Colonel Green

Members
  • Content count

    6,501
  • Joined

  • Last visited

2 Followers

About Colonel Green

  • Rank
    Council Member
  • Birthday 11/18/1987

Profile Information

  • Gender
    Male
  • Location
    Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island, Canada

Recent Profile Visitors

2,567 profile views
  1. The explanation for the Stark kids' accents is that when they cast the family they were planning on having them all speak RP-type accents, but when Sean Bean declined to do that, they had to try to switch over to something akin to his. The older actors (Madden, Harington) could do so; the younger actors (Turner, Williams, Hempstead-Wright) couldn't, so they just had them use their "city" accents like originally planned.
  2. She doesn't know about that, in the books or the show. Because nobody there had any reason to say anything to her about it.
  3. Because they're uncouth, as Littlefinger says. Harry is anticipating becoming Lord of the Eyrie.
  4. He couldn't grab her quickly and split, because he didn't want to take his ship that close to King's Landing when he's been meticulously keeping out of sight. Littlefinger's plans routinely involve major gambles, but regardless, if you assume that Littlefinger was willing to take his boat close enough to the city to receive some kind of message (even though there's no hints at all that any such message exists in the text), then there's no reason for him not to wait and pick up Sansa too. In any event, from his location, if he doesn't get word by a certain point he can withdraw to safety with ease. The "wildly divergent poisonings" are a prime example of nitpicking. The things you talk about are not "in the text" in the manner of the other foreshadowings because there's no textual indication they're meant to be considered suspicious or unusual. It's wholly your own imposition.
  5. Yes, exactly. Exactly, none of those things are right there in the story. Catelyn is alarmed by Grey Wind's behaviour and urges Robb to send the Westerlings away, even if she doesn't know what it means; Catelyn is confused by the discrepancy between different accounts of where Robert Arryn was supposed to be fostered, etc. None of the things you list are actually signalled as being part of the story, they're nitpicking (particularly in the case of the motivations; we're given a motivation for the Tyrells, and there is never the slightest indication of their having a motivation to kill Tyrion).
  6. No evidence for any of that. If he's willing to dip so close to KL as to be in audible range of the bells, he can wait a few minutes to pick up Sansa. If he's that afraid of patrols, he'd be afraid of them detaining all ships in the harbour, and he'd be afraid of them catching Sansa's little rowboat the longer she's out there. The reveal of Littlefinger adds quite a lot, in fact, because it's something of ongoing plot importance, and builds up Littlefinger as one of the series' main villains. Grey Wind's ferocious reaction to Sybell Spicer and her brother Rolph is right there in ASOS.
  7. So, you don't have an explanation, then? GRRM's other mysteries are actually highlighted in the text. That's, in fact, one of the strongest cases against your theory, which hinges almost entirely on haggling over cup heights and geopolitical calculations nobody ever brings up. Likewise, you've never been able to explain why any of this would matter to the plot. "Littlefinger tried to kill Tyrion!" is not a twist, because the plan already involved trying to kill Tyrion.
  8. Moving the ship a little closer to the city would literally only be useful if Joffrey died and you could thus hear the bells, but if the poison was in the pie and the pie was mislaid, the most probable assumption would be that it killed somebody right next to Tyrion (like Sansa), not Joffrey, whose involvement was, according to you, a complete accident. Moreover, if, in the worst case scenario the scheme fails and Littlefinger is implicated right on the spot and the Lannisters know his location, they would act in a manner that would not alert him to their approach, anyway. Moreover, if he was going to sail closer to the city, he could sail closer and pick up Sansa and Dontos, which would wrap up this whole operation much quicker. That's kind of the basis for his whole skill set. But, as I noted, the degree to which everything went according to plan is absolutely rather unrealistic. But that is common with schemer characters, both in this series and in pop culture in general. This alternate theory you're advancing is a lot like the various attempts people still make to pin the assassination attempt on Bran on somebody other than Joffrey, in that it's taking what are really complaints about narrative logic and, rather than acknowledging that the author may have fallen short of whatever standard of plausibility you want, creating an alternative "real" explanation..
  9. Which has no bearing on the exercise of power. As to the passage you quote, I never denied that Olenna had influence. But she is not running the entire house behind the scenes. Take it up with GRRM. You miss the whole point of acting pre-emptively, then, which keeps them from any suspicion. It's also a recurring theme in the whole story that people regularly act in ways that are not considered honourable. I never said the scheme doesn't have elements of literary contrivance to it (see also, the jousting dwarves). But that's true of many schemes in the books, including Littlefinger's. The books are not realistic, they wouldn't be nearly as good if they were. It's not that it cannot do that, but that there is no reason for him to do that, other than because you need a workaround to make your theory viable. If that was his concern, sailing closer to the city is the worst possible idea. LOL, no. That is not how it works. Tywin wields all the actual power; even Cersei says as much, which is why she finds his death so liberating. There's something else with no textual basis. There's nothing at all indicating that the Tyrells are alarmed by the Lannisters to that degree, otherwise they would never have joined them in the first place. It would decade decades for the Lannisters to ever consolidate control of the North to the extent that they'd be able to use them reliably. For somebody who repeatedly insists that it makes no sense for the Tyrells to act against the distant possibility of Joffrey abusing Margaery, you insist in turn that this geopolitical scenario is so urgent it requires them to murder Tyrion immediately (even though, among other things, Tyrion isn't doing any of the things he would need to do to begin consolidating control of the North). Joffrey's nature is explained, and explained to us by somebody who understands Joffrey very well. And the author pointedly shows their lack of concern as something odd in need of explanation, which we subsequently get; that's the twist. I don't take anything he says at face value. I analyze whether it makes sense, and what objective confirmation there exists for it. The Purple Wedding plot has plenty, and more to the point, the literary reasons offered for the alternative theories are just convoluted and add nothing to the story. It is not a "black eye", as you so insistently keep referring to it. This is also spelled out in the text, including the prospect of Loras killing Joffrey, which would be a doomsday scenario. I'm sorry for your personal experience. But the point I was making is that Sansa was abused at length by Joffrey; she has, as a result, a greater understanding of how his mind works in this regard. No, I'm talking about the paragraphs devoted to Sansa analyzing the current KL political situation in ASOS Sansa II. She has a tremendous insight into the inherent and inevitable denouement of this current arrangement, one that Littlefinger (who obviously has no idea that Sansa has thought this as well) later repeats. GRRM himself has noted that Sansa is learning that she has the same potential skills as Littlefinger; showing that (in a similarity she herself never remarks upon) she hit on the truth shows her potential. No, all of those surprises had major plot implications. Most notably, the reveal of who really killed Jon Arryn was a major reorientation of the events of the whole series and established Littlefinger as truly one of the series' main villains. Conversely, your proposed plot twist adds nothing, to speak of. The big surprise of your theory is supposedly that Littlefinger was trying to kill Tyrion, but we already knew that, because the plan as revealed to Sansa already involves killing Tyrion by framing him for murder.
  10. No, it's not. That's show nonsense. Mace is the head of House Tyrell. He has his own ideas, and his own will. The Queen of Thorns is a behind the scenes influence, and she works mostly through the ladies exerting soft power. No, quite the opposite, since Sansa may have to take the fall for the murder plot, so there's no reason to tell her that at all. Joffrey doesn't have to be lying; he may quite like Margaery at the moment. Joffrey is a sociopath. As Sansa notes, he might be fine for a while, but eventually it will go south. That's his nature. You assume that using poison makes one a "snivelling coward", rather than a practical individual. Also, any version of the Tyrell plot involves all these people lying their asses off to Sansa throughout. Also not true. Loras and Mace almost certainly weren't in on it; indeed, the plan is built around the sense of their own plans being too risky. The Purple Wedding plot has more independent external verification than almost any other mysterious plot in the series. Littlefinger says he hired the jousting dwarves; we know from Tyrion's ADWD chapters that that's true. Littlefinger says somebody touched Sansa's hairnet; we know from Sansa's own POV that happened. Littlefinger says the poison was in Sansa's hairnet; we know from Arya's POV (via the Ghost of High Heart) that that's true. Littlefinger knows that Joffrey died without anybody saying anything, even though he's well out of range of the city (and yes, you've proposed an elaborate workaround for this, but there's not a scintilla of textual evidence for it, and it would have been much easier to just have the boat closer to the harbour in the first place). Littlefinger lays out the case for what the Tyrells' motives were, and it just happens to coincide exactly with Sansa's own earlier read of the situation that Littlefinger would have no way of knowing about, thus illustrating Sansa's burgeoning insight. Nobody should take anything Littlefinger says on faith, but assuming he's always lying about everything is no better. Tywin was the real power in King's Landing; had he not died, Cersei would have been packed off elsewhere, probably, and even if she hadn't been, she was irrelevant. That the Tyrells are looking to play for maximum benefit is absolutely true. But you provide no basis whatsoever for the idea that the Tyrells are mortally afraid of Tywin destroying them at any minute. Tywin intends to forge a grand alliance that will benefit both parties and secure the throne going forward. He doesn't pick fights with people on his team for no reason. When the author specifically calls attention to their nonchalance, and has characters wonder about it, that's setup. You insist on taking this, and this alone, completely at face value. Joffrey delights in cruelty. That should have been pretty damn obvious by that point in the books. Moreover, as an abuse victim, Sansa understands Joffrey's pathology far better than you do. As outlined in-text, once Joffrey starts to mistreat her, the Tyrells' motive for killing him is evident to anybody with a brain (whereas in the books, note that it never occurs to anybody other than Cersei, and that's basically because a stopped clock is right twice a day in her case). And Loras might act before any other plan could be set in motion again. No, that's Sansa demonstrating political skill. Sansa is on a character arc of evolving as a player, and her time in KL is, among other things, about refining her ability as an observer. Moreover, that particular moment is something that one only really notices on reread. Sansa herself never thinks back to her earlier analysis and thinks she was right; it's left to the reader to pick up that she saw a crucial piece of the situation well in advance. Your version, on the other hand, does nothing whatsoever to advance Sansa as a character (much like you've never been able to explain what the literary purpose of your proposed theory being revealed would be).
  11. LOL, no. Not only would that require Sansa to have taken huge, huge leaps in character development completely off-page, it would require her to then immediately snap back and forget everything about her own involvement, and it would require both Dontos and Littlefinger to instantaneously realize that she had gone insane and forgotten everything about her involvement in the plan the second they meet her. Mace agreed to the wedding, because he thought putting Loras in the Kingsguard solved the situation. It was the Tyrell women who saw that that wasn't enough. You seem to have missed the rather significant idea in the series that appearances are not everything. You want to talk about textual justification, yet there is literally nothing in the text supporting the idea that the Tyrells are concerned with Tywin trying to destroy them. Tywin is seeking to build a grand alliance, he says as much. If that bothered the Tyrells, they would never have joined the Lannisters in the first place. As as been outlined to you before, the whole damn point of Sansa repeatedly highlighting the Tyrells' seeming lack of concern in regard to Joffrey is to foreshadow their plan to kill him. Sansa, who has been abused by Joffrey and knows the kind of person he is, sees that the present political situation is incredibly dangerous and will inevitably lead to violence; the thing that confuses her is that the Tyrells don't see this too. What Sansa is missing is that the Tyrells were going to kill him, and that's why they were so confident about the whole thing. It's one of the ways GRRM shows us Sansa's evolving political skill. She sees part of the truth that nobody else in King's Landing, even the Lannisters, even picks up on.
  12. Why would that make a difference? If other noble houses can do it, so too can the Starks.
  13. Tell that to Maege Mormont, Anya Waynwood, Arwyn Oakheart, and Lyessa Flint, among others.
  14. You missed her internal dialogue, where she is steadfast in maintaining her affinity with her family. No, Sansa is Sansa Stark. And if she had children, they can take the Stark name, if she wants them to. Same with Arya. We were discussing the period where the family was active.
  15. She's acting as a proper lady when Loras offers flowers to the various attendees, which is part of chivalric pageantry. Again, there's no competition because Sansa hasn't been raised to pursue men. The textual evidence is that there is no evidence of it, and when she is invited into the Tyrell entourage in ASOS, she is ecstatic and remarks how much she's missed the company of women. Sansa explicitly notes in the text that she tries not to think of everybody she's lost because it makes it too hard to keep up the facade she has to maintain. The "out of sight, out of mind" moment where she's glad Jeyne is gone at the end of AGOT is anomalous with the rest of her relationship with Jeyne, and reflects her desperation at that moment to convince herself that things are normal and the situation is in hand. She's shortly disabused of that notion. Sansa does, in fact, have loyalties. Her loyalty to her family throughout her captivity in KL is a recurring theme, and she's loyal to the Tyrells (at considerable risk to herself) until they stab her in the back.