Winter's Cold

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  1. Arya and Jon's feelings for each other are exactly why that pairing is preferable to Jonsa. If we're going to have a romance, why not between characters who already love each other.
  2. Dontos Hollard. Lancel Lannister. Robert Arryn. All of them are nobles. How does that disprove my point that Sansa looks down on common folk? It's a negative trait that she acquired from Catelyn. Childish squabbling sure. Joffrey tried to murder her sister and she betrays both her sister and mother for him. Later in Storm of Swords, where Sansa is supposed to be in her post brat phase she compares Arya to Margaery and thinks of how unsatisfactory of a sister Arya was. Sana is kind and compassionate? Doesn't seem to be the case for her own family.
  3. She wanted Arya to bow to her as a superior. Being the top lady in the realm was her primary reason for marrying Joffrey. She saw the power and influence Cersei wielded and she wanted to be in her position someday. She also doesn't seem to care much about common folk as shown by her victim blaming of Mycah.
  4. Catelyn isn't dumb. She's just too impulsive and as a result she makes some terrible decisions instead of thinking it through. Sansa isn't dumb. She's just extremely selfish and power hungry. She wants to be Queen, so she betrays her family repeatedly to stay in good graces with Cersei and Joffrey.
  5. What was the point of this season? Jon and Dany get together and the Wall falls?
  6. Sansa fed Ramsay to his own dogs. That's the most brutal execution by a Stark in the show. Is Sansa now a psychopath who deserves to die a miserable death and be forgotten about?
  7. Is Arya supposed to get justice from Cersei, Joffrey, Roose or Ramsay? Kinslayers, backstabbers, adulterers, infant killers, and rapers. Those are the people who have power in Westeros. Arya is justice in comparison.
  8. Arya is most definitely an extrovert. Here's a great post explaining why: Is Arya introverted or extroverted? Extroverted. She’s 100% extroverted. I think anyone who believes otherwise mistakes being reserved in trusting people with her life and being separated from everyone she loves and cares for as introversion. The difference between introverts and extroverts is that introverts feel drained by social interactions and energized by being alone while extroverts have the opposite feelings. Arya has always sought out people to be with and hates being alone. She always does this. Right from the first book, we are introduced to an Arya who thrives off social interaction. “Sometimes it’s fun just to ride along with the wagons and talk to people.” Arya enjoys being with people, she really likes people actually. She’s obsessed with this idea of “pack” because she always wants to have people around her. And they’re not always people she’s known for that long (Syrio, Yoren) nor are they necessarily people who treat her well (Lommy, Jaqen.) But Arya likes being with people. She likes to name and play with her father’s men’s children, likes to listen to people (knights or smallfolk alike) tell stories, she’s interested in that kind of stuff. And it doesn’t stop in recent books. The reason why she enjoys being Cat so much is it’s the first identity that’s really allowed her to meet people and make friends. One of Arya’s issues is that she feels abandoned by everyone she ever cared about- some left her, some became separated from her, and some just died, but she feels abandoned by all of them and all alone. Jaqen was gone, though. He’d left her. Hot Pie left me too, and now Gendry is leaving. Lommy had died, Yoren had died, Syrio Forel had died, even her father had died, and Jaqen had given her a stupid iron penny and vanished. Arya, ASoS Even when she’s in the HoBaW, she can’t get over these feelings of abandonment and betrayal: And one of the reasons why it bothers her so much is that Arya values friends very highly. She’s staunchly protective when it comes to them, thinks of them as equals and valuable, and is hurt when they don’t (in her mind) respond in turn. Loneliness and abandonment are two of the biggest themes in Arya’s narrative because she’s an extrovert. She needs friends, companions, and social contact to feel energized. Having friends as Cat provides her with some of the first bit of comfort she’s had in a while. She goes out of her way to interact with the women of the Happy Port, random sailors, mummers, braavos, everyone. Arya likes people. She really likes them. She attempts to make people who are upset feel better (Elmar Frey, Ned Dayne, Lady Smallwood,) she defends people (Gendry, Mycah, Weasel, Samwell Tarly, Jon,) she shares with them (Sam, Gendry,) she strikes up conversations with everyone (Yoren, the sailors in Braavos,) she risks her life for them (Jaqen, Gendry, Hot Pie,) ect. Arya thrives on interactions with people. She’s an extrovert.
  9. It is murder but too bad the world of Westeros isn't real life. It is a dark world of murder and slaughter. And young kids are not spared from it. Arya cannot fight toe to toe with any adult in the series as she is just an 11 year old child. Thus murdering those she considers her enemies is her only option. She also doesn't have an army. She can't just order people to be butchered and crucified like Dany does. Did you want her to duel Raff, the child murdering sadist and one of the Mountain's men?
  10. Jon doesn't mind Arya using mortal violence to solve problems. He is the one who taught her to "stick them with the pointy end after all" and that phrase was the last thing on Jon's mind when he died. She's not a psychopath but she is a killer as are most characters in the series. Unless you believe that brutality is what makes someone psychopathic, in which case Dany would qualify as psychopathic as well. Besides no matter what she's done or who's she killed, Arya believes that Jon would accept her for it. I trust that she's a better judge of Jon's character than yourself. It's not like he is repulsed by violent and ruthless women as evidenced by his attraction to Ygritte and Val. There are good reasons that Arya and Jon would be attracted to each other romantically and sexually assuming of course that Arya is at least not a pre-teen anymore. Their intense feelings for each other are undeniable and they have strongest sibling bond in the series. Also all of the incest couples in the story and the series' history have been between family members who look alike. Jaime and Cersei, the Targaryens, perhaps Tywin and Joanna as well if you count first cousins as incest. It makes sense after all. Incest is attraction to people with very similar genetic material. It would therefore be strongest between family members who look alike. As such, I don't see any potential bond between Dany and Jon as one that is based on romance. Rather it's far more likely that the match would occur for political reasons. Jon needs Dany and her dragons to fight the white walkers. If Jon's Targaryen heritage is revealed, Jon's and Dany's marriage would resolve any succession disputes. Assuming that Aegon is dead. Perhaps their match would become romantic later like Ned and Catelyn.
  11. Sansa is responsible for Yes, Arya is partly responsible for the acts committed by Rorge and Biter because she was the one who saved them. Their later actions are only possible because of Arya's own actions. Arya's mercy to those monsters was cruelty to the innocent people they hurt. At least she does atone for this mistake by killing Iggo and his band through Nymeria. I don't believe that Arya is a perfect person or character. She is human and makes mistakes as any good character does. I admire Arya for her devotion to her home and her family.
  12. Sansa apologism is the use of lies and mistruths to defend or justify Sansa's actions on the Trident or her decision to tell her father's plans to Cersei. Sansa's actions in going to Cersei harmed not just her, but also Arya and Jeyne Poole as well. She sealed the fate of Arya as a fugitive and Jeyne Poole as prisoner of Littlefinger. She also harmed her father and her family by giving herself as a hostage to Cersei. It was a serious mistake that she has also come to regret making. Martin directly stated that Sansa knew exactly when they were leaving and also the location of Arya. Also all mistakes that drive the plot are "narratively required" mistakes. Does that mean we can't criticize Ned, Robert, Rhaegar, or other characters for their mistakes because they drove the plot? Of course not. Characters are defined by their actions. Whether a character is judged as good, bad, neutral, nice, smart or a myriad of other traits is based on their choices.
  13. I thought you said you had given up arguing with your previous post. Seems not. I suppose your previous statement also applies to yourself. Going back on your own statements is quite Sansa like behavior. No wonder you defend her betrayals of her family as smart decisions. Of course Sansa isn't a monster or a devil like Joffrey, Euron or Ramsay. But she has a common theme of disloyalty to her family. In the first book, she betrays both Arya and Ned to achieve her dream of being queen. Then in the second book, she denounces her family as traitors to survive at court. And in the more recent books she appears to place her and Littlefinger's ambitions over the well being of her cousin Sweetrobin, a seven year old boy. It's this current theme of familial disloyalty that Sansa is consistently criticized for. Not her passivity or her femininity. Her choosing to side against her family isn't smart behavior as evidenced by the fact that it hasn't worked out for her and would never have worked out due to the natures of the people she abandoned her family for. Hopefully, she'll chose to help protect her cousin from Littlefinger in the next book to show that she's learned from her mistakes.
  14. Alright. As long as your Sansa apologism doesn't distract you from the fact that she's one of the most disliked and controversial main characters. You should expect to find many people not agreeing with your opinion on her. No need to get upset about it.
  15. Wrong. Sansa did have a good option. Give up her dream of being Joffrey's Queen and be loyal to her family. Her dreams are not more important than her family members. Why would she want to be the wife of someone abusive like Joffrey anyway. She saw how he treated Mycah. Sansa's decision was not smart. It was foolish and short sighted. She abandoned her family members to curry favor with Cersei and Joffrey. But as you've stated Joffrey already hates her because she saw his true face. Cersei rewarded her silence by demanding that her pet be killed. Her gambit failed because she failed to understand the true natures of the people that she was dealing with. Sansa shows herself to be a liar and a hypocrite. She first states that she didn't know what happened. Then she changes her story when Cersei demands Lady's death. So now that Sansa is at risk of losing her pet, she decides to push all the fault of the incident unto Nymeria and Arya. Not a word about how Joffrey got drunk and assaulted Mycah. This shows her initial claim of not knowing what happened to be a lie. She feels that if she abandons her family even more, perhaps Cersei will take mercy on her. Of course, the end result is that her direwolf is killed and Sansa becomes the only Stark child without a direwolf, the symbol of their house. It makes sense after all. If Sansa wants to be a Lannister/Baratheon so badly, why should she have a direwolf.