Hangover of the Morning

Members
  • Content count

    2,175
  • Joined

  • Last visited

1 Follower

About Hangover of the Morning

  • Rank
    The Forum's Delight

Profile Information

  • Gender
    Not Telling

Recent Profile Visitors

1,668 profile views
  1. Why is not Eddark Stark an option? He outplayed everyone by hiding an heir to the throne under everyone's nose. And all without any scheming, bribing, spying or backstabbing. Doran Martell must be a joke answer, though he certainly would win in a poll on "Who's the best at getting their family members killed?".
  2. That's an incredibly astute observation and definitely a possibility. It wouldn't even have to be Aerys who Papa Dayne got close to during the war but just someone influential at court.
  3. We never got Arthur's description, only that of his relatives (sister, nephew and distant cousin). There's absolutely nothing in the text to support the idea that Aerys banged Lady Dayne.
  4. Fair enough. Edric Dayne seems to be insinuating that he has all the info about Ashara from his aunt Allyria, who was only a baby at that time. Think that if there was another adult in his father's generation, he'd be likely a more reliable source of information, and thus mentioned. But yeah, the possibility that there were more Dayne siblings can't be excluded, even if I find it somewhat unlikely. Either way, they are irrelevant to the plot. It really doesn't matter, whether Arthur was 2nd or 10th born as he certainly wasn't' the heir.
  5. What makes you think that there was another son/s in between Edric's father and Arthur?
  6. Arthur's age (or looks for that matter) are never describe in the books so it must be just a fan's guess. However, I too think that he was probably more or less the same age as Rhaegar. I've written my reasoning before so just copy-pasting: It's unlikely to befriend someone more than a couple years older or younger when you are a child or a teen and since Arthur was not only Rhaegar's dearest but also oldest friend, it's safe to assume that their friendship goes way back The age of Arthur's siblings: the older brother had his first child two years after Arthur's and Ashara's deaths, while at the same time the youngest Dayne is but a wee kid when they died. Unless they had different mothers, it's unlikely that there was more than a 25 year gap between Edric's dad and Allyria. Arthur has to fall somewhere in between. Ashara and Arthur were very close by all accounts and if there was a significant age gap between them, they'd barely known each other. Ashara couldn't have been much older than Ned and Robert as she's repeatedly described as a "young maid" and "new to court" around the time of Harrenhal Tourney. Edric left Starfall to become page and later squire at the age of 8. Jaime left home when he was 11. Arthur would presumably not be an exception in this case and would have left home around that age as well. He and his sister could have bonded during their time at court but we don't know if they were even in the same place. Ashara, as one of Elia's ladies in waiting was probably on Dragonstone rather than King's Landing but we don't know about Arthur's whereabouts. I always took for granted that Arthur joined KG at a young age (around the time he turned adulthood: 17-20) but not absurdly young like Jaime (otherwise it'd be noted). Similarly, I got the impression that Prince Lewyn joined later in his life (e.g in his forties). No textual evidence, just feels right regarding what we know about their personalities. Arthur probably joined after Duskendale (277 A.D.), otherwise he'd be mentioned doing "something" at that time. So if Arthur replaced Gwayne Gaunt (who died at Duskendale) and was 20 at that time, he'd be two years older than Rhaegar. He could have also been younger and/or joined a year or two later. Either way, he'd have 5-6 in the KG plus few years as a Sword of the Morning and a celebrated tourney knight prior to that, which should be plenty of time in GRRM-verse to achieve eternal fame. Of all the celebrated knights in Aerys' Kingsguard, teenage Jaime identifies the most with Arthur. Could be because Arthur knighted him or because he was the best swordsman or because Jaime liked his personality (or looks) but could also be because he could related to him the most due to their closeness in age. The White Bull and Barry the Bold were famous throughout the realm and had much more victories under their belts compare to Dayne but no sane teenager wants to emulate someone 3-4 times their age. A guy who is already famous but only few years older than Jaime sounds like a much more reasonable role model. We don't know the age of Whent, Martell or Darry but they all had siblings in their forties so would likely be in early thirties at least. GRRM likes his heroes absurdly young when they achieve their fame (Daeron I, Jon, Robb, Jaime, Ned and Robert during RR) so why should a prodigy like Arthur be any different?
  7. Edric Dayne mentions that his father was Arhtur's older brother. No mention of any other male-Dayne in that generation.Therefore, Arhtur was in all likelihood the second son. I'd wager he was also second born out of the four children (since Ashara is described as quite young at Harrenhal) but we don't know that for sure.
  8. How does a second son from a relatively minor, albeit famous, far-away house become best friend with the crown prince? We can only speculate as there's very little to go on in the canon. We only know that Arthur was Rhaegar dearest as well as oldest friend. To me that implies that they have known each other from childhood or early teens. My guess is that the boys have squired together for the same lord (Jaime and Merrett Frey or Tywin/Aerys/Steffon scenario). Alternatively, Arhtur could have been "fostered" in King's Landing for a period of time. Rhaegar grew up as an only child (Viserys was born when he was 16) and it's not unusual to bring other noble children to the court to keep the prince company. How do you think that those two met?
  9. I only properly read the OP so I apologise if it had been mentioned in the comments but I don'f find the Harry - Alyane match so far-fetched Harry may fling his "heir of the Vale" title as much as he wants but essentially he's a nobody (one step above a hedge knight) as long as Sweet Robin lives and much more so once the kid marries and procreates. I kinda got a feeling that there is an unspoken agreement between LF and Lady Waynwood (similar to his former collaboration with Olenna) where both party understand that the match is only viable if Harrold inherits the lordship, i.e. LF will make sure that that's indeed the case. I don't think Lady Waynwood is necessarily a horrible person (or would approve of child murder). She probably convinced herself that the boy will die from his sickness anyways, even if it means that LF's neglect (or extra help) may speed up the process. Harry is essentially marrying LF's bastard in exchange for the Vale of Arryn. Not too bad of a deal from his and Lady Waynwood perspective. Obviously, that's not the end of LF's ambitions but that's another story.
  10. What do you base it on?
  11. I'd be incredibly surprised and frankly quite disappointed if it turns out that Varys knows about Jon's real parentage. His actions throughout the books suggest no such thing and the Young Griff reveal makes it down right impossible without making it look like a clumsily handled retcon later on. I think the whole Jon = Targaryen princeling reveal and the irony that the politically inept Ned Stark was able to outplay all the aces of the game without any scheming, lying or backstabbing, would be heavily undermined (and didn't make much sense) if we later find out that Varys (or LF, Doran etc.) knew about Jon all along.
  12. All Daynes, even Darkstar. The casualties of the Rebellion: Arthur, Elia, Ashara, Rhaegar, Lyanna and Brandon Sam's family Wylla Harry the Heir Tommen Baratheon fAegon Garlan Tyrell
  13. I totally agree. Among the main characters, Stannis displays probably the highest discrepancy between "what he says" and "what he does", i.e. he's the biggest hypocrite. As you so nicely summarised it, his actions shows that his willing to do to almost anything (no matter how amoral) to become king, yet his disciples fans will insist that he's the most self-sacrificing human being and that he's doing everything out of duty to the realm and its people simply because he says so once or twice.
  14. I wish AFfC and ADwD were the alternative novels that showed us the world from different regions and perspectives. I'd love it if the "real book IV of ASoIaF" to be a fast-paced continuation of the core story set in the first three novels (preferably after a 5-year gap).
  15. I agree with your post. The imaginary and dialogue very strongly indicates that the KG are protecting someone very important, i.e. a possible future king and GRRM wouldn't structure the scene in that way if he didn't want to hint at Jon's royal origins and/or his potential future claim to the IT. It's emphasised by the white cloaks (very impractical in a fight), boasting about being true to their vow and being exactly as where they should be and their reaction to Viserys' whereabouts. I have no doubt that in their minds the KG were protecting the rightful monarch and the last of Rhaegar's legacy. However, I believe that there's a discrepancy between what Rhaegar (and his men) perceived as "right" and "legal" and what the realm would should Jon's birth become public. Even if Bobellion didn't happen, nobody would look too kindly on Rhaegar's action and most would consider his marriage to Lyanna invalid and thus Jon a bastard.