Clegane'sPup

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  1. Jaime’s back story is a bit c-o-m-p-l-i-c-a-t-e-d-. I seem to remember that the King to spite Tywin brought Jaime into the fold at the tourney at Harrenhal. Jaime’s back story also has a bit to do with his sister. In the below quote Jaime is reminiscing about the day he killed his King ----two important things ---- Jaime wore the golden armor (Lannister) not the white and the King told Jaime to bring him Tywin’s head. Seems to me, that the pawn Jaime, was going to be a Kingslayer or a kinslayer (parricide). OR Jaime could have simply thrown down his sword, walked away, and been hunted and hounded as a coward & traitor. But that is not the story the author wrote. A Storm of Swords - Jaime II But when he closed his eyes, it was Aerys Targaryen he saw, pacing alone in his throne room, picking at his scabbed and bleeding hands. The fool was always cutting himself on the blades and barbs of the Iron Throne. Jaime had slipped in through the king's door, clad in his golden armor, sword in hand. The golden armor, not the white, but no one ever remembers that. Would that I had taken off that damned cloak as well. When Aerys saw the blood on his blade, he demanded to know if it was Lord Tywin's. "I want him dead, the traitor. I want his head, you'll bring me his head, or you'll burn with all the rest. Also SoS Jaime V chapter gives a rather interesting look at what was happening when he became known as the Kingslayer. In this saga Jaime can be judged for his actions (never mind the until you walk in my shoes shite), but the way the character is written Jaime is not a liar.
  2. Okay sum of the city slickers ain’t been out in the rural areas of their country. This guest right thawg in these novels is about hospitality in the north of Westeros. The people south of the Neck dunna pay much heed in the custom. The World of Ice and Fire - The North One notable custom that the Northmen hold dearer than any other is guest right, the tradition of hospitality by which a man may offer no harm to a guest beneath his roof, nor a guest to his host. The Andals held to something like it as well, but it looms less large in southron minds. / In my opinion all Mance is saying in the below quote is that he ain’t gonna kill Jon this night BUT Mance can’t guarantee that someone in Mance’s crew ain’t gonna off Jon. A Storm of Swords - Jon I The laws of hospitality are as old as the First Men, and sacred as a heart tree." He gestured at the board between them, the broken bread and chicken bones. "Here you are the guest, and safe from harm at my hands . . . this night, at least. / Mance spoke nothing of salt and bread to Jon, they ate chicken and bread Bejebes, Lord Walder knows about the quest right tradition. He is not a northman he is a Riverlander, a southron. By the time the RW rolls around Walder has already thrown In with Tywin and Roose . A Storm of Swords - Catelyn VI Walder Frey's mouth moved in and out. "Food, heh. A loaf of bread, a bite of cheese, mayhaps a sausage." "Some wine to wash it down," Robb said. "And salt." "Bread and salt. Heh. Of course, of course." The old man clapped his hands together, and servants came into the hall, bearing flagons of wine and trays of bread, cheese, and butter. Lord Walder took a cup of red himself, and raised it high with a spotted hand. "My guests," he said. "My honored guests. Be welcome beneath my roof, and at my table." Notice in the above quote Walder says, "My honored guests. Be welcome beneath my roof, and at my table." Hospitality --- the implication is you are safe from harm from me right now/this night. Guest right as it applies to all the other frekking scenarios ---- twist it, turn it, have fun with it. I would ask ---- is providing your guest with hospility the opposite of a lord laying an unsheathed sword across his knees while sitting his chair? A Game of Thrones - Bran IV Robb was seated in Father's high seat, wearing ringmail and boiled leather and the stern face of Robb the Lord. Theon Greyjoy and Hallis Mollen stood behind him. A dozen guardsmen lined the grey stone walls beneath tall narrow windows. In the center of the room the dwarf stood with his servants, and four strangers in the black of the Night's Watch. Bran could sense the anger in the hall the moment that Hodor carried him through the doors. "Any man of the Night's Watch is welcome here at Winterfell for as long as he wishes to stay," Robb was saying with the voice of Robb the Lord. His sword was across his knees, the steel bare for all the world to see. Even Bran knew what it meant to greet a guest with an unsheathed sword. "Any man of the Night's Watch," the dwarf repeated, "but not me, do I take your meaning, boy?" Edit: Does Davos know what guest right is and is he a viable source about what guest right is about--- A Dance with Dragons - Davos I It was, though any stale crust would have tasted just as fine to Davos; it meant he was a guest here, for this one night at least. The lords of the Three Sisters had a black repute, and none more so than Godric Borrell, Lord of Sweetsister, Shield of Sisterton, Master of Breakwater Castle, and Keeper of the Night Lamp … but even robber lords and wreckers were bound by the ancient laws of hospitality. I will see the dawn, at least, Davos told himself. I have eaten of his bread and salt./ Thing is did Davos actually ingest salt? I dunna know because I didna re-read the complete chapter.
  3. I’ll provide what the author wrote. A Storm of Swords - Jon I The laws of hospitality are as old as the First Men, and sacred as a heart tree." He gestured at the board between them, the broken bread and chicken bones. "Here you are the guest, and safe from harm at my hands . . . this night, at least. / I don’t own WOIAF. It is available on the search site https://asearchoficeandfire.com/ The World of Ice and Fire - The North One notable custom that the Northmen hold dearer than any other is guest right, the tradition of hospitality by which a man may offer no harm to a guest beneath his roof, nor a guest to his host. The Andals held to something like it as well, but it looms less large in southron minds. / Since I don’t have the App I can’t say what it says about guest right. In my opinion it appears that for the one night both the guest and the host are safe for the night..
  4. I think you are a very amiable and polite poster. Kudos. Many will not remember the TV series LOST which was referenced by Martin in the above article I linked. I gotta look at what Martin said and what Martin has written in his saga. The article says: Martin knows what it’s like to be provoked by a serial entertainment. He experienced it himself as a faithful viewer of “Lost,” the ABC adventure series about a group of castaways trapped on a mysterious island. “I kept watching it and I was fascinated,” he recalls. “They’d introduce these things and I thought that I knew where it was going. Then they’d introduce some other thing and I’d rethink it.” Like many “Lost” fans, Martin resented the series’s mystical ending, which left dozens of narrative threads dangling. “ We watched it every week trying to figure it out, and as it got deeper and deeper I kept saying, ‘They better have something good in mind for the end. This end better pay off here.’ And then I felt so cheated when we got to the conclusion.”/ I’m at the point I just want an ending whatever it is. Whether it is a nightmare, a dream, time travel or whether Jon and Dany spawn a new ruler who turns Westeros into a peaceful seven kingdoms.
  5. I would like to read the next installment of this saga. Granted the man has a busy life and has enriched the community of the arts. A writer does not owe anyone anything. A writer tells a story or no. I can only hope that he finishes his tale. Step back a moment and think about the fame and notoriety that Martin achieved with his HBO deal and read this 2011 article. https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2011/04/11/just-write-it If anyone reads the article and steps outside the forum bubble I would be interested in their thoughts.
  6. I had to struggle to keep the My Pappy Van Winkles Family bourbon from spilling.
  7. Maybe this is helpful or not. The Bael bard story is told by Ygritte in CoK Jon IV. Mance & Jon’s conversation takes place in SoS Jon I. A Storm of Swords - Jon I "Bael the Bard," said Jon, remembering the tale that Ygritte had told him in the Frostfangs, the night he'd almost killed her. "Would that I were. I will not deny that Bael's exploit inspired mine own . . . but I did not steal either of your sisters that I recall. Bael wrote his own songs, and lived them. I only sing the songs that better men have made. More mead?"
  8. Garsh dangit dude/dudette don’t you know I am old as Nan. I’m trying to play Harry Potter on Xbox 360 and you keep popping up trying to argue with me about sumthin’ I dinna say. Bejesus. Har!
  9. nope, nope I poured no scorn on Cat or Sansa. This thread is short so it is not difficult to navigate. The opening post said: I replied: I would suggest you slow your roll and back off my bumper. Happy Friday.
  10. Sorry no, I dunna think I can enlighten you or anyone. The word essence in the context I was using it merely means the human condition. Maybe what I posted four hours ago to another poster will shed some light on it.
  11. I was using satire to mock “hate” threads. If you look at my words you quoted I said, “I do not agree that either of them are the worst characters in the series.” If you want an explanation of my words,” dark side of the female essence,” I’ll give you one. In my life experience I have met females who exhibit some of the traits of Martin’s characters. I myself on occasion have been selfish and self centered. To deny that females can be petty, vicious and vindictive is foolish, but you will note that I didn’t say Cat or Sansa exhibited those traits, did I. I would be interested in reading your response to the original post. Thanks
  12. @LynnS you may be interested in this freedom to express the personal opinion in a forum. I would ask the same question @Lady Dacey asked. Who is they? The twitterverse and facebookverse and the other social media outlets need to reign in that “hate” shite. Sansa is a fictional character in a fictional book. She is a child with childish ideas. She is a child so yes, Sansa is naïve and was until Eddard took her to KL she was much protected and believed her fairy tales. She is a child so yes, Sansa is naïve and was until Eddard took her to KL she was much protected and believed her fairy tales. Both Cat and her darling Sansa are selfish and a bit self centered. I do not agree that either of them are the worst characters in the series. The book character Ms. Stark and her daughter merely portray the dark side of the female essence. Yes little Sansa a 11/12 year old girl afeard of being separated from her prince spilled the beans. As to the But... a wrench does not fit every nut. Whatcha think @LynnS is the OP being sincere? Was I amiable enough? The discussion in a different thread goes like this Poster !: Nobody has any obligation to humor interpretations or arguments that have absolutely no basis in the text. You are within your right to post such things, however baseless, and others are well within their right to point out how baseless they are. Poster 2: Yes, all kinds of baseless things have been posted including assumptions about RLJ. However, there is an obligation for civil discourse. The ability to treat other members with respect is the issue, not whether or not you think something is baseless.
  13. I agree. I agree. There seems to me that there are a few things going on ---- you are pranking, you are bored, your brain is not working properly or you are looking for validation or argument. Are you aware that LC Qorglye was most likely Dornish? Let me go back the what say stuff ---- what say Qorglye brought the song with him when he went to the Wall. I don't know why Qorglye decided to take the black. I don't know his back story. The Dornishman's wife was as fair as the sun, and her kisses were warmer than spring. But the Dornishman's blade was made of black steel, and its kiss was a terrible thing. The Dornishman's wife would sing as she bathed, in a voice that was sweet as a peach, But the Dornishman's blade had a song of its own, and a bite sharp and cold as a leech. As he lay on the ground with the darkness around, and the taste of his blood on his tongue, His brothers knelt by him and prayed him a prayer, and he smiled and he laughed and he sung, "Brothers, oh brothers, my days here are done, the Dornishman's taken my life, But what does it matter, for all men must die, and I've tasted the Dornishman's wife! I took the below quote directly off the wiki site. Easiest and simplest. I can’t find the words to ole Bael’s song of the winter rose legend. It seems to me ole Bael was a wildling. According to legend, Bael the Bard climbed the Wall, took the kingsroad, and entered Winterfell as a singer under the name Sygerrik of Skagos. There he sang until midnight for Lord Brandon Stark. Impressed by Bael's skills as a singer, Brandon asked him what he wanted as a reward. Bael answered by requesting the most beautiful flower blooming in Winterfell's gardens. As the blue winter roses were just blooming, Brandon agreed to offer him one. The following morning the single virgin daughter of the lord had disappeared. In her bed was the rose Bael had received from her father./ Your thread title is ---- Jon, Mance's blue rose and the Dayne heiress ---- From what I have read of your theories I am a bit confused especially with this one. What is it that you are trying to convey? Sum it up for me, please, in five sentences of 20 or less words. If you come back with a remark that you don't have to explain nuttin' to nobody
  14. Don't pay any attention to the rest of the post because I am being I can understand the mystery behind Mance. I have my own tinfoil and questions. Considering Mance, as a child was taken in by the NW after a group of wildlings had been killed --- Let’s say Mance displayed leadership potential as he aged. Let’s say he was being groomed to be a ranger. Let’s say that in that grooming process he was taught to read & write. That is a lot of let’s say. How old does a person think that Mance is? He was supposedly raised at the Wall. I don’t know how old Mance was when he deserted. According to Halfhand A Clash of Kings - Jon VII "Was he a good ranger?" "He was the best of us," said the Halfhand, "and the worst as well. <snip> "She even claimed we were kin. She told me a story . . ."". . . of Bael the Bard and the rose of Winterfell. So Stonesnake told me. It happens I know the song. Mance would sing it of old, when he came back from a ranging. He had a passion for wildling music. Aye, and for their women as well."/ It seems Mance had a passion for women and wildling music. A person could ask where the wildlings heard the songs from. From Mance I learn A Storm of Swords - Jon I Jon's eyes widened in disbelief. "That can't be so." "It was. When your father learned the king was coming, he sent word to his brother Benjen on the Wall, so he might come down for the feast. There is more commerce between the black brothers and the free folk than you know, and soon enough word came to my ears as well. It was too choice a chance to resist./ From the prologue of DwD I learn that Eastwatch is a trading center. A trading center that trades with wildlings and ships from faraway places. Perchance the area around Eastwatch has bars and brothels that singers traveling from place to place stop in to sing their songs and earn a bit of coin? A Dance with Dragons - Prologue He could not have been more than ten. Haggon traded a dozen strings of amber and a sled piled high with pelts for six skins of wine, a block of salt, and a copper kettle. Eastwatch was a better place to trade than Castle Black; that was where the ships came, laden with goods from the fabled lands beyond the sea. The crows knew Haggon as a hunter and a friend to the Night's Watch, and welcomed the news he brought of life beyond their Wall. Some knew him for a skinchanger too, but no one spoke of that./ Martin is telling a story. I would ask what the Dornishman’s wife song represents ---- A Storm of Swords - Jon I "But what does it matter, for all men must die," the King-beyond-the-Wall said lightly, "and I've tasted the Dornishman's wife. Notice that at the end of Oberyn's remark it says, "The knelling men stood up, and we were free again." A Storm of Swords - Tyrion IX "And?" said Tyrion, waiting. By way of answer Prince Oberyn swirled his wine, and said, "When the Young Dragon conquered Dorne so long ago, he left the Lord of Highgarden to rule us after the Submission of Sunspear. This Tyrell moved with his tail from keep to keep, chasing rebels and making certain that our knees stayed bent. He would arrive in force, take a castle for his own, stay a moon's turn, and ride on to the next castle. It was his custom to turn the lords out of their own chambers and take their beds for himself. One night he found himself beneath a heavy velvet canopy. A sash hung down near the pillows, should he wish to summon a wench. He had a taste for Dornish women, this Lord Tyrell, and who can blame him? So he pulled upon the sash, and when he did the canopy above him split open, and a hundred red scorpions fell down upon his head. His death lit a fire that soon swept across Dorne, undoing all the Young Dragon's victories in a fortnight. The kneeling men stood up, and we were free again."