Jump to content

Do Westerosi Armies Have Ballista's?


Arthur Dayne's Honor

Recommended Posts

In the real world ballistas predate trebuchets. They were mature technology by the time of Alexander the Great. Trebuchets didn't reach their full development until the Middle Ages, by which time classic ballistas disappeared, being replaced by the arbalest.

"Scorpion" is a really vague term, could be any number of devices.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, they do. Tyrion muses about them while watching the Yunkish jokes and the scorpions at the Wall are de facto ballistas

Technological advancement doesn't seem to occur in Westeros. If anything they seem to have regressed over time.

That's a wrong impression. The problem is that most Westeros lack the education and interest to conciously register the technological advancement. That was quite common in the real world as well. Church paintings show Saints in plate armor, King David as knight in mail, roman legionnaires as landsknechts and all that, simply projecting current circumstances backwards.

But there are a lot of hints for technological advancements. Jaime points out advancements in architecture, Cersei in shipbuilding, Jon in glassmaking and glasshouses, Sam, Maester Luwin, Rodrik Harlaw and the novices of the citadel more general advancements.

I mean if you have maybe a dozen Ballista's it wouldn't be to hard to shoot a dragon down.

Well, if you hit. That's quite a big if. Aiming a ballista takes several minutes. Not gonna happen while the dragon is on the move. You'd need to set up the ballistas in advance and shoot when the dragon crosses the line of fire by pure chance. The sky is really big, so that's already terribly unlikely and any sane rider would avoid it as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, they do. Tyrion muses about them while watching the Yunkish jokes and the scorpions at the Wall are de facto ballistas

That's a wrong impression. The problem is that most Westeros lack the education and interest to conciously register the technological advancement. That was quite common in the real world as well. Church paintings show Saints in plate armor, King David as knight in mail, roman legionnaires as landsknechts and all that, simply projecting current circumstances backwards.

But there are a lot of hints for technological advancements. Jaime points out advancements in architecture, Cersei in shipbuilding, Jon in glassmaking and glasshouses, Sam, Maester Luwin, Rodrik Harlaw and the novices of the citadel more general advancements.

Indeed. We must also keep in mind that the First Men could only work iron and bronze, whereas the Andals had perfected steelcraft by their invasion of Westeros. Furthermore, the Free Cities seem to be more politically and technologically (canals, architecture) advanced than Westeros. Westeros probably progresses very slowly due to the frequent wars which drain the populace and plague the land.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Indeed. We must also keep in mind that the First Men could only work iron and bronze, whereas the Andals had perfected steelcraft by their invasion of Westeros. Furthermore, the Free Cities seem to be more politically and technologically (canals, architecture) advanced than Westeros. Westeros probably progresses very slowly due to the frequent wars which drain the populace and plague the land.

That's what i find weird. In RL, frequent wars actually caused technological advancement over time and Europe is a great example of that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

GRRM never actually comes out and says that the Westerosi don't have digital targeting systems. That's going to the maester's ace in the hole when the Targaryens invade.

I hate to disagree, but it's going to come from the Myr Institute of Technology. All that sophisticated glasswork they create is only produced in order to pay for their computer R&D.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I think that in warfare, the focus on chivalry disappeared shortly after it reached it's height, due to the invention of fire-arms. I think that one possible explanation for the situation in Westeros is that it lacks some geochemical resources of our earth which would explain why there is no gun powder, for example. And obviously there are no coal deposits.

But what bugs me is how many forests there are in Westeros. Didn't the process of rapid deforestation in Europe(specifically England?) precede the industrialization for about two centuries, meaning that it started in an age in which Westeros seems to remain for many thousands of years?

Surely there are historians on this board who could resolve those... inconsistencies :drool:

Also, I don't think that ballistas ballistae are anti-air weapons.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I think that in warfare, the focus on chivalry disappeared shortly after it reached it's height, due to the invention of fire-arms. I think that one possible explanation for the situation in Westeros is that it lacks some geochemical resources of our earth which would explain why there is no gun powder, for example. And obviously there are no coal deposits.

But what bugs me is how many forests there are in Westeros. Didn't the process of rapid deforestation in Europe(specifically England?) precede the industrialization for about two centuries, meaning that it started in an age in which Westeros seems to remain for many thousands of years?

Surely there are historians on this board who could resolve those... inconsistencies :drool:

Also, I don't think that ballistas ballistae are anti-air weapons.

There aren't that many forests, actually, and the trees grow back quicker than people manage to cut it down. What are they going to do with all that surplus timber, anyway? If i remember correctly there are three huge forests, and from Jon's chapters we hear that the nights watch have a hard time keeping the ground clear of trees.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, I think that in warfare, the focus on chivalry disappeared shortly after it reached it's height, due to the invention of fire-arms. I think that one possible explanation for the situation in Westeros is that it lacks some geochemical resources of our earth which would explain why there is no gun powder, for example. And obviously there are no coal deposits.

But what bugs me is how many forests there are in Westeros. Didn't the process of rapid deforestation in Europe(specifically England?) precede the industrialization for about two centuries, meaning that it started in an age in which Westeros seems to remain for many thousands of years?

Surely there are historians on this board who could resolve those... inconsistencies :drool:

Also, I don't think that ballistas ballistae are anti-air weapons.

Actually, the focus on chivalry began when it had become obsolete on the field, Turned from a tool of war to a sport. Sports can afford fair play.

Melisandre or the pyromancers seem to employ gun powder and similar. Why do you presume that there are no coal deposits? No coal, no steel. Charcoal can only serve to a certain extent, but it's mentioned as often as coal mines.

Deforestation is a local phenomen. Apart from the Kingswood and the North, woods are rarely mentioned in the series. Could be that the Westerlands, the Reach, and all the other southern regions apart from the Stormlands suffer from deforestation. The Iron Islands certainly do.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

×
×
  • Create New...