The Latest News
Connect with Us

Notable Releases
From the Store
Game of Thrones Lannister House Crest Wooden Plaque
Game of Thrones Lannister House Crest Wooden Plaque
HBO US
Featured Sites
License Holders

Jump to content


Photo

The ADWD Epilogue


  • Please log in to reply
6 replies to this topic

#1 northernmonkey

northernmonkey

    Yorkshire Ambassador

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,496 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 07:52 AM

There's been a lot of talk on here about the ADWD epilogue recently, but is it only me who didn't really enjoy that part of the book?

I don't think it fits in with the rest of the novels at all. Like most people, throughout ADWD I kept thinking "when's Varys going to show up?" but when he does turn up, he just seems like a cartoon villain rather than the subtle character that he usually is. He seems to be acting very out of character. Obviously, GRRM writes the characters so he knows best, but weren't you disappointed to see Varys, the master manipulator, reduced to murdering two people in cold blood?

There are other questions I have. Why would Varys commit the murders in person? Surely he's got other people who are perfectly able. Why does he go on to explain his master plan to Kevan? Unlike the rest of the novels, it doesn't seem very realistic. It's like the whole scene is a nod to the reader, a contrived way to tell us Varys's plan and what side he's on.

I think it would have been better if the reader was left not knowing who murdered Kevan and Pycelle, or even if as he was dying, Kevan looked up to see Varys smiling at him.

I won't deny it was a very exciting scene, but I was also very disappointed.

#2 northernmonkey

northernmonkey

    Yorkshire Ambassador

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 1,496 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 07:53 AM

I seem to have posted this twice, does anyone know how I can delete one?

#3 RumHam

RumHam

    Commoner

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 4,083 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 07:54 AM

I seem to have posted this twice, does anyone know how I can delete one?


I don't think you can, the mods have to.

#4 Tyrion's Third Wife

Tyrion's Third Wife

    Sellsword

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 105 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 08:13 AM

Report your own duplicate post to get their attention.

#5 SanderOfTheFaith

SanderOfTheFaith

    Sellsword

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 82 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 11:53 AM

I think sometimes when your entire plan comes together. You feel the need to tell it to someone, to show them how you pulled it off, it's just for himself, not really a point for Kevan to hear. I think Kevan was a great candidate to be honest with because well..... He won't tell a soul.

#6 Jon of the Dead

Jon of the Dead

    You're the only turtle I want

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 2,098 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:14 PM

I didn't like the epilogue, but it wasn't because of Varys characterization.

It was like GRRM suddenly just remembered that he had to move the plot along so he crammed the epilogue to the brim with cliffhangers, shocks and hints:

Aegon is rising, there's tensions between Lannisters and Tyrells, Mace is hand, Cersei is suspiciously gentle, Jaime is reported missing, Boros Blount is seemingly poisoned, the Iron Bank want its due, winter has come at last, Varys shows up after 2 books, Kevan and Pycelle die, Varys tells his little speech...

It's too much, and don't get me wrong, it's cool. But if only the rest of the book had moved the plot along like this...

#7 sarah.jenice

sarah.jenice

    I KNOW A HAWK FROM A HANDSAW

  • Members
  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • 839 posts

Posted 21 September 2013 - 12:22 PM

I know the Epilogue comes up a lot - especially in the FAegon/Aegon debates - but I saw it as a necessary end for two really long books that brought in a lot of new characters/storylines and a lot of unanswered questions.

There are only two books left, and Dance was the first one that has started to give us hints into what Varys and Illyrio are really up to since we see them meeting in the dungeons in AGoT. In the same way that Lysa reveals Littlefinger's part in everything and his plans to Sansa in ASoS, Varys lays out their plans to Kevan (not saying this proves Aegon is real of course since this works either way) so the reader will know them. This isn't about Kevan and Varys, it's about GRRM wanting the reader to know these details.

If you think about it, after that speech by Varys, pretty much all of the cards are finally on the table for all of the characters in the Game of Thrones. That was the one of the last pieces of the puzzle when it comes to contenders for the Iron Throne (not counting other plots that may be out there from Maesters/Faceless Men) since we had already learned about the plots/plans of Littlefinger, Doran, the Ironborn, Stannis, Dany, Cersei, Tyrells, etc.

OP, I get where you're coming from about wanting more from Varys, but I felt the same way about how open Littlefinger is being with Sansa. However, we don't have first person accounts for these characters so the only way to learn their plans is to have them tell another character through dialogue. At least the person Varys told is dead so his motives continue to remain a mystery to the other characters in the books.