sweetsunray

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  1. They were weighing whether she could still be Joffrey's betrothed if she was the daughter of a traitor. There was no threat to her life, but to her chance of being married to Joffrey.
  2. The first time I saw it, nothing made sense. LF advizing to use Brienne, but then Sansa sends her away, and becomes utterly rude and cold to stop all discussion about it. Then Arya sounds like she went nuts and wants Sansa's face, but hands her the dagger. So, I rewatched and watched it again. But it starts with Arya applauding no one in the gallery before bringing up the letter, as if she's applauding a theater play. So, that's the cue of the commencement of Arya playing a role. She especially dogs Sansa about her fears and then says, "I'd go with anger". Arya hides the bag of faces under the bed, the same location where she herself found the letter. That seems to be on purpose. Those faces were a clue to the viewers imo: we know she has faces. Walder's face is too conspicuous, but she could have used the servant girl's face (I guess that was a face she earned in Braavos after killing the waif) to follow LF around if she wanted to. But she didn't, because she wanted LF to believe she wasn't much of a spy. She also entered her room without making a sound, so her picking and closing the lock of LF's room previous episode was noisy on purpose. Arya already questioned Sansa's loyalty to Jon. LF used the letter to make her doubt Sansa's loyalty even more: by making it appear as if Sansa had asked him to check for the letter in Luwin's archive and then suppress it. And he's using the past to remind Arya of Sansa's non-loyalty. And she's pretending to fall for it. But the empathic Arya peeps up for a moment when Sansa emotionally responds she survived a hell. She sounds almost apologetic. Which makes sense, because Sansa is truly upset and thus emotionally honest. Pretty sure that Sansa was utterly stunned when Arya handed her the dagger as harmless as possible (she turns it around and offer her the heft), after that oh-so-convincing lie of wanting her face and dresses. I also liked how Sansa was just plainly concerned over WTF has Arya gotten into when she saw the faces.
  3. Actually I think both sisters handled it well and that Arya wasn't crazy at all: Sure, it sounded like she was threatening Sansa talking about faces and dresses, but what did she actualy do? She handed the dagger to Sansa. She initiates the last scene starting the lying game, but when asked questions, she answers almost all honestly... but it's also about telling a lie and making it believable (not to Sansa, but LF who's most suredly eavesdropping behind the door). Her actions show the lie in words: she was saying one thing but actually doing the opposite. From Arya's pov this scene to me was her saying "I could kill you here and now and nobody would even know, 'cause I could wear your face and clothes and use your voice, but I'm not gonna do that, so here's the dagger. Now think, sister!" And Sansa was actually lying and dishonest about the letter she sent to Robb. Sure she was naive, a child, and stupid and manipulated by Cersei at the time of that letter, but she was not under durress. She still wanted to marry Joffrey at the time, and believed her father committed treason. And Arya can tell whether someone's lying. The show never had Sansa for once admit that she was a stupid, conceited girl back then who could throw her family under the bus, though she has in the books already. I don't care if she makes excuses to Lyanna Mormont, but to her own sister over calling their father a traitor, after lying about Joffrey's part in the Trident incident... not good. At the end of that conversation, Arya's more empathic about what she could imagine. IMO Arya's on to LF, but she had to relay the information to Sansa without revealing his scheme is blow,: confront Sansa over the letter. and then advize Sansa in an indirect way to choose anger over fear Sansa took LF aside privately over the letter, and goes directly against his advice of using Brienne. So, imo Sansa took LF aside to figure out what the fuck LF's up to. Instead of following LF's advice, Sansa does the exact opposite. Sansa sends Brienne away to prevent LF from using Brienne against either of them, and Brienne's also not the woman to pretend anything. Sansa did make herself look guilty by snooping in Arya's room, presumably to retrieve the letter, and Arya kept that bag in a place to be found easily on purpose imo. Prediction: Sansa got Arya's message of "if I really wanted to kill you, I'd have done it right here and now." Meawhile: LF is wringing his hands in anticipation and will pay for it with his life I still think the whole plotline is shit-filler though.
  4. Wondered the same thing. They left the ice lake to get those chains. Lake must have frozen over again. They made a hole and jumped in the water to put those chains around him. Man those wights are getting more handy with every wight episode.
  5. I always start my rating at 0 and show has to earn its points. This episode is imo based on outrageous plot decisions: wight hunt for Cersei + prolonging LF's life until the end of the season more like + ridiculous teleporting. Dany + Tyrion scene in map room was long and boring, and where was Varys and Missandei. 0 points, enough said. M7 Beyond the Wall: the convos on the way over were good and entertaining. They seeded and referenced loads of meta-stuff, both Sandor and Gendry. 1 point. Polar bear: good characterization, brutal, with Thoros being mauled and Sandor freezing over the burning polar bear. And several redshirts died. 1 point. Wight capture: I liked this one a lot. 1 point. Gendry running for raven (wtf didn't Jon think of bringing ravens in the first place?) + the whole battle at ice lake was ruined for me with raven + Dany flying dragons to beyond the Wall in 1 day. Only redshirts died in this. D&D altered what can kill a wight (they admitted they changed this from canon lore from the books): apparently they were fighting with dragonglass... which they never actually have the characters confirm verbally. And it just looks stupid, they can kill a skeleton with dragonglass. Not only was this battle immensely contrived with plot armor, they upped the ante by having wights carrying and using weapons, which is another deviation from the evidence in the books. So far, only one wight used a weapon in the books, which was an accidental latch on of a wight's hand onto the haft of a dagger of a NW brother and planted it in the gut. The wight in questin was already headless, so it was no more than muscle memory. Wights throttle or disembowel with bare hands. So, no usage of chains either. WTF did they get such chains from anyway? The free folk? Rubbish. Gah, and then they just made it more contrived with Jon falling in the ice lake, and Benjen making his sacrifice. Also, I should retract a point of episode 1 which I had given a 5 (so that should be a 4/10 for epi 1): they showed at least 3 looming giants walking in that army of the dead, but all of a sudden there aren't any giants in sight? They could have pulled their weight with those chains, ya know. They did manage to make me empathize with Viserion. He was always the nicest dragon. And that ice spear was brutal. NK having an ice dragon is cool (especially since most of the time I'm on #teamWW for the show. Oh, and Jon seems to have learned something from the BatB: he wanted to go for the NK, but stopped in his tracks and called a retreat. For all of that: 1 point. Winterhell plot: again I find the premisse of this plot ridiculous. Just a heart to heart with Royce would give Sansa enough to have him executed along with everything else she knows. That said, I actually liked the confrontations. And yes, Arya seemed overkill in the last scene, but she did give the dagger to Sansa. Words are wind, it are the actions that count. 1 point Jon-Dany scene: no points for all that hamfisted sweetness is just bad for my teeth. So, 5/10
  6. You did see what happened to a person when that Time Lord warped time right? If that is explaning all the teleportation, then why didn't Bran teleport Meera and himself from the cave to the Wall. He just stopped and took a break halfway just so he could meet with Uncle Benjen? Meera was out of breath at the Wall? Was that because of walking or time warping? If time warping creates someone to be out of breath, then why aren't Dany and the Dothraki heaving and breathing heavily before entering Dragonstone? Or Jon catching his breath for a moment when Tormund welcomes him at Eastwatch? And why don't they all turn into Hodors?
  7. Actually we know it took a fortnight to get from Darry to KL with the whole party. That's actually mentioned in the B chapter. And in Catelyn's chapter we know she traveled from KL to the inn in a fortnight, just her and Rodrik. Catelyn arrives in KL before Ned, and left at least 9-10 days after Ned left KL, which would be when he was crossing the barrowlands with Robert. George effed up with Tyrion's journey from the Wall to WF and then to the Inn though, because that was simply impossible, which he admitted.
  8. S2: - Have Jaime in RR as prisoner, keep Tyrion's plan to bust out Jaime, feature a second Mountain Clan man aside from Shagga who's more cunning, to use him later in the Vale. Have Tyrion let him kill someone ruthlessly or something. Have Allister show up in KL with the wight hand and be mocked by Tyrion. Just make Tyrion far more ambiguous. - Stannis-Renly: Renly more arrogant and opportunistic, have Stannis offer him heirship, and Renly defying it. - Introduce Ramsay as Reek in S2 and Rodrik's daughter who looks somewhat like Arya. - Harrenhal: have the Roose-Tywin switch at end of S2 and delay the escape for S3. She has Jaquen help her with the switch, and he reveals her his trick at HH. She decides to stay, because she believes her brother's army has HH soon. - Qarth: streamlining was fine, but make Dany less arrogant in her demands, and more trusting (another way of making her naïve). Without Quaithe. Just have her learn how much people wants dragons through the HotU. - Robb conquers a castle in the Westerlands and uses it as a base, and meets with Jeyne. Have him wounded, learn the news of Bran and Rickon and sleep with Jeyne Westerling. S3 - Ironborn: Euron murders Balon and orders the return of his relatives for a kingsmoot. Victarion abandons Moat Cailin (offscreen) and shows up, Theon is Ramsay's prisoner, Yara ignores Euron's demand and stays in Deepwood Motte (off screen). Cut back on the torture porn. Euron doesn't care. - Harrenhal: Arya sees that Roose has or uses men as horrible as the Mountain's, and decides to escape (thus introducing Locke then already, The Robb and Roose and Catelyn arrival at HH was a nonsensical scene at the show anyway). They run into the BwB. Gendry isn't sold to Mel. - Robb-Catelyn: shows up at RR married, losing the Freys, and having to deal with Karstark's murder of the boys. Have Catelyn urge for some reconcialiation with the Freys. Blackfish and Jeyne Westerling remained behind at RR, with Blackfish swearing to Robb to protect her. - KL: Sansa refuses to kneel for Tyrion for the Cloak ceremony. At the wedding night Tyrion orders her to undress, but changes his mind. Keep the marriage a cold one. S4 - Stannis: have him just be defeated and depressed, burn his uncle for betrayal, and Davos reveals the letter of the NW. They leave for Eastwatch. - Wall: Jon alerts the NW at CB of a coming attack by wildlings from the South. No, Allister nor Janos yet. No stupid plot at Craster's. Just have Bran and Meera run into some deserters on their way North and have Leaf save them and help them to the cave where they're attacked by wights. They put in filler that delayed everything for no reason. Jon buries Ygriitte after te victory, but Allister and Slynt show up and have him arrested. Mance's army arrives and they send Jon on a suicide mission to kill Mance. Stannis shows up, while Jon protects Mance's wife who's delivering his child (they can still decide to have both of them die), introduce Val here. Have LC elections with Stannis trying to win Jon by offering him WF, but Jon's elected LC. He executes Slynt. Stannis and Jon deal with Mance and Tormund. With his wife and child dead, Mance refuses to bend the knee and is burned. Stannis is making plans and sends Davos to Braavos for a loan. Tormund accepts a deal from Jon Snow to rescue Arya. Val accepts a deal to convince wildlings to help Jon defend the Wall. - Dreadfort: Keep Theon's been reekified and betraying the few remaining Ironborn at Moat Cailin. Ramsay and Roose planned to get rid of Yara at Deepwood Motte next, but the news of Stannis at the Wall and Jon Snow as LC make them decide to relocate at WF. They prop up Rodrik's daughter from WF as fake Arya and hold a wedding at WF to try and lure Jon Snow and Stannis in rescuing her. - KL: Jaime and Brienne arrive at KL just after the Purple Wedding. Casterly Rock still has gold. - Vale: Sansa lies about her identity to the lords of the Vale and corroborates LF's lies about who murdered Lysa. - RL: shorten the trek with Sandor for a few episodes. They never go to the Vale, learning that Tyrion's guy from the Mountain Clans is running amock and that Lysa Arryn died at the inn. Sandor's wounded at the inn. She leaves him where Brienne catches up with her, but the port is attacked by Roose's outlaws. She's knocked unconscious, but not without killing some of Roose's men she already met in S3. She never saw that Arya left on a ship to Braavos. She wakes up as a captive of the BwB who fought Roose's men, who also had tried to track Arya. Turns out that the BwB have a new leader - LS. Meanwhile Arya arrives at HoBaW in Braavos and wanders in. She believes she gives a man water from the pool, but he dies. She's accepted as an accolyte. - Mereen: after taking it Dany meets with issues, like the Harpy's sons. S5 North: Stannis liberates Deepwood Motte and captures Yara and moves for WF. Mel stays behind at CB with Selyse and Shyreen. Maester Aemon dies and Jon sends Sam to the Citadel. Reek meets with Tormund and spearwives who create tension through murder and helps them rescue fArya. Davos returns from Braavos to be captured by Manderly while hosting Freys, but Manderly later reveals he wants him to find Rickon. A banker of Braavos shows up at the Wall and informs about wildlings at Hardhome. Jon makes a deal with the banker. Jon goes to Hardhome with Val to convince them to come south and help him defend the Wall. Theon's handed as captive to Stannis. Roose sends an army out in a blizzard to attack Stannis. We never see the outcome of the battle. Jon returns from Hardhome with surviving wildlings SOUTH of the wall and the Pink Letter arrives. Thorne has Jon assassinated. We never see the actual battle between Stannis and Bolton army. Bran is taught by the 3ER. Braavos: Arya's seen spying in Braavos and reporting back what she learns, such as talk of illegal slavers who captured wildlings at Hardhome (before its attacked by wights), the lying game. She meets Sam or Davos in Braavos and helps them out of trouble. Have her be part of an actor's troupe, learn about disguise and play a role. Trant shows up and she murders him. She becomes the blind girl. Vale: Sansa's to wed SR as Alayne, and LF vouches to give her armies to take back the North. You can do lots here as court intrigue, especially if you have the Mountain Clans launch an attack. You have LF executed here, or not. You can have SR poisoned here or not. You have Sansa captured or not. You can insert the Hound in this. But you end it with Sansa at Royce's and his army, having to reveal her identity, and they sail for White Harbor. Reach: Sam goes to Oldtown and enters the CItadel and starts to learn stuff. Ironborn: Euron attacks the Reach. Victarion is sent to Mereen to make Dany his queen. Essos: Slavers besiege Mereen. Dany tries for peace, but flies off on Dragon and ends up in the Dothraki sea (much earlier). Meanwhile Tyrion makes his way to Mereen. He's stolen by Jorah (no greyscale). Jorah and Tyrion are taken as slave captives, but freed by Victarion who wishes to attack the slavers at Mereen to win a queen, but pretends with the Yunkai he's there to help them. He sends Tyrion in. Selmy lives and trusts Tyrion, who sets the dragons free. Together with Dothraki and Ironborn and dragons Mereen's liberated. And sail for Dragonstone. Riverlands: LS has BwB mop up Roose's outlaws and hang Freys. Brienne helps taking out leftover outlaws of Roose, but is dismayed about the hangings. She's undecided about going to KL to Jaime to tell him she failed, OR go North to kill Stannis. But Jaime has been sent to take RR from the Blackfish. He uses Edmure to get the castle, threatening him and Edmure's child. A BwB infiltrant witnesses this. And LS has Brienne lure Jaime to be taken captive. After learning what he did, she consents. LS organizes a slaughter of Freys with infiltrants of the BwB who open the doors of the castle. Brienne gives her mercy and sets Jaime free. She goes North, taking both Podrick and Gendry (after telling who his father sis). You can still have Jaime go to KL for Tommen. KL: Margaery marries Tommen. Cersei gives the HS power and sends Jaime to deal with the Blackfish, and someone to the Iron Bank to negotiate delays of payment. They're not happy. They learn of Euron's attacks to the Reach. Margaery and Loras demand to have armies sent there. Cersei orders Loras to take Dragonstone instead. He finds it abandoned and cooks up a lie for Cersei to sail with the army to meet Euron. Cersei has Margaery arrested on accusations of adultery. But Cersei ends up arrested and having to do the walk of shame. NO Dorne. S6: KL: Tommen is the popular king and shuts out Cersei from power. He cooperates with the HS, sets up peace accords with the RL Makes more sense for him to rally support against Dany's invasion, and for her not to antagonize him. He settles for an armistice and is willing to send an army North against the dead, with Jaime's backing. After receiving the message that Myrcella was assassinated in Dorne, Cersei ends up doing her thing to blow up the Sept, especially after Tyrion has the Unsullied capture Casterly Rock, that still has gold. Reach: Euron takes out Loras' fleet and Highgarden. Sam finds out the stuff he needs and with Oldtown threatened to be taken by Euron, he flees, gets Heartsbane and journeys North. Wall: Mel burns Shyreen at the Wall in the hope to resurrect the presumed dead Stannis, but ends up resurrecting Jon, and leaves with wildlings for WF. Selise hangs herself. Bran gets to the Wall and has warnings sent.Davos arrives with Rickon at Eastwatch, while the army of dead is marching to Eastwatch. When the wall falls, Rickon dies there. Send others to go fetch a wight. Winterfell: Stannis did not die in the battle, but took heavy losses. Roose got killed, leaving Ramsay to hold WF. Theon and Yara leave for Pyke to take it from Euron. Manderly and Vale armies also move for WF. Ramsay dies. Brienne kills Stannis. Jon is proclaimed KitN, and sends a plea to Dany and Tommen. Etc. Arya: She does her stick thing, gets an assignment, but instead takes a ship back to Westeros. No parcours.
  9. During the show's airing the show-part of the forum is pushed to the top, because otherwise a lot of first-time people wander onto the website and start posting show-threads in the book-forum section, where discussing the show is not allowed (plenty of book readers who don't watch the abomination and don't want to know what happens). When the season's over, the book forum will be put to the top again.
  10. Yes it is an issue. Arya isn't like her mother who makes the mistake to believe her sister to be trustworthy just because she's her sister. At her arrival at WF she knows this: Sansa wanted to be queen of 7K and was in love with Joffrey, so much that she'd rather lie about the Trident incident and throw Arya under the bus Sansa's still engaged to marry Joffrey at Ned's beheading. DId Arya see Sansa's distress and fainting while Yoren prevented her from looking? Then LF visits Harrenhal, and speaks of "after Stannis and Robb Stark are defeated", and that he met with her mother Catelyn regarding a proposal about her daughters. And before that he talks of how Margaery wants to be "queen". Next, much later, she was present at the Red Wedding, outside the Twins, where her mother and Robb were killed. While she's with the Hound she learns Sansa married Tyrion Lannister. She knows Lysa Arryn is dead at the Vale At Braavos she sees a play about the Purple Wedding, where Sansa and Tyrion are portrayed as scheming to poison Joffrey to take the throne themselves. By the time she gets to WF: Jon is absent and Sansa is Lady of WF When asked, Sansa says that yes, Arya has to call her Lady Stark now. (Has Sansa called Jon "Your Grace"?) Sansa did not murder Joffrey after all, but says she wanted to. And Arya warms to her enough to hug her sincerely. She learns LF is at WF via the dagger, but Sansa shows signs of distrusting him and explains quickly he chose to back House Stark. Some times elapses. We can assume that in that time Arya also learns off-screen that Sansa was Lady Bolton, and married seemingly voluntarily into the family involved in the Red Wedding, was mistreated, conquered WF together with Jon after a battle in which Rickon was killed by Ramsay. But also that she set his dogs on him. All would seem right by Arya: even if her sister once wanted to be queen and loved Joffrey she seemed to have gone through a hard journey, and got her family priorities straight again. Then she notices that even if Sansa goes through the motions of pointing out that Jon is king, it is not heartfelt and she was pleased that at least two lords said they'd back her as Queen in the North. Sansa is ambitious. There's nothing wrong with having ambition, but how far is Sansa willing to go for it is not an unreasonable question for Arya to have. And Sansa is not entirely honest about these feelings and desires to Arya (or herself really), which is a mistake, because it makes it look as if she's trying to hide her true motivations. Then those 2 lords seem to collude with LF and LF makes it look as if Sansa wants to suppress a letter. That letter turns out to be one of utter disloyalty to the Starks: calling their own father a traitor and asking Robb to bend the knee, praising Joffrey for she is to be his queen. Arya would be stupid to ignore this letter by merely assuming that Sansa was only young and naive at the time by herself. That's what Catelyn did with Lysa. At the very least, with such ambiguous behavior and her marrying into the family of their enemies, and LF's past and present behavior, it's normal that Arya would confront her. And if Sansa were to lie or excuse it, that's gonna look even worse. Does show-Sansa have the self-awareness and the courage to admit to Arya that she treated Arya horribly, that she was a stupid, silly, conceited girl who was so blindly in love with a monster that she rather beleaved their father to be a traitor and Cersei manipulated her ambition and desires to write such a letter? Or will she defend it as "I did what I needed to do to survive and didn't mean any of that"? The latter would be a lie. She was mistreated and a hostage and abused, but that actually happened after the letter, not during. In that sense, if LF wants chaos, he's smart to once again use Sansa's inherent ambitions to cause doubt in Arya. But on the other hand it would be just nuts to anger someone trained to be an assassin against the woman he lusts after.
  11. It's got to be cold and indeed the sun blocked some way (night, blizzard). Another thing that doesn't match up with wights: in the books they don't use or carry weapons in the on-page scenes with them. There is only the one time that a headless wight accidentally ended up having his hand around the ranger's dagger, and like muscle memory pulled it out and planted it in the black brother's gut. They just strangle or disembowel someone with their bare hands otherwise. It's something to watch out for with the upcoming episode: whether they carry swords, spears, etc and fight with them. But they're not intelligent tool using beings, except muscle memory reflexes. Dragonglass is useless against wights. D&D confirmed that they deviate from that. They're very easily destroyed by fire though. Just stuff glowing charcoal in their mouth and the blue light goes out.
  12. In other words anyone claiming they have S8 scripts before September is bullshitting. And from October on we'll start to see film location reports. Essos, Dorne and Reach is done, and KL can be done mostly as indoor set filming. And it seems that in the S7 finale, Dany will retreat from Dragonstone and move all her armies North. In other words they might not film at Spain anymore at all, which was where they had the most difficulties to prevent access to people filming acting scenes from afar with their Iphones. We'll probably know in September whether there will be filming done in Spain. That leaves Ireland and Iceland mostly for filming. They will do at least one giant epic battle with the army of the dead in what's supposed to be WF area, the size of the BatB, so that's too big a set to not have some verification about. Ireland and Iceland have tighter control on small scale filming, but allows enough to gleen some info on what outside sets might appear like.
  13. Something not being clear is a loose end and therefore a plot hole, especially given the fact they portray Arya as being at the Twins for days if not weeks, having been able to snoop around, have access to Walder's raven messages of the past with his face, etc. Just because they lampshade and handwave all their plot holes at their own inconvenience doesn't make it any less of a plot hole.
  14. He wore his black NW garb.
  15. Of course, they do have a knack at strange erratic confusing character development, and especially strange ways of exaggeration for faux cliffhanger drama. One moment Jaime is dropping in the Mariana Trench, and the next he's somehow hundred yards further along, floating, in his armor. One moment Arya is completely careless and just strolling in Braavos to admire the coloss, only to be taken by surprise with multiple stabs in the gut, drops into a canal that's practically a sewer, but all she needs is a bit of milk of the poppy and some stitches by an actress, to then do parcours being chased by a mean terminator waif, and masterfully kill her off-screen in the dark, claiming to go home and be a Stark, to then pop up at the Twins and bake Frey Pies, and have all the men die from poison, not missing a beat. Sandra doesn't trust LF, knows what he wants, refuses Brienne's service of protection, gets in a panic when she learns LF means to marry her to Ramsay Bolton, but agrees because "marrying your enemy is a good plan to avenge your dead family from within, as good as catching a wight for Cersei" (that'll show them). One moment they can do magical stuff to utter perfection to impress us, the next they bumble along for dramatic effect and are stupid, but don't worry too much and just hand wave at it for it'll all be alright, because off-screen they become super-intelligent again, but yeah, they were really stupid in the mid-section, because creepy LF is by definition a "smart man". It's just that we can't manage to make him smart without dumbing everybody else down. So, there's a very good chance that Bran didn't say anything, that Arya just bested Brienne and was showing off and those choreographed parallels are in there because it's cool, and Arya's a cartoonish spy who only managed to kill all male Freys because the Freys are stupider, but LF is a perceptive man. There's a very good chance that while Sansa doesn't trust LF at all she still runs to him for advice the moment she needs him, to then not take that advice and plot how to get rid of her sister by herself for her own survival, but just in the nick of time, she'll finally for once will realize she'd rather be rid of LF, and finally will use all the ammunition that she has. Sansa also says the right things in Jon's absence, but indeed is the least Stark and in her heart of hearts is pissed that she wasn't chosen to be QitN. Especially because she'd be better at it since she knows how to make armor, and marrying your enemy makes you an expert in the enemy and how to destroy them, after you first (almost) throw a Stark under the bus, because there's no saving them anyway. And while Arya is not good enough a spy to fool LF, she's an expert in detecting lies, especially because she knows her sister has a weakness for nice things and titles.