that's been buried all along. That gets unleashed and Walt goes from awesome badass nerd to scary-as-fuck monster with glimmers of humanity. It's not the money that keeps him going, it's smashing his opposition and feeling validated. He maintains the excuse "it's for my family" but that becomes increasingly flimsy--also not entirely untrue, but not wholly true either. The writing's excellent--I personally have not rooted for him in a long time, but it's still amazing the stuff he pulls off.

Was JUST going to say that. If Cersei was a genius meth cook, she'd be Walter White.

Wiggy. Id say from the sounds of things that this Walter guy is more like...

Walter and Tyrion are pretty much even

Yeah...that. Sounds like Real World Tyrion.

Sympathetic guy? Check.

Most of the story told from his side? Check.

Some serious family issues? Check.

Kind of a dick? Checkmate.

[Mark Antony]

Yeah...that. Sounds like Real World Tyrion.

Sympathetic guy? Check.

Most of the story told from his side? Check.

Some serious family issues? Check.

Kind of a dick? Checkmate.

They're both murderers as well. lol.

[Wise Fool]

He did say "bigger monster," not necessarily "more evil."

Crackpot theory time! Secretly Westeros itself is smaller in scale than the real world. One inch in Breaking Bad is one foot in ASOIAF, so Walt is quite literally a bigger monster, because he's just plain bigger, as is everyone else in Breaking Bad, to everyone in ASOIAF.