Iron Mother

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About Iron Mother

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    Ice and Fire History

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  1. *this might be an appropriate place for this thread?* It has been mentioned in passing even in the show I think but at least 3 times in the books that Cercei is sending fabulous "tapestries" to the Eyrie to Littlefinger from the King's Landing castle. I cannot think of a logical reason for either one of them to do this or it to be just what it seems. And why would it even be mentioned at all? Maybe it means nothing, but does anyone see an underlying "something" with that? It can't be to replace the tapestry from Sweet Robyn's flying porridge spoon...
  2. im almost positive there was one referenced in the show. but, how can this thread be moved there, and which specific location are you saying? thanks
  3. It has been mentioned in passing even in the show I think but at least 3 times in the books that Cercei is sending fabulous "tapestries" to the Eyrie from the King's Landing castle. I cannot think of a logical reason for either one of them for it to be just what it seems. Maybe it means nothing, but does anyone see an underlying "something" with that? It can't be to replace the tapestry from Sweet Robyn's flying porridge spoon...
  4. YAY to that most eloquent post. I wont spoil you since you are on book 1... but I have a feeling the Littlefinger of the book will meet all those expectations and more. My feeling is his role will be played down on the show due to lack of time and unforgivable changes to other awesome characters btw, I too love a character who is almost a complete mystery while being a MAJOR player at the same time.
  5. ok up the ante and say BOOK ONLY character (just one and why) ain't it fun?
  6. Bran will provide mystical knowledge that will help overcome the ultimate threat to all people in westeros. Having said that, do you see the mega possibilities of Sam in the Citadel? Learning all kinds of needed knowledge that will (like Bran) be heroic in a way that isn't the fighter himself but searches for and finds knowledge that is not mystical (or may be) but in a different way than Bran. I had not thought of that until a re-watch and FINALLY my brain latched onto why the Sam story has gone on so far when at times I thought it should die. There will be multiple heroes on different levels I think. I guess I made this thread for people to say who was their favorite character in the series...as in maybe to whom they related to that much or admired. I could easily choose Arya because of her personal journey ALONE growing from a very young girl to a woman through many, many trials and tribulations. Like, to me it wouldn't matter if she turns out on the "darkside" or whatever. It's her character's journey and what led her to where and who she is in the present.
  7. Oberyn Martell is on par with Rhaegar Targaryen. I would have chosen Rhaegar but he doesn't appear in the show or the books except through 3rd person. The only difference (which makes Oberyn even better) Oberyn cares NOT about what anyone thinks of his sexuality and fathers bastards from all over the world - only to collect them, bring them to Dorne and instruct them in all things Oberyn. He's a great warrior who explored the world and fought with different Companies, he writes poetry, milks vipers, studied at the Citadel and acquired links for a chain. He's incredibly diverse, cunning, witty, intelligent and he tells it like it is (he explained to Tyrion what Tyrion was REALLY like when born - as opposed to the bilge Cercei has been telling for years). During the fight, he looks Tywin right in his face while addressing the Mountain about who ordered him to kill Elia and the children. He fears nothing. Not only would he not care if someone spoke ill of his bi-sexuality but I bet most men wouldn't even bother to say it because he's a rough MF whom they know could put them down right quick. He makes bi-sexuality cool almost. That's hard to do in Westeros, since the endless jokes about Renly never stopped and he was in the running for KING. Loras was a warrior too but he himself said "everyone knows anyway" and they made endless jokes at his expense. Rhaegar - from the alternate views of others - is very similar. Very diverse, a warrior, a creative soul - and Oberyn while whored the world, Rhaegar lived in the spirit of that by choosing Lyanna and possibly marrying her in the Old God tradition (don't scream at me, it's a theory that has been around for a while and makes sense) and fathered her child. Meaning, he did whatever the F he wanted. And the whole "singing to the sparrows" and giving away the money, it's the same spirit of IDGAF. In the book chapter "The Watcher" Tyene Sand (one of the sand snakes) is going to be sent to the Sept (her mother was a Septa and taught her their ways) to spy from there while Nymeria (the blood of Old Volantis) is being sent to the Small Council.... both as a part of Prince Doran's plan to take down the Lannisters. And Obara is being sent to kind Darkstar to kill him for harming Myrcella to cover up their lie (due to Arianne's errant plan). These women are quick, smart and dangerous as hell because their father, Oberyn, taught them his ways. So even in death, The Red Viper lives on That's a legacy.
  8. one person lol maybe with an explanation why you feel that way
  9. personally I love the Dorne element (Arianne and Faekgon, etc in WoW) I think other than The North, it's the most interesting thing going on. It's everyone's opinion. I only know Cercei and Jamie are dead to me, yet, their wombed romance and lives of sin drone on and on. I only messed with the idea of if the book does something so radical from the show, it would be very lame. And no one could predict past just prior to the coming WoW because it was only in GRRs mind. Maybe the best example is Arya... her story was way different in the book than what they are doing in the show. They're just cramming it based on "character recognition" and tying up the plots of the existing characters who have been on the show for a long time and are well-liked by the audience. Arya's story is really deep and requires lots of kind of "meta" themes. In the show it was so beyond basic. As in "Mercy" representing Arya choosing to not kill her. duh but confrontation with "faewaif" must be had so she is forced to choose to return to Westeros - somehow at the joy of Jaqen. The book was taking Arya to cool places, the show chose common gore and Sweeny Todd callbacks (which were originally Shakespeare) of bodies in pies. Everything Dorne in the books (except Quentyn what a waste) is awesome. The sand snakes, all Arianne's friends, Areo Hotar, all of it. The books barely feature Elaria which is more real than her ruling Dorne. And Tyienne isn't even her daughter. But in the show, Cercei will kill Elaria's non-daughter in front of her in revenge for Myrcella. If I can predict it, then it shouldn't be. In the book chapter "The Watcher", one of the sand snakes was going to be on the Small Council and another was going to be secretly in The Sept (the one that has not exploded) and they were going to work from within to ruin House Lannister. And the show gives us what it has? And people don't think Dorne would not be a really cool element? And the fact Arianne was hooking up with Connington I think just brings in an element nobody wants to talk about. But Dorne's heir to the throne is in peril going to Storm's End in WoW chapters... to me, that's a lot of setup for a japed Fakegon. WoW
  10. So, I try to imagine how this worked out or happened.... did they have a board meeting with GRR and probe him on generalities of the end of his story as would eventually appear in his books? Did the show even try to get some form of "summation" from Martin about HIS end so they could complete a (by comparison) a quick and dirty version in the TV show? I found it very odd and interesting that in the released chapters of Winds of Winter, there are 2 Arianne chapters that go even further into the Jon Connington/Aegon plot. This plot device has been scorned perhaps universally by book readers... except, when I saw those 2 chapters, it told me there was going to be a huge difference of direction between book and TV. Arianne never made it into the TV show, neither did Connigton or Aegon or any of their crew. Before I go on, based on those chapters, I find it so bizarre that there is apparently no one inhabiting Storm's End -- rather, no heirs to Robert in any form (Stannis and Renly were IT?) - and Connington goes up from Griffin's Roost and basically just takes it for their cause. The TV show cut off Prince Doran and his plots put into motion over years (to marry Arianne to Viscerys to sending Quentyn (who?) to go try to marry Daenerys. The fact Arianne is going to ascertain the Connington Crew is completely different than the TV show........ and there are many other things. So again, I wonder if anyone knows HOW or in what way GRR "guided" the show's end (if at all) to make it line up with the end in his head even if in vague ways that wouldn't give away too much of the "real" story yet to be unfolded in his coming books. Lastly, I had a thought that could it be Jon being the son of Rhaegar is not even where the books were/are going? In terms of another Targaryen. Could it be the Connington Crew and Young Griff were to fulfill that role? Please be polite in answering this... some people hate that anyone talks about "Fakegon" but with these new chapters focusing on them... AND that Arianne (the heir to Dorne!) is going up to ally with them AND they have taken Storrm's End, AND AND Tyrion spent time with them and basically convinced Aegon not to on his knees to Daenerys but to land in Dorne and then she would come to him.... it's a little much to be a rouse. Bringing it home, what does anyone think about what went on if Martin guided the show to its end or not (even in generalities). To me it seems unlikely because for example WHAT if Sansa is going to die in the books? Yet on TV they have her overcoming the Boltons and allied/with Jon, etc... the show moved a lot of pieces around. They either had to have guidance they could fix it when the time came OR they just said "ok from now on we are going to do whatever WE THINK would happen". And that doesn't make sense either because I do not believe the show writers could - out of thin air - create a really dynamic ending to the story without knowing even bare bones of specific plot lines.
  11. that was improper
  12. no
  13. I am now worried my belief must be suspended in that screen-time was spent "proving" Tyrion is Dragon #3 because he went into the crypt to unchain them and they purred, yet Quentyn (Dorne have wed with Targaryens for centuries yet no similar boast for Lannisters) and Quentyn was burnt up. As long as the Hollywood Sign lives, so does suspended disbelief. sidenote: the movie "2012" (2012) has just ceased to exist because it portrays the Hollywood Sign blown away by tornadoes.
  14. Hello friends, I was on youtube and found Song of Ice and Fire: Complete History and Lore it's a semi-animated story narrated by the characters from the show. But goes back very far into the children and Andals and the beginnings of Westeros. Anyone know of similar things on youtube or otherwise? I'm looking for things that tell intricate details of the story in a less bland but still interesting way than World of Ice and Fire. Also, what even is the thing I found? Does it come from a video game? Thanks if anyone knows