[SPOILERS] Breaking Bad - Final Season - Final Two Episodes

[Bronn Stone]

To those people who are giving Hank some sort of pass because he owned up to his assault under the cover of authority against Pinkman, one hopes you are giving Walt the same credit. This IS the man who called off the hit on Jesse when Walt and Gomie showed up. Surrendered and allowed himself to be cuffed because the alternative was killing a non-player and most of all forfeited his enormous fortune in a futile attempt to save Hank.

Sure, it didnt work, but that was ONLY because of the convoluted writing that had the professional hit man go ahead with a hit that they'd been called off of - an act of dreadful writing (pet peeve #1 when writers do not bother properly motivating characters who take actions wholly contrary to their own interests).

The wholly evil Walt that folks here seem to see would have told the Nazis - 'pop a cap in the bald DEA muthafu**a and hit the pussy under the car while you at it' And kept ALL of his barrels, less a piddly hitman fee.

[Bridgeburners]

Lydia is a psychopath like Todd. I guess he sees that in her.

[ninjastark]

i get Lydia's position though...she got ppl in very high places who depend on her ...so if she feels the pressure then those below her have to feel it too.Gus was the same way except he didn't mind getting his hands dirty.

[Bronn Stone]

Lydia is an idiot. NOBODY wears Louboutin shoes to a hit in the desert - which she did.

The actress is VERY attractive. The character, not so much. Though I'd say the same of Betsy Brandt/Marie

(Note to most guys - Louboutins are VERY expensive designer shoes easily identified by the red soles).

[Jabronius Maximus]

Well Lydia never stepped outside the office when she was in Gus' (and later Walt's) operation. The only 'move' she's really made so far (on her own) is killing off Declan's crew. And we saw what a nervous wreck she looked like when walking out of that meth lab. Like Walt, she is also a time bomb (and a bombSHELL but never mind that) that will explode pretty soon. And she will screw things up when she sends some hitmen to a guarded White family (something that will probably expedite their enrollment into a witness protection program). My guess is some of the hitmen may get arrested, setting up a situation similar to what we had with Mike's guys. Only Mike isn't around to deal with that kind of situation.

I'm assuming the Whites will be 'guarded' because the cops will still be after Walt, and looking about for evidence (not to mention the Hank situation). And plus, as I've mentioned before, Walt has lost his family. Wouldn't the show be going a little too far if they killed them off anyway? Imo that would lessen the impact of what happened in Ozymandias.

[ninjastark]

no Todd and Lydia please....had enough dexter/hannah.

[TrackerNeil]

Hank owned up to his crime and took punishment for beating Jesse even when his CO suggested that they could build a bullshit defense and try to fight the charges.

Exactly. Yes, Hank went off the deep end, but only after Jesse played a really, really awful trick upon him. That doesn't make him a bad guy; it makes him human. And, to his credit, Hank admitted what he did and took his punishment. Maybe some here think that good men never do wrong, but I think good men (and women) take responsibility for the wrongs they do.

[Lord Flashheart]

Exactly. Yes, Hank went off the deep end, but only after Jesse played a really, really awful trick upon him. That doesn't make him a bad guy; it makes him human. And, to his credit, Hank admitted what he did and took his punishment. Maybe some here think that good men never do wrong, but I think good men (and women) take responsibility for the wrongs they do.

Hank admitted what he did? I might have to watch again but I only remember Hank telling the story up until the point he left the junkyard to go to the hospital. Then he pleaded the fifth.

[aeu]

Sure, it didnt work, but that was ONLY because of the convoluted writing that had the professional hit man go ahead with a hit that they'd been called off of - an act of dreadful writing (pet peeve #1 when writers do not bother properly motivating characters who take actions wholly contrary to their own interests).

The Nazis went there because the head nazi realized that Walt had something valuable buried in that location. At least the possibility of that. It worked quite well for me as an explanation.

I originally thought they went ahead with the hit because they were very vulnerable to Jesse "becoming a rat", so once they get from Walt that Jesse could be a problem, it's in their best interest to take him out (or enslave him) regardless of what Walt wants.

[Herb]

Tyweezel said:

Can you detail the instances in which Hank broke the law?

Hank took the WW book from Walt's house. Protocol dictates that he should have taken pictures of the book and whatever pages etc and filed for a warrant to seize the item. Hypothetically if the case ever went to court, anything used as evidence that came as a result of him taking the book would be illegal and not accepted as legitimate evidence. Obviously it's the point where Hank knows Walt is his man and everything he does is a result of him finding that book.

[Isalie]

Personally, I think people should differ between the moral and the legal aspects of Hanks actions.

Another thing, to the people saying Walt would've gotten away with it if it wasn't for Hank - Walt was never going to get away with it, his perceived control of the situation (that he still deluded himself about even after Hank's death), was never real. He was never coming out ahead.

[DaveSumm]

Something about Lydia just rubs me the wrong way and I can't figure out what it is. Every time I try to formulate it the reason eludes me. She's too heartless and cold. But then she's too weak and compassionate also. She's frigid and businesslike. But she's vulnerable and a caring mother. Why do I dislike her so?

She seems mildly frustrated every time she deals with anything, as if to say 'why is controlling a meth empire such hard work?'. She has a sense of entitlement to the millions of dollars that she seems to have been pretty lucky to have found herself in a position to earn.

[TrackerNeil]

Hank admitted what he did? I might have to watch again but I only remember Hank telling the story up until the point he left the junkyard to go to the hospital. Then he pleaded the fifth.

Look again. Hank accepted his punishment and did not lawyer up.

Hank took the WW book from Walt's house. Protocol dictates that he should have taken pictures of the book and whatever pages etc and filed for a warrant to seize the item. Hypothetically if the case ever went to court, anything used as evidence that came as a result of him taking the book would be illegal and not accepted as legitimate evidence. Obviously it's the point where Hank knows Walt is his man and everything he does is a result of him finding that book.

I don't know the legality, but this does not prove he is not a good man. It proves that he may have made mistakes. Hank's like people that way.

[Bridgeburners]

The Nazis went there because the head nazi realized that Walt had something valuable buried in that location. At least the possibility of that. It worked quite well for me as an explanation.

I originally thought they went ahead with the hit because they were very vulnerable to Jesse "becoming a rat", so once they get from Walt that Jesse could be a problem, it's in their best interest to take him out (or enslave him) regardless of what Walt wants.

At the time they had no reason to believe anything was buried there. They went over to help because they thought Walter was going to die (for all they knew Jesse ganged up on him with two of his own guys), and they needed him to cook. It was only after they arrived that Walter told them money was buried there, and then Uncle Jack figured out what the coordinates really were.

Hank is a very flawed character. He has a police superiority complex (sees all potential criminals as lowlife scumbags for whom human rights laws are simply a formality - this comes through when he beats up Jesse or those guys in the bar, or even something little as pushing the head back of a guy in a cell when he asks for his phone call), he's a bit of a misogynist, he gets obsessed with cases without regard for whom it affects, he skirts the edge of the law to get case information, etc.

But does anyone really want him to be a complete white knight? How boring would that be. I hate when show writers do that.

[Kalbear]

At the time they had no reason to believe anything was buried there. They went over to help because they thought Walter was going to die (for all they knew Jesse ganged up on him with two of his own guys), and they needed him to cook. It was only after they arrived that Walter told them money was buried there, and then Uncle Jack figured out what the coordinates really were.

Not true; he was already interested as soon as he heard the specific coordinates. That alone was unusual. When he heard about the money he figured out what was actually there, but the coordinates were worth a check regardless.

[TrackerNeil]

Hank is a very flawed character. He has a police superiority complex (sees all potential criminals as lowlife scumbags for whom human rights laws are simply a formality - this comes through when he beats up Jesse or those guys in the bar, or even something little as pushing the head back of a guy in a cell when he asks for his phone call), he's a bit of a misogynist, he gets obsessed with cases without regard for whom it affects, he skirts the edge of the law to get case information, etc.

But does anyone really want him to be a complete white knight? How boring would that be. I hate when show writers do that.

I don't think anyone claimed Hank is a "complete white knight." He's a good man, and like all good men, he has flaws.

[Bridgeburners]

I don't think anyone claimed Hank is a "complete white knight." He's a good man, and like all good men, he has flaws.

No, certainly nobody has claimed that. But I feel like a lot of people are being overly critical for him not being one, as if that's enough to stop you from rooting for him.

[Roose Seal]

I think Hank is supposed to be seen as Walt's exact opposite.

Walt is a generally evil character who lets the little good that's left in him shine through sometimes (like with the phone call in the last episode), while Hank is a generally good person who lets the darkness take over sometimes.

Hank seems like an average "good guy". Fucks up sometimes, but owns up to it. Walt on the other hand, is a "bad guy", whose acts of kindness are more often than not self-serving.

[Martell Spy]

No, certainly nobody has claimed that. But I feel like a lot of people are being overly critical for him not being one, as if that's enough to stop you from rooting for him.

Hank is a genius character precisely because he is a good leaning character, but there are also many reasons a viewer can find to NOT root for him. Being fast and loose with civil rights as a cop makes many nervous. There's also little character things like how he emasculates Walter back when Walter was still a sympathetic character in earlier seasons. By the end of this tale most want Walter to be caught, or at least out of business...but at the same time you don't want Hank to be the Big Damn Hero yet again. You want any cop but him to catch Walter.

He's kind of the stereotype of what many fear a typical DEA agent is like. And it was kind of planned of planned that way. I saw on Talking Bad I think that the original base concept for him was "dumb jock" or the like. Clearly he evolved from there, as Hank is far from dumb, but the personality type can be grating, especially when spiking the football in Walter's face. (Brilliant scene)

Of course that's what this show does, is turn around who we root for. We probaly shouldn't be rooting for Jesse or Mike, but many of us have. Mike in particular is a practiced killer. But when compared to Lydia and the Nazies, he looks like a saint. And he's frankly more likable than Hank. Mike seems like one of the sanest people in the show, until you ponder how many corpses he's made over the years.

[flinn]

They showed a good parallel in one of the episodes.

Walt's wife wanted Jesse killed.

Hank was more than fine feeding Jesse to Walt to get evidence on Walt.

Marie wants Walt dead.

Walt was the only one trying to avoid killing.

In a way it shows that all of them have their shades of gray and in the right/wrong circumstances could become what Walt has become.