Le Cygne

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About Le Cygne

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    "I'll save you a bowl of soup, might even have some ale"

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  1. [Book Spoilers] Jaime & Brienne- What's going on?

    Yeah, they set them back quite a bit. They don't do separation periods well, they try with lots of little hints, but twincest expired ages ago, or should have. And yes, he did a great job with that scene.
  2. [Book Spoilers] Jaime & Brienne- What's going on?

    Do you ever discuss stories without getting personal about it? I won't ask you if you are "really, really into penis metaphors" because I'm here to talk about the story. GRRM uses sexual symbolism a lot. In the case of Jaime and Brienne, he uses it extensively, throughout the story, and indeed, much of the story is there. It's a Beauty and the Beast story, and desire is a central motivation of the characters. Here's the Far From the Madding Crowd director describing the Hollow in the Ferns (the hollow, the ferns, that's classic female sexual symbolism) scene. Sexual symbolism is often used in literature to represent desire and foreshadow sex between characters. The show uses sexual symbolism in a different way, they are much more direct, but they go there. I think both show and books are hinting so heavily for something sexual for Jaime and Brienne, that there's more to come along these lines. Sex is actually pretty common in ASOIAF. Two characters who want to have sex will usually "realistically" have sex more often than not. When GRRM gave Dany and Daario all that sexual buildup, they had sex. It would have been rather surprising if they didn't. The scene I mentioned is a symbolic sex scene. The swords kissing, moving into her, faster faster faster... This is all very suggestive of what's going on between them, mutual desire, beneath the surface. That's what BatB is about. These are hints for readers/viewers, to convey this. The red flower blossoming hints at virgin consummation (like the bloody cloak with Sansa and Sandor, the two BatB pairings have similar scenes). Brienne sits astride Jaime, and he goes for the dagger. That last bit with him submerged is very suggestive, too. After all of this, he's looking at this woman, and thinks she looks like they've been fucking instead of fighting. And he calls her his wife. None of this was unintentional, indeed, this is an important scene for them. This is to put in the mind of the reader, these two may have sex one day.
  3. [Book Spoilers] Jaime & Brienne- What's going on?

    Yeah, they deliberately set this up for a reason, there will be follow up. We are not meant to just disregard prior scenes that tell their story, just because it was a while ago. The separation period is part of the story.
  4. [Book Spoilers] Jaime & Brienne- What's going on?

    I never got into the Brienne having a child idea, I don't think she really wants one. But I think sex is definitely in the cards. Both Beauty and the Beast stories, J/B and SanSan, are very sexy stories, they are steeped in this. The sexy layers have layers. All the daggers and swords and hills and hollows and red blossoms and bloody cloaks. J/B had a mud wrestling scene! So many sexual hints, over and over and over again. To do all that and then end chaste... nah. That would not only be a letdown for what he's built up, but it would be quite boring, too. No one watches a show like this for chaste letdowns. This is a very sexy saga, and he has no qualms about going there, a lot. And an author doesn't hang a "fucking instead of fighting" scene on the wall and not go there. And there's so much more. Books, I think they are not in denial anymore. I think they are ready. Show, they keep using him as a prop, so I suspect whenever they get done with that, he will be instantly ready. There's no time to hem and haw, they will get right to it. And this next is the penultimate book, all these things he's been building to, this is what it call comes down to. Not much time left to dilly dally. I think they will resolve his story with Cersei at least to a certain point, and bring Brienne back into the mix somehow. Probably send him her way, or him his way. We saw that with Sandor, too, they brought him back and wham bam, sent him north. I can't really picture Jaime up north, so I suspect Brienne will go to him. And his dream seems to hint when he's alone, she will be there.
  5. I think they kind of have to do more with Rhaegar. They seem to be streamlining big time, but there are certain things they set out to do from the start. The showrunners had lots of talks with GRRM to plan the series, before it started. This helped them to know what key things were important, to know who to cast, and to plan key things. They have been in touch with him all along, since before the series began, and he said writes notes on their outlines each season, and tells them things they need to know, and makes suggestions. This is typical, Diana Gabaldon does the same thing with Outlander. She writes notes and tells them, this is going to matter later. So make sure it's covered, that sort of thing. And they said there are certain things they set up right from the start. And as bad as they can be with storytelling, they call back to earlier seasons all the time, again, they say they do this. I think they have to touch on the Lyanna and Rhaegar stuff, at least a little. My rant is, they skipped right past it, but I think they are saving the Jon and Dany stuff as something big. There are certain key relationships and plot points that factor in, and they keep saying the beginning matters. The ones left are the ones we have always been invested in. Jon and Dany are at the center of this thing, their history is a big part of what started the whole thing, and yet neither knows about the other. They are going to play it up, they have to. He keeps wondering about Lyanna. She keeps wondering about Rhaegar. The obvious question once Jon finds out Ned isn't his father, is, well, who is? And he's Dany's brother, too. It's their common point. So they have to get into him more. This isn't a small point. And there are still mysteries tied to Rhaegar, it's not all about Jon's birth, there are things surrounding that readers don't know yet. Also with the dragons, someone is going to ride Rhaegal, and I bet it's going to be Jon. They rarely get the mix right, finer points, broad points, seems to be one or the other. But Rhaegar is too big to leave out. That's my guess, anyway.
  6. [Book Spoilers] Jaime & Brienne- What's going on?

    Yeah, I never go there beyond "something must happen" with these books. I think the sexual tension is building up to at least sex (loving sex, of course). Checkhov's "fucking instead of fighting" scene.
  7. Possible marriage

    Oh yeah, and they talked to him about the story in the planning stages to get a sense of what was important, they said so. It's common with a book series in progress, the author tells them what's important, and gets more specific as details are known. Sandor's Cloak... by Sansa Stark...
  8. Possible marriage

    Oh, there's lots. They had them carefully placed, he's standing between the two unwanted Lannisters, and there's a moment in the scene where she stands to face him as she's wearing his cloak. Books, she thinks no velvet felt so fine. And there's the whole nine yards of the tall strong man who gives her his cloak of protection and kisses her. All those beats are hit in their story, thanks to her (and she gives him the kiss). There's lots more, she tries to read his face when he says I have no wife. He says, what wife, when he finds out about her. She puts his bloody cloak in a cedar chest (hope chests in the US). She places him in the marriage bed because of how he'd kissed her. There are even hints about kids worded the same way. It's a really nice story! Lots of layers. And the show hit on a lot of this, the separation period is part of the story, and they did a lot of setup, and commented on the relationship as significant. And of course, they always planned to bring him back, and then as soon as they did, sent him north. Could be a really nice high point on the show, too (if they don't bungle it too badly.) Also another cool point, she puts it on herself in the books.
  9. Possible marriage

    Yeah, she said she will always think of him as a brother, and she mentioned the Targ stuff before. I think they are going to focus on Jon and Dany. And Sansa and Sandor have more story. There are key plot points and relationships they knew about all along, and they've said they have been setting up from the start. And I think they saved the best for last, for the climax.
  10. Possible marriage

    They ruled out Jon and Sansa, they never even considered it...
  11. Possible marriage

    So let's look at the other ships. For Sansa, they ruled out Tyrion, they tossed out the forced marriage. For Sansa, they ruled out Jon, they said they never even considered it. For Arya, GRRM ruled out Jon, he said he scrapped the outline. None of those will happen. Sansa and Sandor had lots of setup on the show. Arya and Gendry, too. Those are book stories with romantic references. GRRM said there's something there with Sansa and Sandor on the show, too, and said Arya and Gendry will have more story in the books. Cogman said they always planned to bring Sandor back, and the Sansa and the Hound relationship is a big part of the show. The showrunners said about Sansa and Sandor, the developing relationship between these two, much more to come. Now, seems like if Sansa and Sandor were a big part of the show, and much more is how they described their relationship, then it's significant. So maybe the 20 or so scenes together, based on Beauty and the Beast, and all the hints after, were actually for a reason. Now let's see, how does Sandor feel about Sansa on the show? They said he is attracted to her. They also said it's a good thing Rory is taller than Sophie during this scene where they added the line where he pledges to protect her. And they added this scene, too. He gave her his cloak. He called her his pet name for her four times. They also added the happy memory line. Rory said about the love, yeah there might be after filming that scene. And much more. Seems like Sandor has got quite the thing for Sansa. He sure cares a lot about her. Always looked out for her. And he said ask her who came back for her, and now is told it's never too late to come back and sent north.
  12. Possible marriage

    Or they could build on all the scenes and setup... now that she's more like him, and he's more like her...
  13. Possible marriage

    Fixed a lot of typos, on a phone. He really did put a lot of heart and soul into this story.