A few posts ago, Apple Martini made an intriguing observation, that most people keep fixating on answering the “who” part of the riddle and not the “how” and/or the “why”. It’s like solving a murder case, by choosing the most likely suspect and then try to find the evidence that support your assumption. On the contrary; the correct path, is to identify the evidence that will lead to the perpetrator.
Having said that and acknowledging that AM and me use the same argument to reach different conclusions, I would like to say that, imo if we don’t answer positively the “how” and the “why” can never be sure of the “who”.
In order to answer the “why” the believers of the theory place Lyanna in the South and most likely (favorably?) at Harrenhal. Forgive me if I have lost truck of new data that confirms that… in that case I apologize for my entire post….. But as far as I am informed we don’t know where Lyanna was. She could be at Winterfell, from where seems almost impossible to have been kidnapped. Even if I accept the likelihood of her being South, wouldn’t Riverrun be more suitable? And why would anyone assume that she needed to “learn to be a southern lady”…. What’s up with that anyway? What is the difference between a southern lady and a northern one? Lyanna was a wild tomboy perhaps, much like Arya, both Northern ladies, but so is Sansa.
And the “why” now. This is my favorite and the reason I have being hesitant towards the theory all along. Why Lyanna and more interestingly why then? Simply because he had just learned that Elia couldn’t have any more children…meaning that if she could, he wouldn’t need Lyanna? Or maybe it just happened to have an epiphany a couple of months after Elia’s second childbirth and it so wonderfully coincided with her not being able to have more children, so as not to stain his good character.
And what about Lyanna? I believe almost everyone here admits that there was no relationship between the two after the tournament and prior to the “elopement”. And knowing Lyanna’s character, we assume it’s wonderfully logical to accept to run away with the married prince, while betrothed, just before her brother’s marriage with a man she may very well had been infatuated with, but had not seen or heard from, for an entire year.
My point and I hope you will all see it as such; it has always been to show that no matter how likely it may seem, this or any theory, imo shouldn’t be treated as facts.
Well Jon is a guy who desperately tries to live up to Ned’s ideals, while admitting his hero is Daeron the Young Dragon….take a hint?!?!
This is Jon….the real Jon, unsure and conflicted. Being one but trying so hard to be something else. Doesn’t accept his nature, his bastard nature, because he thinks he is more than that. He accepts to kill Halfhand, in a situation much similar to the Old guys but doesn’t kill the latter. Why? Because Halfhand wants him to, because Halfhand almost asks him to, Jon is not to blame, he is following orders. But when he has to decide for himself he tries to do what he believes is the moral thing, not the right thing, what Ned would have done and that’s where the problem is. If he wasn’t so damaged by his bastard nature, If he was self-assured he would have done the right thing.
corbon v.49 #1170 :
Of course. When Rhaegar gave them an order, Jon was not even born, let alone King. So Rhaegar couldn't give them an order to guard their King at ToJ.
He could give them an order to guard his wife and unborn child. Which isn't dictated to by their vows.
The disagreement here is that I believe that even if Lyanna had given birth to a girl they would still have stayed there under Rhaegar’s order and protect her and her child.
I think I’ve said enough especially since I don’t think that it actually matters since Jon imo isn’t Rhaegar’s son, so the 3 KG business at the ToJ is still unclear to me
"Shaw: Can you explain why the King's Guard chose to stand and fight Ned at the Tower of the Joy instead of protecting the remaining royal family members?
Martin: The King's Guards don't get to make up their own orders. They serve the king, they protect the king and the royal family, but they're also bound to obey their orders, and if Prince Rhaegar gave them a certain order, they would do that. They can't say, "No we don't like that order, we'll do something else."
I don’t think that we have any valid reason to assume Olenna is lying. It’s not like she was cornered by someone about that event and had to lie about it out of pride. It’s an information she shares freely, plus it would be out of character for a straightforward woman like her to distort history for no apparent reason.
On the age issue I believe she must have been born between 225-.230 Hoster Tully was born in 235 and she admits she is older, I doubt she would mention that if the age difference was less than (let’s say) 3 years. I think it’s safe to assume that she is at least 5 years older and up to 10 (my personal belief is closer to 10).
With that in mind and knowing that Aegon had at least two sons by the age of 233 when he got the throne then both sons (and maybe the 3rd too) are candidates. Personally though, I see no reason why Aegon would want or need a Redwyne bride, especially for his first son and heir. If indeed she was supposed to be married within the royal family I think it was one of the younger sons (maybe ironically enough Jaehaerys who later ascended to the throne). Aerys sent Steffon Baratheon to the Free Cities in search of a suitable bride; I doubt a Redwyne would suffice for the Targaryen future king.