Currawong

Gave it a 9, and that was mainly because I didn't think we needed the Loras / Olyvar scene. By all means have a scene with Loras and Margaery briefly discussing changes in their situation after Tywin's death, but we didn't need Olyvar's 'involvement'. Loved the final scenes at the Wall, and especially appreciated all the little shots of the various characters as Mance was set to burn. The cold self-righteousness of Mel as she set the pyre allight, the almost fanatical look of glee on Selyse's face, with poor little Shireen next to her closing her eyes in horror, the way Gilly turned away to Sam, the suppressed anger of Tormund and the wildlings, the stoicism/muted horror of the NW. And then of course, Mance's growing agony and fear as he burned, and the way Jon finally broke and put him out of his agony. Beautifully done.

Being forewarned, I was prepared not to like it, but when I watched, I thought it was rather clever to have Jaime say No! so quietly. Yes, it was very different to the angry scene in the book, but that occurred almost immediately after Jaime returned to KL, just after the sept-sex scene and when Jaime is still furious about what he's just found out about the whole KL situation. The show's altered timeline means he's been in KL a little while before this scene. I got the impression that Tywin was almost expecting Jaime to be angry and was prepared to deal with that - he seemed almost disconcerted when Jaime was so calm about things. Having successfully bullied Cersei and Tyrion in Season 3, I don't think Tywin expected Jaime of all people to say no to him in such measured terms. Yes, it's a shame we didn't get the 'I don't want your Rock' and 'You are not my son!' bits but I am sure there is plenty of room left for Tywin/Jaime drama.

Good solid opening episode for the season, gave it an 8 but I'd have liked to give it an 8.5. It moved far better than I thought it would, and it was interesting to see how they gave viewers some key bits of background or reminded them of others. I know some readers have been upset at the lack of mention about Rhaegar and Ellaria before now, but really, it made much more sense in the context of a TV show to wait for S4 and bring them up when Oberyn is in KL to avenge his sister. For Unsullied viewers, I suspect those details would have been missed completely if they'd been mentioned in earlier seasons. Also interesting to get mention of Ser Arthur Dayne and Duncan the Tall, plus a reminder about Brienne's oath to avenge Renly. Things that were a bit 'meh'- Tyrion and Shae, and also Yet Another Dany march to Yet Another City. Dany is not my favourite character, but it all looked so very deja vu, just with children instead of adult slaves. She needs to get some training advice for those dragons - where's Cesar Millan when you really need him?! The only thing that I thought really let the episode down and should have been better staged was where Tyrion waited for the Dornish. Tyrion was supposed to be representing King Joffrey and meeting a Prince from Dorne! So why were he, Bronn and Pod just hanging about under some tree looking like a group of vagrants? I half expected to see a litter of wine flagons around them. If Peter Dinklage doesn't like riding horses, then they should at least have set up some sort of formal welcome pavillion where the KL contingent could wait in appropriate formal state. I am sure they would have had a spare little awning or something that could double up from the wedding!

Michelle Fairley plays a newspaper editor in Philomena.

I liked the episode overall. Full marks especially to Dany and her 'negotiations', to Tywin counselling Joffrey, and of course to Jaime / Brienne. However, once they decided to move the bearpit scene to this episode instead of Ep 8, I think they should have done a bit more re-balancing of some scenes to give the actual bear fight in the pit slightly more emphasis, given that this was the big dramatic ending to the episode. I think they could have added about 20-30 seconds to that and cut the same amount from the Theon torture scene. Even though I shudder at them, I agree that the Theon torture scenes are necessary in terms of the long-term plot - it was just that in this episode, I felt it all went on slightly too long in comparison to all the other scenes. A bit of skilful editing would have left the whore-then-torture stuff still horrible, but allowed that little extra time with the bear.

Am now gleefully looking forward to what should be the upcoming Cersei - Loras - Margaery plot to have Joffrey appoint Loras to the KG. This will then: Neatly foil one aspect of Tywin's plot, stop Cersei getting married off again (at least this time) and free Loras to keep on grieving for Renly, avoid a sham marriage, and keep on following his own sexual preferences.

I agree - I thought he did a wonderful job, showing fear and terror through his eyes and facial expression, yet then giving us a man who somehow found the strength to overcome those fears and fight. He had run away at Blackwater, but here he was going to confront those fears, stand and fight. And this was a far more personal fight than the generic Lannister vs Stannis fight at Blackwater. I suggest you go onto the HBO site and read Bryan Cogman's interview about this episode, and you will see his explanation. The jars made perfect sense to me even before I read what he had to say.

:agree: Very well said on so many matters. I wish they still had the 'Like' button :)

Ah, OK - you said that Dany's line with Barristan was stupid, so I misunderstood and thought you were saying that Dany should not have got cross with him.

Being in the KIngsguard does not give you the right to question the king in public or interrupt any meetings. KG were supposed to guard the king: if they attended meetings, they were not expected to speak unless spoken to. The fact that the knights in the KG did not challenge the mad king Aerys about some of his more terrible actions (e.g.raping his wife, his torture of Brandon and Rickard) was what so disturbed the young Jaime as a new KG member. Ser Barristan as the Lord Commander would have known that as well as anyone, and Dany was 100% right to reprimand him for disagreeing with her in public as he did.

Not to mention that the main title music itself is SO totally 'medieval' in tone and orchestration! :D Can't see what the problem is.

Then on the Goldilocks and the Three Bears principle, this probably means that the producers have got things 'just right' !

LOL Duke - I remain quietly amused that so many people have continually found fault with the show, right from Season 1, and yet they are still watching in Season 3 :) They criticise this and that, they say the writers have butchered certain people, or berate them about even minor deviations from the books, they wail bitterly about changes to names, plot line condensations, invented characters and scenes so on ... yet these people are still obviously watching the show despite all their objections, and the audience keeps growing! HBO execs must truly be laughing.

I gave it an 8. I try to put aside my knowledge of the books, and look at things as a TV series. So I ask myself: does this scene/episode make sense on TV in the context of what they have shown us before? I thought everything was well done except for the Sam / Mormont stuff beyond the Wall. I didn't mind not seeing the actual battle and just hearing the sounds over a dark screen (seeing it would have been a waste of screen time and resources, TBH), but I thought the explanation as to how Sam survived, and how Mormont and the NW just conveniently reappeared was poorly explained. Nice to see Ghost again, but it would have been better if the writers had explained - either in this episode or back in Season 2 - just why he was not with Jon. Did Jon order Ghost to stay with the NW? It would have only needed a sentence or two as explanations for viewers. Apart from that, there was some great stuff. The Lannister family dynamics are pure TV gold, as usual. Love the 'Margaery echoes Princess Di' approach with the orphans, and Joffrey not yet realising her is going to be out-manouvred by the Tyrells. Agree completely with Stark Winds that: Because LF is not a POV character in the books, there is so much we cannot see there about his machinations, but I enjoy seeing him play out his 'everything to everyone' role on TV. Very clever reference to Arya - did he really recogise her in Harrenhal? Or is he just using Arya's name as a family 'hook' to convince Sansa that he's on her side? After all, he never admitted that he saw Arya or knows where she is ... Nicely devious. Dany's story is picking up some pace at last, and like others, I think that having Barristan reveal himself at this early stage makes far more sense on TV, and sets up some potential for conflict/ jealousy with Ser Jorah. I'll give Emilia another couple of episodes to show that her acting has improved now that she is being given something of substance to work with, but as yet she has not mastered the 'act with your eyes' technique - for me, she still seems to just open them more widely and stare, without any true depth of feeling. Hopefully she'll be able to do herself more justice in the role as Season 3 progresses. ETA. Forgot to mention Roose and Karstark. Liked their few brief lines, and the hints of more seeds being sown for the RW - they are loyal to Robb right now, but you can almost see the calculations going on behind Roose's eyes. Karstark just wants revenge, but Roose is much cleverer ... Overall, I thought this was a strong beginning, as it just plunged us straight back into the world without worrying about in-show recaps or reminders. The storylines and directions for all the main characters and locations we saw have been set up and moved along nicely. Now for Ep 2, with Arya, Theon, Jaime/Brienne and Bran and Rickon

Yes, yes, and YES. Frankly, I think it's about time so many of the book purists stop complaining and finding fault with even the tiniest little changes (like the pathetic fuss about omitting weasel soup) - and instead, stand back and appreciate what HAS been achieved. No adaptation is going to satisfy everyone. Rather than nipick to death, I think its about time everyone said a great big THANK YOU! to Dan and David, for having the sheer guts and dedication to do everything necessary to bring this world to our TV screens. And to GRRM for allowing them to do so. These two men have invested 26 hours a day, 9 days a week, 360 days a year for the last few years, doing their level best to bring GRRM's extremely complex books to life. They and HBO have assembled an incredible pool of off-screen backstage talent, and an absolutely amazing cast, who continue to deliver over and above anything they might have hoped for (especially the kids). They have filmed day and night in three or more countries per season, they have produced TV of a quality that is rarely ever seen, and they have signed up to do exactly the same for at least another two seasons. No one is ever going to produce the 'perfect' adaptation of any book, let alone an entire series set in a different world with multiple complicated plot lines and an ever-increasing cast of characters. I'm just amazed that anyone thought it could be done, and that D &D have actually made it happen. And so at the end of Season 2, I'd just like to say: Bravo, David and Dan - thank you, thank you, and take a bow. Take several bows and lots of applause. (And don't let the turkeys get you down!) :D