Nittanian
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F&B Jaehaerys and Alysanne - Their Triumphs and Tragedies
Thousands of years before the Conquest, when the Kings of Winter still reigned in the North, Brandon the Shipwright had built an entire fleet of ships to cross the Sunset Sea. He took them west himself, never to return. His son and heir, another Brandon, burned the yards where they were built, and was known as Brandon the Burner forevermore. A thousand years later, ironmen sailing out from Great Wyk were blown off course onto a cluster of rocky islands eight days' sail to the northwest of any known shore. Their captain built a tower and a beacon there, took the name of Farwynd, and called his seat the Lonely Light. His descendants lived there still, clinging to rocks where seals outnumbered men fifty to one. Even the other ironmen considered the Farwynds mad; some named them selkies.
Is this indicating that the Farwynds of the Lonely Light are the founding branch of the family? Right now, the wiki has House Farwynd (for the Sealskin Point branch) and House Farwynd of the Lonely Light (for the western branch). We could follow the House Flint example and move the current "House Farwynd" to "House Farwynd of Sealskin Point".
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18 hours ago, Ran said:
Give it a try now.
Works good, thanks!
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Other pages are loading and saving fine, but I'm not able to preview any edits for "Varys". On different computers and browsers I'm seeing this error message:
Quote403
Forbidden
Access to this resource on the server is denied!
Proudly powered by LiteSpeed Web ServerPlease be advised that LiteSpeed Technologies Inc. is not a web hosting company and, as such, has no control over content found on this site.
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On 3/18/2024 at 3:20 AM, Ran said:
Okay, folks, so far I've seen no issues and the server is now steady, so I think we're fine to say that you can now work on this wiki. Do let me know if there are any issues with things like uploading images, getting thumbnails made, etc.
When saving edits this week, I have sometimes received a "500 Internal Server Error" message stating:
QuoteRequest Timeout
This request takes too long to process, it is timed out by the server. If it should not be timed out, please contact administrator of this web site to increase 'Connection Timeout'.
The edits have been saving despite the error message, fortunately, and the error message isn't appearing every time.
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Same 431 message for me with desktop Chrome but not mobile Safari
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Ser Bartimus also follows the old gods. He was rewarded with the Wolf's Den for having saved Wyman's life at the Trident, though we don't know if he was already a knight by then.
Quote"Then a long cruel winter fell," said Ser Bartimus. "The White Knife froze hard, and even the firth was icing up. The winds came howling from the north and drove them slavers inside to huddle round their fires, and whilst they warmed themselves the new king come down on them. Brandon Stark this was, Edrick Snowbeard's great-grandson, him that men called Ice Eyes. He took the Wolf's Den back, stripped the slavers naked, and gave them to the slaves he'd found chained up in the dungeons. It's said they hung their entrails in the branches of the heart tree, as an offering to the gods. The old gods, not these new ones from the south. Your Seven don't know winter, and winter don't know them."
Davos could not argue with the truth of that. From what he had seen at Eastwatch-by-the-Sea, he did not care to know winter either. "What gods do you keep?" he asked the one-legged knight.
"The old ones." When Ser Bartimus grinned, he looked just like a skull. "Me and mine were here before the Manderlys. Like as not, my own forebears strung those entrails through the tree."
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21 hours ago, Thomaerys Velaryon said:
It seems that Answer 2 is the correct one. But Answer 1 could still be correct too, thoughts ?
I'm thinking that #2 is correct as well.
Regarding the Farwyds, the Damphair thinks,
QuoteAeron knew some Farwynds, a queer folk who held lands on the westernmost shores of Great Wyk and the scattered isles beyond, rocks so small that most could support but a single household. Of those, the Lonely Light was the most distant, eight days' sail to the northwest amongst rookeries of seals and sea lions and the boundless grey oceans.
The Map of the Iron Islands in TWOIAF has "Sealskin Point" written above the northern shore of Great Wyk. Do we think this is referring to the large peninsula making up the north of the isle, or the smaller peninsula jutting from its northwest? The latter makes more sense to me considering Aeron's thoughts.
Also, which would be preferred as a location map for places in the Iron Islands?
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/File:Location_map_Iron_Islands.svg - includes the Lonely Light, but has fewer details
https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/File:Iron_Islands.jpg - greater detail, but lacks the Lonely Light and has some misspellings
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Other instances of Unsullied using longer spears:
Quote"Since that day, the city guard of Qohor has been made up solely of Unsullied, every one of whom carries a tall spear from which hangs a braid of human hair." (ASOS Daenerys I)
QuoteThree hundred yards away, Astapor's new Unsullied had been pouring through their gates and forming up in ranks beneath their city's crumbling red brick walls, dawn light glinting off their spiked bronze helmets and the points of their long spears. (ADWD The Windblown)
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21 hours ago, Potsk said:
I think the difference is that "Barrow Kings" refers to the unnamed dynasty (therefore the article title should be plural) while "King of the First Men" is the title they held. Merging them would be like merging "House Gardener" and "King of the Reach."
That makes sense, thanks!
Regarding Bear Island, Yandel writes:
QuoteThe histories of the North claim that Rodrik Stark won Bear Island back from the ironborn in a wrestling match, and perhaps there is truth to this tale; the kings of the Iron Isles were often moved to prove their prowess and their right to wear the driftwood crown with feats of strength. More sober scholars call this into question, suggesting that if there was "wrestling," it was with words.
@Ran, does this mean the island's status was resolved diplomatically ("with words") or should it be "with swords" (thus resolved militarily)?
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Yandel writes, "More historical proof exists for the war between the Kings of Winter and the Barrow Kings to their south, who styled themselves the Kings of the First Men and claimed supremacy over all First Men everywhere, even the Starks themselves."
We currently have separate articles for "Barrow King" and "King of the First Men". Since they cover the same topic and the latter is essentially a stub, we could just have "King of the First Men" redirect to "Barrow King".
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1 hour ago, Ran said:
Anyone able to reach the wiki at the moment? Suddenly got a message of bad health and trying to figure what's going on. Reached out to Sparks about it but it's early on the West coast yet.
Nope, connection timed out for me.
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Also regarding Brandon the Builder, his article uses the monarch infobox and lists him as as a King of Winter. His descendants were the Kings of Winter, but is he himself ever referred to as a king?
QuoteAGOT Appendix
The Starks trace their descent from Brandon the Builder and the ancient Kings of Winter. For thousands of years they ruled from Winterfell as Kings in the North, until Torrhen Stark, the King Who Knelt, chose to swear fealty to Aegon the Dragon rather than give battle. Their blazon is a grey direwolf on an ice-white field. The Stark words are Winter Is Coming.
QuoteTWOIAF The North: Winterfell
The greatest castle of the North is Winterfell, the seat of the Starks since the Dawn Age [sic instead of the Age of Heroes?]. Legend says that Brandon the Builder raised Winterfell after the generation-long winter known as the Long Night to become the stronghold of his descendants, the Kings of Winter. As Brandon the Builder is connected with an improbable number of great works (Storm's End and the Wall, to name but two prominent examples) over a span of numerous lifetimes, the tales have likely turned some ancient king, or a number of different kings of House Stark (for there have been many Brandons in the long reign of that family) into something more legendary.
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The founder of House Stark is currently at "Brandon Stark (Builder)", but has GRRM ever called him by that name? From what I can tell, he's referred to as "Bran the Builder" or "Brandon the Builder". Lann is at "Lann the Clever" instead of "Lann Lannister", for instance, and Durran is at "Durran Godsgrief" instead of "Durran Durrandon (Godsgrief)".
Also, we should mention the "Age of the Hundred Kingdoms" in the "Timeline of major events", right?
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https://awoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/Years_before_Aegon's_Conquest
This page lists the prominent deaths from Aegon's Conquest with 2 BC, but do we know they all occurred in that year?
TWOIAF and FAB explain:
QuoteThe maesters of the Citadel who keep the histories of Westeros have used Aegon's Conquest as their touchstone for the past three hundred years. Births, deaths, battles, and other events are dated either AC (After the Conquest) or BC (Before the Conquest).
True scholars know that such dating is far from precise. Aegon Targaryen's conquest of the Seven Kingdoms did not take place in a single day. More than two years passed between Aegon's landing and his Oldtown coronation...and even then the Conquest remained incomplete since Dorne remained unsubdued. Sporadic attempts to bring the Dornishmen into the realm continued all through King Aegon's reign and well into the reigns of his sons, making it impossible to fix a precise end date for the Wars of Conquest.
Even the start date is a matter of some misconception. Many assume, wrongly, that the reign of King Aegon I Targaryen began on the day he landed at the mouth of the Blackwater Rush, beneath the three hills where the city of King's Landing would eventually stand. Not so. The day of Aegon's Landing was celebrated by the king and his descendants, but the Conqueror actually dated the start of his reign from the day he was crowned and anointed in the Starry Sept of Oldtown by the High Septon of the Faith. This coronation took place two years after Aegon's Landing, well after all three of the major battles of the Wars of Conquest had been fought and won. Thus it can be seen that most of Aegon's actual conquering took place from 2-1 BC, Before the Conquest.
While events earlier in the Conquest (like the burning of Harrenhal, for instance) most likely occurred in 2 BC, would it be better to give a range like 2 BC-1 AC for relevant articles if we don't know for certain?
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6 hours ago, astarkchoice said:
Ironborn:slave labour and a scummy raiding culture allows all their free men to be potentinaly professionals
GRRM did say:
Quotehttps://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/1001
The ironborn come from a culture with a very strong warrior tradition -- much more so than mainland Westeros. The rest of the Seven Kingdoms have a warrior caste (the knights) on top of a larger base of peasants, farmers, craftsmen, merchants, etc. The "Old Way" of the islands encouraged almost all men (and some women, like Asha) to take up raiding, at least if they were young and healthy.
additionally,
Quotehttps://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/1174
What is the relative composition of archers (or horse-archers), infantry and cavalry?
Infantry outnumbered cavalry by a considerable margin, but for the most part we are talking about feudal levies and peasant militia, with little discipline and less training. Although some lords do better than others. Tywin Lannister's infantry was notoriously well disciplined, and the City Watch of Lannisport is well trained as well... much better than their counterparts in Oldtown and King's Landing.
Will they be able to support their armies with larger groups of archers (say, thousands of archers) in an effort to withstand or prevent attacks from flying dragons?
If they can find thousands of archers... depends on the season, of course...
and
QuoteAGOT Catelyn VIII
This host her son had assembled was not a standing army such as the Free Cities were accustomed to maintain, nor a force of guardsmen paid in coin. Most of them were smallfolk: crofters, fieldhands, fishermen, sheepherders, the sons of innkeeps and traders and tanners, leavened with a smattering of sellswords and freeriders hungry for plunder. When their lords called, they came … but not forever.
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On 12/13/2023 at 4:25 PM, Loraq said:
"According to a semi-canon source, the hills are located within the dominion of House Manderly, and Hornwood [this link should redirect to the seat of House Hornwood, also called Hornwood, and not to the page of the House itself, as it currently redirects], the seat of House Hornwood, is located near the northwestern edge of the hills."
Corrected!
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There used to be a thread in the TWOIAF subforum to discuss the AWOIAF app, but I can't find it anymore.
The entry for "Bay of Ice" states, "The First Flints fish the shores of the Bay of Ice, and they and the people of Bear Island have suffered many raids by the ironmen over the years." This should be the Wulls instead of the Flints.
Quote"There's people," Bran told her. "The Umbers are mostly east of the kingsroad, but they graze their sheep in the high meadows in summer. There are Wulls west of the mountains along the Bay of Ice, Harclays back behind us in the hills, and Knotts and Liddles and Norreys and even some Flints up here in the high places." (ASOS Bran II)
QuoteThe mightiest of the Northern clans are the Wulls, the fisherfolk who dwell along the shores of the Bay of Ice. Their hatred of the wildlings is matched only by their hatred of the men of the Iron Islands, who have often raided along the shore of the bay, burning their halls, carrying off their crops, and taking their wives and daughters as thralls and salt wives. (TWOIAF The Mountain Clans)
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Steffon Darklyn
QuoteAegon II had suffered his first defections the night before, when Ser Steffon Darklyn of the Kingsguard had slipped from the city with his squire [Harrold Darke], two stewards, and four guardsmen (FAB The Blacks and the Greens)
Meryn Trant
QuoteACOK Sansa I
At a signal from the master of revels, the combatants couched their lances and put their spurs to their mounts. There were shouts from the watching guardsmen and the lords and ladies in the gallery. The knights came together in the center of the yard with a great shock of wood and steel. The white lance and the striped one exploded in splinters within a second of each other. Hobber Redwyne reeled at the impact, yet somehow managed to keep his seat. Wheeling their horses about at the far end of the lists, the knights tossed down their broken lances and accepted replacements from the squires. Ser Horas Redwyne, Ser Hobber's twin, shouted encouragement to his brother.
But on their second pass Ser Meryn swung the point of his lance to strike Ser Hobber in the chest, driving him from the saddle to crash resoundingly to the earth. Ser Horas cursed and ran out to help his battered brother from the field.
Jaime Lannister
QuoteJosmyn Peckledon held the palfrey's reins as Ser Jaime mounted. The squire was skinny as a spear, with long arms and legs, greasy mouse-brown hair, and cheeks soft with peach fuzz. His cloak was Lannister crimson, but his surcoat showed the ten purple mullets of his own House arrayed upon a yellow field. (AFFC Jaime III)
and
QuoteJaime glanced at his two younger squires, who were hovering near the braziers pretending not to listen. Lewys Piper and Garrett Paege were both the sons of river lords. He had grown fond of both of them and would hate to have to give them to Ser Ilyn. (AFFC Jaime V)
Balon
QuoteSer Balon's journey had been shorter but troubling in its own way, the captain knew. Three knights, eight squires, twenty men-at-arms, and sundry grooms and servants had accompanied him from King's Landing, but once they crossed the mountains into Dorne their progress had been slowed by a round of feasts, hunts, and celebrations at every castle that they chanced to pass. (ADWD The Watcher)
- kissdbyfire and Willam Stark
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18 hours ago, James Steller said:
No, I don’t think that’s accurate. How could Tywin would have known when Stannis would attack King’s Landing? He would have had to know everything the readers know, and the readers themselves were surprised by Stannis’ shadowbaby plan to take over Renly’s army and kill Cortnay Penrose. Tywin must have figured that he’d have weeks while Stannis besieged Storm’s End. Nobody could have guessed that the castle would fall that quickly.
Right, here's GRRM discussing the situation:
Quotehttps://www.westeros.org/Citadel/SSM/Entry/1044
Tyrion reflected that his father should have been able to defeat Robb in the west before Stannis could have taken Storm's End. Wasn't this move a great risk though, since Stannis could have abandoned Storm's End at any time, in order to strike against King's Landing and the Lannister claimants to the throne while Tywin was occupied in the west?
Storm's End is a hugely formidable castle, and should have been able to hold out much longer, as it did during Robert's Rebellion when Stannis was inside rather than outside. And both Tyrion and Tywin knew that Stannis was a methodical commander rather than a daring one, and therefore would be unlikely to leave an enemy stronghold untaken in his rear. There was also the psychological aspect, as Stannis himself explains to Davos; he could not risk being seen as having suffered a "defeat," however minor.
Was Lord Tywin marching west a huge risk? Of course it was. That was why he sat at Harrenhal for so long, hoping to lure Robb into attacking him... or Stannis into committing against King's Landing. Neither of his foes would play into his hands, however. At which point he made a calculated gamble.
In a three-sided struggle (four sided when Renly was still in the game), any decisive move is a risk... as I learned in high school playing... yes... RISK! But the only way to win is to take some of this risks.
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47 minutes ago, Ran said:
Try now. Seems to be working for me after a restart. You may need to try unchecking the "Remember my login" option for some reason.
Yep, I was able to log back in and also save an edit which included an external SSM link. Thanks!
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On 7/9/2023 at 9:31 AM, Ran said:
Try now? Looked like a session cache got filled up and needed to be reset. I managed to get the error then after the restart was able to login.
Could this have happened again? I'm having the same situation which happened to Mindset.
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I created articles for septas and septons in case if anyone wants to expand / rearrange.
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Thank you!
The ASOIAF wiki thread
in Wiki of Ice and Fire
Posted
I created a new article for "Alchemy" since there are more types of alchemists than just the fire-focused guild in King's Landing.
"Pyromancers" currently redirects to "Alchemists' Guild" (since most references to pyromancers in the books are to the KL guild), and we also have an article for "Firemage" (only referencing the mage briefly seen by Dany in Qarth).
Melisandre differentiates between alchemists and pyromancers:
Yandel does as well:
Hallyne's pyromancers encountered by Tyrion just seem to be concerned with wildfire, but pyromancers at Joffrey's wedding are able to manipulate fire.
Not all alchemists are pyromancers, and I don't think we can say that all pyromancers are members of the Alchemists' Guild. Might it be better to have an article titled "Pyromancers" (or "Pyromancy", though I don't think GRRM has used that specific word yet) to differentiate pyromancers/firemages as a general concept from the Alchemists' Guild in KL?