Ice Turtle

  • Content count

  • Joined

  • Last visited


About Ice Turtle

  • Rank
    ... and something unimaginative
  1. If I understand you correctly, you seem to suggest that being like Sansa and Margaery (as you understand her) is the only way for a woman to be successful in political world of Westeros. Yet you mentioned Lady Olenna too, a woman who is famous for being far from courteous or kind. Still, she is generally considered one the most successful political players and I have never actually seen anyone questioning her ability to function among Westerosi nobility. She is not the only one. Asha Greyjoy, Lady Dustin, Lady Mormont, Miranda Royce aren't exactly the hearts of courtesy and gentle manners either.
  2. The original crown was most likely prepared beforehand by those who organised the tourney, it was likely not the crown Lyanna got. while usually it would be uncommon and rude to use the crown prepared by winner, Rhaegar Targaryen was bloody Rhaegar Targaryen, no one aside of Aerys was likely to tell him no. And Aerys almost surely didn't know or didn't care. What I think we can read between the lines of the text is the time when Rhaegar decided to win the tourney, IMO it was after he learned Lyanna was KOTL. That would suggest that the roses were planned at most ?1-2 days beforehand. Now I think the in the story winter roses are very symbolic and connected to North/Old Gods/magic. There are few places with similar connection, Winterfell is one of them but so is The Isle of Faces. If I had to bet on one place near Harrenhall where magical blue roses would grow it would be there. Whatever Rhaegar went there personally or Howland was more involved than we thought is harder to tell.
  3. There is a meta level to that. Ygritte says it because Jon knows nothing about wildling world a knows little about girls. GRRM, IMO, writes it as a meta joke. Jon Snow, knows nothing, because likely he doesn't even know is own true name.
  4. This most of all. As a less important I would add connections between more important characters. For example Jon has a very specific and likely plot relevant connection to Daenery, Tyrion and all the Starks, but the ties between Daenerys or Tyrion and Stark children are generally less important. Which makes Jon a more central character in my book.
  5. I don't think that Rickon will turn out to the Shaggy Dog at the scale of entire series, but IMO he will turn out to be a somehow irrelevant conclusion of Davos' TWoW quest. That is not something so hard too see. Davos is searching for Rickon to help Stannis's cause and in the end after finally "succeeding" he might only find that Stannis is dead or that Manderly played him false because he send him to find his liege lord but his true liege lord is Bran, so even when Davos turn out with Rickon the contract won't be fulfilled. Why I think that Rickon will die is because he is red herring when it comes to Stark inheritance. He is able bodied, true-born male but I think that unclear situation when the all left claimants are cripbles, bastards and girls is more GRRM style.
  6. I think that it's not only a choice between Winterfell and Kings Landing the most likely option is that Arya will spend the whole season 7 in the Riverlands. But aside of that I still think the North is more likely than KL, though as always it is hard to tell with the show.
  7. Knowledge is power. If Mance ever grasped that literacy would give him some amount of power, he likely took initiative and found someone to teach him. He is described as an able and ambitious man, the best one the Watch was able to produce. From the plot and character perspective neither option (Mance being literate / illiterate ) would be odd and there is a chance that we will never learn for sure.
  8. 1, Lannister - on the outside they rule most of the Westeros 2, Tyrell - They have food, armies and gold 3, Targaryen - they have three dragons but only one known member who is temporarily exiled from her centre of power 4, Blackfyre - if fAegon and Varys are truly team Backfyre 5, Baelish - Littlefinger in one way or another control two regions and have control over the supposed heir of the North 6, Hightower - if they have any control over Citadel 7, Greyjoy - They are heading to alliance with Dany and Euron himself is likely one of the most dangerous men of ASOIAF world 8, Martell - They control the whole region and have ties to forthcoming Targ restoration 9, Arryn - Sweetrobin is s child who everyone expect to die, power of this house is only on the paper for a moment 10, Stark - as a wildcard Westeros is not aware of. Between Sansa, Arya and Bran with their blood right to places like North and Riverlands, their connections (BwB, Riverlands, Children of Forest) magical powers and inside knowledge from the readers' perspective they count even now as one of the most powerful houses I don't think Freys or Boltons should belong to this list as they have neither control over even one whole region and have no power over other parts of the kingdom. Redwynes and Manderlys with their fleets/ scheme to get hold of Rickon would be closer calls.
  9. I don't know why people claim that Jon/Arya are based solely on the outline. Granted there weren't many threads before that but if you open the existing ones any reasonable person will quickly understand why. This forum is something we do for enjoyment and it's not very enjoyable when instead of arguments based on text the only answers are strongly negative opinions based solely on personal feelings, name calling and emoticons. I know what GRRM said, but I am starting to think that he talked himself into corner. Newstar had pointed in another thread that he is contradicting himself when it comes to other interviews, OP is right that a lot of outline actually did happen even if little altered and I would add that if lines that were foreshadowed even in later books can change ASOIF are much more shallow and flimsily written books than we though at first and even the best theories on this forum are worth nothing, because GRRM can simply change his mind and ignore parts of the future story that are already rooted in text. For now, I refuse to take that as my opinion. More to the OP, I don't think resurrected Jon would forget Arya. She was one of his last thoughts. That would be like Lady Stoneheart forgetting Robb and her daughters. There is another more likely possibility for Jon to be attracted to Arya without knowing who she is - glamor. Though I am not saying even that will likely happen. IMO most likely if GRRM goes there he will go there full force so he won't it make easier for the characters.
  10. I would have been a more sensible thing to do. I think it was honour, selfishness and regard of Jeyne's feelings that he didn't do that. Robb did not want a girl he was attracted to with another man and Jeyne likely didn't wish for a "pity"marriage with a stranger. Robb was too young and idealistic to consider anything else a Sybil likely pushed him this way too.
  11. Brave Companions are a bulldozer, not a surgeon's knife. They are too unpredictable and unreliable for this type of work. I think that they are simply a bunch of people so despised in their societies that no one else would take them.
  12. I haven't thought there could be a more random ship than Jon/Sansa but I should have known better. I agree that Jon might feel need to protect Jeyne, but marrying her is the last way he would do so. He can hardly marry every girl he wishes to protect. Will he marry Shireen too, because once Stannis dies her position becomes rather unfavourable. Will he marry Val as another wife to stop Selyse's men for courting her? Will he marry every orphan girl from Wall to Neck? I don't think so. Will he marry Jeyne Westerling as some fans speculated to take care of Robb's widow? Even that makes more sense, surely there would be more duty in that than marrying steward's daughter. Not to mention that as long as Ramsay lives Jeyne is legally already married and once he dies there won't be anyone who would give Jeyne a second glance. Some Northern lord might nurse a mild resentment her for her role in the farce, but they are too proud to declare a helpless girl their nemesis. We actually have at least three instances where Jon deals or thinks about finding place for a woman in need. He sends Gilly with Sam to Horn's Hill, he marries Alys Karstark to Sygorn and he thinks about sending Arya to be fostered in Braavos. Not once a marriage to himself crosses his mind, in case of Gilly and Arya that makes sense but he is actually fond of Alys. Even with Val he thinks that he is not the man to steal her. It makes hugely more sense for Jon to either find a place for Jeyne to be fostered, or some occupation as a helping hand of a steward or lady in waiting (she grew up as steward's daughter and lady's companion she would know how to fill those roles) or if she wishes to arrange a good marriage for her. For now Jon is either dead or a member of the Watch forbidden to marry. If he gets out he is likely to become a king and no noble South or North would have much regard for a queen Jeyne Poole stewards daughter and pretender. Why would Jon endanger thousands with weakening his position as a leader for a one girl he was never very fond of and who isn't even his kin? Jeyne is rather young and spend a long time being sexually abused, Jon is very unlikely to feel more for her than pity. If Jon ever becomes king he will marry either for a politician gain or some great passion. Marriage is a powerful tool for every king.
  13. I can't even say why but Rhaegar always seemed to me as (very close to being) asexual even Lyanna could have been more subject of obsession/ platonic bond than lust.
  14. Willas Tyrell Barbrey Dustin Weasel - I want to know what happened to her Edric Dayne Hoster Blackwood Howland Reed The Black Pearl Marwyn Myranda Royce Rhaegar Wylla the wetnurse ... and so many more, I want the damn book!
  15. If Jon won't start making eyes on Lyanna Mormont he doesn't have much of a chance of being paedophile. Arya is roughly 16 in the show, about two years younger than Sansa. It's not like they are 10 years apart. Show Arya is clearly supposed to be older than Tommen and I didn't hear much about Marg being called paedophile, which makes sense because neither Arya nor Tommen are prepubescent. It's not discussed much and she was wearing a different face but Arya was actually portrayed as a sexual object twice in the last episode and once it was by Bronn who is one of fan favourites, so I think that in the show we are nearing the phase where her in romantic/sexual situations could happen. I might be unreasonably optimistic but I have some expectations of Jon/Arya reunion, mainly because I expect it to be so important point for the books that the show will be roughly following the book story instead as pulling it of from whatever place D&D are pulling of their original ideas.