MMA & Boxing 14 - There's not a ditch in hell deep enough to toss Team Lloyd Irvin in

[Horus Ex Machina]

Okay, we were FINALLY approaching 400 posts (2 years later, give or take) so I decided to go ahead and FINALLY start a new thread.

I, like a number of MMA fans, have stayed away from this forum for one reason or another. One thing to catch my eye is that the Eddie Alvarez saga of a few months ago seemed to open up alot of inquiry about the inner workings of UFC contracts mostly bc this was the first time anyone had actually seen one. Reason being because Bellator immediately disputed the contract much like the UFC has done to other fighters in the past. In this case Eddie Alvarez decided that he wanted to test himself in the UFC but Bellator copied many of the tactics that the UFC does to keep it's talent in-house. So when the case was disputed in court, his UFC contract became public record. I guess we now know why the UFC rarely tries to go after fighters in other promotions until their free and clear. It's a wonder that they couldn't restrain themselves this time.

http://bleacherrepor...contract/page/2
http://www.bloodyelb...-a-union-in-mma

E2A: And DW's hypocrisy knows no bounds... http://bleacherrepor...y-wont-sign-him

"I heard if he loses, he gets cut. (Loses he gets cut; wins he has a third fight; if he wins that, he's a free agent.) It's a scumbag boxing deal," White said. "What do they think? If Eddie Alvarez loses, he's gonna come sign a deal with the UFC? No. We really don't take their rejects. If Eddie loses, why would we bring him to the UFC? They put him in a real (expletive) situation. But that's what that guy (Bjorn Rebney) is, he's a piece of (expletive).

"He had an opportunity to go out and find out what he was worth. And he did, yet he didn't get paid. Yet he didn't get what he was worth."

Yeah Dana, you tell him. Real scumbag move... but it somehow seems familiar though... I seem to remember some other promoter using almost the exact same methods to keep his fighters. Help me out Dana, who is it? Who's contract structure did Bjorn Rebney basically copy word for word down to the "you can't leave unless you lose" clause? Who's contracts basically keep a fighters rights FOREVER? I never thought I'd see DW call himself a scumbag with a straight face, but there it is...

And then there's this... http://sports.yahoo....06034--mma.html

“(Bellator) have the right to Eddie Alvarez,” said White. “He did his deal, but if you look at the way that this thing goes down, Eddie Alvarez paid his dues there. He honored his deal. He honored his contract with them. When your contract is up and you have the right to match, that’s where a fighter truly finds out what he is worth. Well, he found out what he was worth, now pay him the money.”
Bellator MMA is owned by Viacom, and White claims Viacom is running the promotion and not Bellator president Bjorn Rebney.

“Viacom is running that company,” said White.

“They’re Viacom, one of the most powerful media companies on Earth. What is the number they sit on, 5.5 billion in cash? 5.5 billion in cash, break some off for Eddie (expletive) Alvarez and pay him what he deserves.”

You can tell this for Alvarez' benefit. He's already inside Eddie's head and is planting the seeds for another revolt, perhaps with a few other fighters in mind like Ben Askren or Joe Warren.

And Pippa Middleton tries out boxing. Now you know me, I fall in love with women athletes, and especially women who train in some type of combat sport. Idk, it moves me in ways that super models don't. Anyway, here's a woman who's sister is the Duchess of Cambridge and she's learning a bit about pugilism. That's great. One thing that I've noticed as far as self-defence goes, and no matter how fit many a woman is, most females don't know how to throw punches. Now I've sparred with some girls who do and it isn't about size. If you know how to throw a punch correctly, you can hurt someone. This one girl at my old gym probably goes 110-120 at her heaviest but can throw a punch that can KO a 200 lb man if she can connect. And she throws those bombs consistently. However she probably could not take said punishment from someone much heavier than her, but at least she's more than capable of defending herself. Anyway, here's the article...

http://www.telegraph...cola-Adams.html

On that note, the first UFC title (and 2nd MMA title) from EA will feature female fighters...

And ppl may begin talking up Mayweather-Pacquiao again considering how difficult it's been to find a matchup for PBF. And considering how much more human Pacman has looked in recent outings, I doubt Floyd will find as many reasons to scuttle the fight if it gets negotiated a second time around. Anyone still wanna see that fight? Amir Khan's also still floating out there and though he's had some ridiculous losses, he's also had some very impressive wins. And he's boxer so should at least make a fight interesting for some time. He's got a weak chin but Floyd's defensive style generally doesn't lend him to go after such things early in fights. So it will be at least 6-8 rounds of interesting boxing.

And lastly, Andre Ward is going to be desperately searching for opponents soon. Is Middleweight becoming as de-populated as the heavier weights and will that soon be a problem in welterweight and below? At any rate, he's going to have to get a push soon bc he's the only guy who can replace Floyed and Pacman when they retire. And he likely won't get that push by fighting one of them like they did from fighting ODLH when his career was ending. It can be said that ODLH made Pacman and Mayweather. In fighting them, knowing that he would likely lose, he was investing in the future of Goldenboy Promotions. So how will the next superstar be made?

[polishgenius]

I don't think Ward will have any trouble finding opponents to be honest, though they aren't necessarily fighting in his division right now they'll certainly come to him. In particular, both Adonis Stevenson and Gennadiy Golovkin have expressed an interest in fighting him, though Golovkin will probably want to clean up his own division first before he steps up.

But there is an extent to which Ward is in an awkward situation where the risk/reward ratio of fighting him is skewed. A bit like, though for different reasons, Joe Calzaghe in his prime, and like Calzaghe should have done but didn't he will have to swallow his pride and make fights that aren't necessarily completely on his terms if he wants to become the draw he deserves to be (Calzaghe got there in the end with Lacy, but it was very late and robbed us of a proper Jones/Calzaghe contest). His defensive style never helped and his massive periods of inactivity have really hurt him, though HBO's continued pushing does help.

I don't understand how they can be so supportive of Ward but claim that Rigondeaux isn't marketable enough to bother putting him on television though.

Also, speaking of Golovkin:

That may prove to be a mistake...

On the Floyd/Khan thing: no, no chance that should happen. Khan hasn't nearly earned his dues for that fight and his continued talking about Mayweather when he's got a perfectly good opponent in front of him is disrespectful. He did it before both Garcia and Peterson and lost both times, you'd have thought he'd learn. I strongly suspect Alexander will beat him. I hope he does.

Partly that's because the winner of that will have a mandatory defence against the winner of Shenchenko vs Kell Brook who I really want to see at world title level, see if he's got the mettle, and Khan won't take it - he'll vacate rather than fight Brook if Brook's not got a title, which he obvously doesn't.

Tbh, to me the layout of future fights in that area seems pretty obvious - Garcia should be Mayweather's next opponent, he's more than earned it. Brook, if he wins against Schenchenko, should fight the winner of Khan/Alexander, and the winner of that fight should be next in line for Mayweather. Meanwhile the loser of Khan/Alexander should fight Matthysse, which then opens up options for the winner of that battle too. It's a great little cluster of fighters there ar the moment.

[Arrogant Bastard]

Khan surely doesn't deserve a fight with Floyd, but I'd watch that over Floyd vs Devon Alexander; that fight has snooze fest written all over it. Khan has quick hand speed that could make it interesting for a few rounds, and his weak chin almost ensures a knockout--he was life and death with Julio Diaz. Plus he doesn't bark annoyingly whenever he throws a punch.

MMA: Jones Gustaffson was a good fight, though not as great as people are making it out to be. I'm surprised at all the calls for robbery; I thought Jones clearly won two rounds, and a few were up for grabs. I personally scored it 3-2 Jones.

[polishgenius]

So apparently Khan is indeed going to be Mayweather's next fight. I'm genuinely cross.

[Mark Antony]

So apparently Khan is indeed going to be Mayweather's next fight. I'm genuinely cross.

Are you serious? Another one I won't be ordering. It won't be a contest.

[Ramsay B.]

Are you serious? Another one I won't be ordering. It won't be a contest.

Yeah. A big name but the same results. Easy win for Floyd.

[lessthanluke]

I have no interest in that fight. Regarding UFC I scored the fight for Gus but it was close.

[Horus Ex Machina]

So apparently Khan is indeed going to be Mayweather's next fight. I'm genuinely cross.

He won't win (or even come close to that) but it will be more entertaining than most of Mayweather's fights. I might drop by a bar to watch.

[polishgenius]

Khan's camp seem to be denying it. Interesting one.

[ljkeane]

I haven't watched any of Khan's fights for ages, there's no way he's winning but does he still have fast enough hands to even offer a threat of making it interesting?

[polishgenius]

He's definitely got faster hands than anyone Floyd's faced in a very long while, yeah. However I don't think he's got the ring-craft to make it any significant contest, and his chin will mean it probably ends early. He just can't get in and out without being hit himself.

If it happens, it should be more exciting than most of Floyd's fights, but I can't see it lasting long.

[ljkeane]

Yeah, I can't see Khan lasting too long but to be fair Mayweather does tend to try and avoid people while they've still got fast hands so as a challenge to Mayweather's defensive skills at least it's an interesting change of pace.

[Ramsay B.]

The Stun Gun with a awesome KO. The Brazil crowd shocked...free MMA!

[Hutch]

The Stun Gun with a awesome KO. The Brazil crowd shocked...free MMA!

That was one hell of a KO! War Kim!

[Horus Ex Machina]

Hopefully there are some MMA fans on this forum. I love The UFC, but sometimes you want something different with a twist, its just like European Soccer, you would want a variety of Leagues, not just MLS soccer, EPL or La Liga because just like soccer, you have a lot of high level MMA fighters that have not even been discovered yet. I think Bellator is in a very stable market place with a strong broadcasting network, I think in due time they may be equal to the UFC if not better because of better sponsorships and they're not just going to let go of their marquee fighters like Eddie Alverez.

Do you the forum think that Bellator is new Pride FC, only with fighter fighting in a cage on American soil with a promise of permanency and stability?

Replying to your comment over here bro so that it can get some facetime with MMA fans.

I couldn't agree more. Which is why I still feel nostalgic for the days of old when you not only had different organizations, but entirely different philosophies about the sports presentation, format, rules and officiating which required different tactics and strategies and really made fighters more rounded and offered unique and different challenges. I so disagree with DW and many UFC fan's take that uniformity is the key forward. Alot of spontaneity has been sucked from the sport.

Matches in rings favored jiu jitsu practitioners over wrestlers bc it prevented them from boxing their opponents in and dictating the clinches. Soccer kicks and stomps prevented alot of the turtling that occurs and added an extra element to the attacks of kickboxers and other standup fighters. Then you had the different round system with the 10/5 system as opposed to the 5/5/5 here in the States. Grand Prix's were the gauntlet. Many American MMA fans who were enthusiasts soley for UFC fighting, disdained it bc it didn't necessarily find out who was the best, only who survived. But that's the point. How many playoffs truly decide who the best team is? The point of Grand Prix's were to be a different type of competition, offer opportunities for fighters short of winning the title. And perhaps give a dominant champ a challenge that tests his fortitude and resolve as well as his skills.

I miss the eclectic nature of MMA. I only hope that someday DW and the Fertittas change their tune on some things. They impressed me when they changed their tune on Women in the UFC, which was long overdue. So perhaps they'll open things up as the UFC's growth has stagnated a bit. Perhaps introduce a Grand Prix. I can see that happening now that Scott Coker is with them.

As for Bellator, they've got some serious backers. Strikeforce did as well, but Showtime was way too naive with their goals vs what they were willing to invest and they folded. Bjorn Rebney is a smart owner and is using many of DW's own tactics against him. It's the reason why Eddie Alvarez is still in Bellator and will likely remain there for some time. DW doesn't like this, which is a good sign bc when DW is still being antagonistic towards another organization, then it means that they're not on the brink of being bought out. With both Pride and Strikeforce DW, Sherdog, and Kevin Iole at Yahoo Sports suddenly got awfully supportive of things that Coker and co. were doing at Strikeforce where for the previous 3 years or so they couldn't find a good thing to say about them despite having previously been considered a model organization when they weren't directly competing with the UFC. It's hard to compete when the UFC has so many blatant proxy's in the media. That said, they got alot of good will from me when they let women in. Now I don't usually spend as much of my time blasting DW and the UFC.

[GSP]

Who's got who for the big rubber match Saturday?

[Horus Ex Machina]

Who's got who for the big rubber match Saturday?

Hmm,.. tough one to call. I went with JDS the first time but was wrong on the second. I still think that JDS is the more rounded fighter and should take this, but it's closer than I first thought. Tough match to call.

And my girl Sarah Kaufman is finally coming to UFC. I'm happy for her and happy that the UFC is bringing over more talent. Invicta looks like a great breeding ground for UFC and is holding steady. Powerful stuff. I'm gonna probably end up marrying myself a fighter. That or a fitness chick. Love their toughness and attitude. Especially Sarah's. She's all business. A perfect foil to Rousey. Can't believe that she was a dancer before starting MMA. Just sick,... and I mean that in a good way!

But right under the main event, Daniel Cormier, is bringing that Olympic pedigree to the cage once again, big win-big ups-big props being predicted by me, one round TKO over Nelson. Bank on it!

Gil Melendez will get his UFC title shot and win it within the year. Bank on it!

Okay setting myself up for it somewhere here...

Can Gonzaga ever get back to the precipice he was on? He was such a promising and skilled fighter, and the broken nose that he suffered early against Couture broke him mentally.

Sotiroupolos vs Noons is another nice one. I'll go with Noons to take it by decision. I think he's due but Sotiroupolos is a very tough matchup. Altogether a lovely looking card. Definitely will be watching this weekend!

[Ramsay B.]

Cain will finish him, this time. 3rd round KO is my call.

[Hutch]

I'm going to have to take JDS in this one. He had a lot of excuses after the thrashing Cain gave him last time, and whether legit or not, I think it lit a fire in his belly.

As for DC vs Nelson, I'm probably the only one taking Nelson. He's far more experienced, the smarter fighter in my opinion (sometimes), and Cormier hasn't really impressed me yet in the way he seems to have impressed everyone else. More then anything I'm curious to see how Nelson's chin holds up after losing all that weight.

Other then that, I've got Melendez by murder, Jorden by TKO, and I'm hoping to see Boetch bounce Dollaways head off the mat a few times.

[Horus Ex Machina]

Brazilian fighters love them some standup. JDS says that he can outbox the Klitskos, oh LOL!

http://mmafrenzy.com/94924/jds-on-boxing-the-klitschkos-i-can-beat-them/

Still I say, let him try. It's about the challenge, this is a sport. I wish what Overeem was able to do in K1 was possible for UFC fighters.