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Terms that are thrown a round


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#1 JonathanTheBold

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:46 AM

I've been a member of this forum a while and have noticed two well three words that seem to be thrown around without thought of their meaning those words be Crazy, Madness, and Atrocities.
Crazy and Madness I consider to halves of the same claims usually used to demean a person who takes actions that people don't like regardless of that person actual mental state examples would be Dany, Lysa Tully, The Mountain, And Mel. To
me none of these people are crazy more misguided and misinformed and people seem to think makeing decisions based of wrong information makes u crazy.
Now the world Atrocities this world seems to be used o describe Tyrions actions after the purple wedding and honestly if you can say Tyrions actions are atrocities you have little to no understanding of the words meaning and the context that its been used for in history the holocaust and slavery of Africans come to mind and in those context I don't see how you could honestly say Tryions committed "Atrocities" demeans real atrocities.
Anyway are there any other terms used improperly that bother any of u

#2 Audrey Arryn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:48 AM

"cliche"=the person doesnt agree with your theory or doesnt want it to happen.

"its obvious"= The person doesnt want the theory to happen or doesnt agree.



#3 TalalOfDorne

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:51 AM

Well to me, sexual assault (Something Tyrion commits) is an atrocity.

On topic: Words like "abuse" "torment" and "cruel" come to mind when it comes to Cat and Jon.

Edited by TalalOfDorne, 11 October 2013 - 10:55 AM.


#4 Seņor de la Tormenta

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:56 AM

Many of us are not english speakers, so I guess you cannot be so harsh on the matter. You got to live with it!

#5 Consigliere

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:57 AM

OP - words can have more than one meaning.

 

Atrocity is defined as:

1. Appalling or atrocious condition, quality, or behavior; monstrousness.
2. behaviour or an action that is wicked or ruthless
3. An appalling or atrocious act, situation, or object, especially an act of unusual or illegal cruelty inflicted by an armed force on civilians or prisoners.


#6 butterbumps!

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:59 AM

Now the world Atrocities this world seems to be used o describe Tyrions actions after the purple wedding and honestly if you can say Tyrions actions are atrocities you have little to no understanding of the words meaning and the context that its been used for in history the holocaust and slavery of Africans come to mind and in those context I don't see how you could honestly say Tryions committed "Atrocities" demeans real atrocities.
Anyway are there any other terms used improperly that bother any of u

Well, no, "atrocity" is the correct term.  "Atrocity" simply means a particularly wicked act.  So when used to describe Tyrion's dalliances with rape, murder and patricide, this term is applicable.  "Enormity" is similar, with a slightly less condemnatory connotation (just deviance from moral rectitude).  Both are pretty spot on to describe the actions in question.



#7 Blutraven

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 10:59 AM

I don't think misinformed people would poison their husband and try to push their niece out of a door to nothing 600 ft in the air.



#8 Audrey Arryn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:00 AM

Many of us are not english speakers, so I guess you cannot be so harsh on the matter. You got to live with it!

Thats a good point however I disagree.

 

If someone cant speak french well they won't throw words around that they don't understand well.



#9 Marwi

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:03 AM

Thats a good point however I disagree.
 
If someone cant speak french well they won't throw words around that they don't understand well.


Certainly they do, if they are trying to explain themselves at the best of their skills and are being unaware of their mis-interpretation of some words or can't find proper words to say something.

If you've ever been in such a situation of need, you understand pretty well this thing.

Edited by Marwi, 11 October 2013 - 11:03 AM.


#10 Audrey Arryn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:04 AM

Certainly they do, if they are trying to explain themselves at the best of their skills and are being unaware of their mis-interpretation of some words or can't find proper words to say something.

If you've ever been in such a situation of need, you understand pretty well this thing.

Thats my point people do but they shouldn't.

 

Yes I have been in a situation I am a french speaker


Edited by Audrey Arryn, 11 October 2013 - 11:05 AM.


#11 Marwi

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:07 AM

Thats my point people do but they shouldn't.
 
Yes I have been in a situation I am a french speaker


Shouldn't.
So what are these fans supposed to do.. restrain themselves from joining this forum because they can't speak proper UK English?

#12 Seņor de la Tormenta

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:08 AM

Certainly they do, if they are trying to explain themselves at the best of their skills and are being unaware of their mis-interpretation of some words or can't find proper words to say something.

If you've ever been in such a situation of need, you understand pretty well this thing.

This happens to me a lot, specialy because sometimes we use words that are really specifical for a medieval context that I would ever use in normal life; Types of armor, weapons, jobs etc.

#13 Audrey Arryn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:11 AM

Shouldn't.
So what are these fans supposed to do.. restrain themselves from joining this forum because they can't speak proper UK English?

:eek:  Google is your friend

If you don't understand a term well you shouldn't use it then or look for an explanation, this is logic I don't see how this should be debatable.



#14 Woman of War

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:19 AM

I myself am not a native English speaker but I've read the books in the language they have been written in. Maybe those who complain about non native speakers here should consider reading every book they ever touch in its original language, Spanish, French, German etc since this is the only way to do justice to good literature.

WHAT? You can't? You are limited to English??? You should be ashamed, stupiditas infinita!

Seriously, I really dislike any kind of arrogance against non native speakers. After all they at least manage two languages.

Edited by Woman of War, 11 October 2013 - 11:24 AM.


#15 butterbumps!

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:24 AM

:eek:  Google is your friend

If you don't understand a term well you shouldn't use it then or look for an explanation, this is logic I don't see how this should be debatable.

Those of us raised in English speaking countries have the benefit of ingrained word connotations.  Connotative implications of words are extremely tricky even for those who are otherwise very fluent but not native speakers, especially because translation dictionaries provide the denotative meanings.  I've even had miscommunication with words when conversing American-British English on here due to connotative differences.  

 

I really don't think it's fair to place such stringent expectations on everyone.  Imposing "shoulds" on non-native speakers takes away from the collaborative atmosphere.



#16 Knight Of Winter

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:26 AM

Couple of words that are used way too easily here are legal, lawful and all variations thereof. Especially since Westeros doesn't have any kind of codified law.



#17 Audrey Arryn

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:28 AM

Those of us raised in English speaking countries have the benefit of ingrained word connotations.  Connotative implications of words are extremely tricky even for those who are otherwise very fluent but not native speakers, especially because translation dictionaries provide the denotative meanings.  I've even had miscommunication with words when conversing American-British English on here due to connotative differences.  

 

I really don't think it's fair to place such stringent expectations on everyone.  Imposing "shoulds" on non-native speakers takes away from the collaborative atmosphere.

I am a non english speaker.

 

But my point is if you say "You are a f*** and say I am a non native speaker as an excuse it is not justified because you are in an english forum and must know the meaning of every word you are going to post to prevent any offensive misconception,



#18 butterbumps!

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:36 AM

I am a non english speaker.

 

But my point is if you say "You are a f*** and say I am a non native speaker as an excuse it is not justified because you are in an english forum and must know the meaning of every word you are going to post to prevent any offensive misconception,

This is seriously your concern?  Being insulted and having the other person hide behind the defense of being a non-native speaker who didn't know?  Is this even a thing?   This kind of seems like an absurdly fabricated scenario.  In the event it's not, I'm pretty sure it's against forum rules to be writing evaluative posts about each other, so I don't even know why this is an issue.

 

I'm a native English speaker and don't have every single definition of every single word I use memorized.  I sure as shit do not expect the rest of the world to have all these memorized either.



#19 Seņor de la Tormenta

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:41 AM

I am a non english speaker.
 
But my point is if you say "You are a f*** and say I am a non native speaker as an excuse it is not justified because you are in an english forum and must know the meaning of every word you are going to post to prevent any offensive misconception,

You are asking for something hard for english speakers from different countries, and almost imposible for non native speakers.
Im thinking for example in my own language, the word I use for "take" or "grab" is used as "f...k" in america.

#20 Mladen

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 11:42 AM

I myself am not a native English speaker but I've read the books in the language they have been written in. Maybe those who complain about non native speakers here should consider reading every book they ever touch in its original language, Spanish, French, German etc since this is the only way to do justice to good literature.

WHAT? You can't? You are limited to English??? You should be ashamed, stupiditas infinita!

Seriously, I really dislike any kind of arrogance against non native speakers. After all they at least manage two languages.

 

Gods be merciful, we agree on something... Yes, or they should at least consider reading ASOIAF on more languages than one, like some of us had done...

 

 

Those of us raised in English speaking countries have the benefit of ingrained word connotations.  Connotative implications of words are extremely tricky even for those who are otherwise very fluent but not native speakers, especially because translation dictionaries provide the denotative meanings.  I've even had miscommunication with words when conversing American-British English on here due to connotative differences.  

 

I really don't think it's fair to place such stringent expectations on everyone.  Imposing "shoulds" on non-native speakers takes away from the collaborative atmosphere.

 

Nicely said. Even though my English is relatively good, I admit I am sometimes struggling with some terms, especially in achieving the high level of readability of my essays and posts. But, i always count on people understanding that we are not all raised in English-speaking countries...

 

Edit: Talal 32-23


Edited by Zunni, 11 October 2013 - 11:53 AM.