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  1. No, Yandel is too stupid to make that one extra leap of logic and suggest the obvious. He doesn't even mention the Empire of Dawn in Westeros at all, and simply thinks it was Valyrians but that that conflicts with Valyria's founding. So assuming he's right about Valyria's founding, then it had to be the GEOTD
  2. What part confuses you? The part about Eddard and his honor and the implausibility of him fathering anyone other than his known kids? Or all the facts laid out after like the conflict in Neds lie? Or the non sense you guys are saying about the prophecy? Or Barristan as a reliable narrator? Or how Brandon died to soon to father any one?
  3. As their seems to be remnants left behind by them and no clear sign of them. Dragons roosted on Battle Isle till the first Hightowers put and end to them. Davos the dragon Slayer Serwyn of the Mirror Shield saving Daeryssa from dragon Urrax. Just to name some. Untill we know that those dragons are literal dragons, it's a possibility, Assuming they are real dragons, who had them? Every one want's to follow hair and eye colors yet Martin has clearly stated youd have better luck following names. Stark, Tallhart (Tall Heart), Wull, are all short and simple names. Lannister, Arryn, Corbray etc. Aegon, Daenerys, Viserys, Etc. Notice anything yet?........No? Ok. Daeryssa......... AE........ only used by Valyria. Should not exist in Westeros back then. I mean there's more i could go with but i think that's enough. People can argue it all they want. People on here still argue whether or not any families actually tie to the Empire of the Dawn of anything. There is evidence though that can be construed as them having a presence in Westeros and possibly being kicked out.
  4. Every thing you said is opinion and i have seen no info that backs your opinion. Again. Let me put it like this. Do explain to me how the prophecy can be full filled by Dany or Jon but not a child of theirs? And what is it about Ned that we apparently know that i havn't stated. About Ned being honorable?????? Cause hooking up with Ashara or any one behind Cat's back ins't honorable and that's exactly what Eddard say's he did. You can come up with stories about him doing it before, but he clearly say's he cheated on her. So yea, write me a theory about how thats true. Oh Ned would lie about when he slept with some one to make him self look worse? Where's the logic in that? If i hear Brandon as an option i may never come back to this forum again. So either Eddard cheated with Wylla or Ashara on Cat. Cause that's the only other option based on the text. Cause Jon was born to early in the year for Eddard to have fathered him. And that's literally the only father the book presents other than making some logical leaps for Rhaegar. Yet if Rhaegar is the father of Jon and that's the child that Eddard got from the Tower of Joy, then what's up with Ashara's baby that Eddard is accused of stealing? The one we dont hear anything else about till the 5th book when unreliable Barristan claims the child had been still born.I have sat and listened to every one and their thoughts, yet no one can give me a clear explanation around these facts in the book. So what bread crumbs and out come are you alluding to? Doubt me? Seriously go back and look. Look at all the quotes ive already structured. Im not done yet, but i've already posted enough that should squash Brandon, and Eddard has said enough along with the other facts to squash the rest. Every thing else is just wishful thinking. Only these options exist. Jon is the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna Dany is the Child of Aerys and Rhaella Dany is the child of Aerys and Ashara Dany is the child of Rhaegar and Ashara. Literally only possibilities there is. Non-existent possibilities. Wylla, Ashara, or Fisherman's daughter and Eddard= either Dany or Jon Ashara and Brandon= Dany or Jon Arguing for either of those is clearly ignoring the clues and going with wishful thinking IMO
  5. Yea i think we definitely see eye to eye on most things
  6. Ok, so i've structured some of the quotes around the Tower of Joy and still have some more to do for the actual war, and some quotes from the comment section mentioned that help show some of what's happening will be included. Still much to do to show every thing and cover all debates brought up but im creeping closer. After i fully structure the narrative through quotes, ill go through and write in all the important notes elaborating what im trying to explain through the quotes. Ill try and do that part all at once to save any confusion to people popping in and out of the thread. That being said. Nothing of my theory or OP has been redacted or changed. Everything is simply growing to accommodate all arguments and points to construct the most thorough thread i can covering the subject. I appreciate any and all interested and still following and especially all those who have taken the time to comment with their opinions. Even if they all are against me hahaha
  7. What she said v and that's pretty funny, i like the link though. Drunk buggers
  8. Well certain aspects sound similar but different and possibly not the same. Similarly the Grey plague sounds similar but different. As far as the frigid desert. Maybe, the cold lands in Westeros dont extend that far south though. And the Long Night only came as far south as the joining of the Selhoru on the Rhoyne. That would mean the cold during the long night stopped around Stygai and Asshai. If i were to venture the thing happening out there was the dragons creation possibly to fight the Long Night, or that's what tipped the CotF into getting drastic and creating the Others. I definitely think the grey waste and Asshai are associated with scary ooggily boogilies, but i associate them more with the Fire side of things. The frigid desert just sounds like a high desert. This tripped me out when i moved from Alaska to Vegas and woke up to snow one morning and discovered their cold winter night's compared to the friggin hot days and extremely hot summers haha That's just my take on the evidence though
  9. Maybe. Cersei and Robert did wed in 284. You may have an argument on your hands if you can find some text stuff to help set up the scenario
  10. Where are you going with your idea though? Does this connect to Dany and Jon or does this tie to other people? like other possible dragon seeds and such? If so, as far as Elia idk. You may wanna look around the Martel line closely though. Doran's mother being a lady in waiting to Rhaella, you know, the ones Aery's like to rape? Elia and Rhaegar obviously. Any possible tie or implication between Daenerys and Daemon Blackfyre. There is a good chance House Martell has dragon blood in their line given the Daenerys and Maron marriage at least. Plus the other two possibilities. I often wonder what was up with the love between Daenerys and Daemon, specially given the long amount of time between her marriage and when he rebelled. Making me wonder at any possibility they were able keep it going while she was married, at least up to a point. Closer to when he rebelled. Or if it really is just unrelated and people like to connect them to romanticize Daemon and his rebellion.
  11. Not if the Long Night fell in Westeros from the North, and members of the Empire of the Dawn possibly expelled from Westeros as the text seems to imply, may have carried all these legends back to the lands in the East. All we can tell about the east is that dark magic was practiced there and that there is an area similar in that its a sort of dead lands where scary things exist. No evidence to say the Others ever walked in Essos. Just that the Winter effected them.
  12. Hmm, can't say i've ever heard Robert as a potential candidate. Interesting. Though i dont know why Eddard would hide his own kid from Robert. Even if Robert was indifferent to his bastards
  13. I seldom look to the wiki for anything. There's websites if you wanna pull quotes for anything from the books. it's pretty easy. The whole point of that was to illustrate that multiple Targs have hooked up with people who have dark or brown hair that has played out differently among there children. Once even producing brown haired dragon riders. This all to the question of Jon's hair being brown and why.
  14. Well the Tudor bit is a poor literal translation, i just meant the idea and like how they did with the sigils. The Tudors claim was actually through a legitimized bastard if im not mistaken
  15. That's literally all the purpose of that passage is. To show that they misinterpreted it slightly and that it is still full filled and though the line(s) of Aerys and Rhaella. This is just some weird side tangent people are on that i dont understand. Im suggesting the PTWP is not Dany or Jon, but their child. That detail is covered further is my other threads though as this one ends with their time in hiding....... As to the unreliable narrator bit was every bodies tangent on Line or lines (which literally changes nothinggggggg) and me simply arguing to argue that he still could've been misquoting and that Barristan is less that reliable for information on anything and proven by the text and the author that every one clings to so hard. Again with clinging to things. Well Jon being the child of Rhaegar and Lyanna is "not impossible" but as it's not clearly stated in the text i guess i should just rule that out. I dont get that logic, cause when you flip it, it looks ridiculous. The books literally only suggest Eddard and either the Fisher man's daughter, Wylla (which Eddard clearly say's it is so i guess we clearlyyyyyyy need to go by it), and Ashara Dayne. ( based on Jealous paranoid Cat and Cersei's hear say.). Well the Fisher man's daughter claims Eddard got her with child too so i guess Eddard has 3 babies momma's as clearlllyyyyyyyy stated by the text............