sweetsunray

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About sweetsunray

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  1. The above is NOT REAL WORLD genetics, as real world genetics is complex, involving a varied number of pairs of genes, with several different combinations and various hues of results. The whole basis you use to write the pedigree you listed is NON-REALISTIC, SIMPLIFIED MENDELIAN genetics, which works fine for ANY author writing out a pedigree of nobles in a family tree where the heir not looking like the standard phenotype can lead to doubts of paternity. It's not SCI-FI, but oversimplification and you can wave your hand at it with magic.
  2. Don't forget "physics", as your simplistic genetic explanation forgets to explain that genetics can only determine the amount and which type of melanin is produced in the retina: that is yellow, red and brown pigment in one layer and black or nothing in the second typed layer. It is a physical effect, not genetics of pigment, that determines what type of "structural color" the observer of eyes sees: (dark) brown eyes, blue eyes, amber, hazel, green, violet, red. Blue and green and red and violet pigment doesn't exist.
  3. Well, I think we can use "rudimentary/simplistic" genetics into explaining George's world building insofar that it's FAR MORE likely for George Martin to use some vague, simplistic Mendelian genetic conditions to paste onto whichever family tree (that is completely unrealistic) than him using real world complex genetics. After all, the author does not have a master in biology. George also wants to write semi-realistic ... with that I mean - George is writing fantasy, not scifi, but he wants it to appear real and similar to our world at "first glance". So, he's not gonna have blonde haired twins have black haired children. That would be just weird to a modern reader. And a black-haired mother isn't going to have a blonde child, an auburn haired child and a black-haired child from the same father either, without providing for some hint that this is either magically caused or some genetic trickery. Neither the average reader nor George can be expected to have knowledge of in-depth complex real-world-genetics. The average reader and George can be expected to have some rudimentary and hazy recollection of Mendelian genetics. And it is certainly to be expected that George will apply it very rudimentary to allocate the "typical" house looks, and to rudimentary mess around with it when having to write down a family tree for reference once writing. What bugs me about some genetic theories is not that they rely on Mendelian Genetics, but faux-Mendelian genetics, or worse espouse what they try to sell as a "scientific sounding theory" that completely fails even internal logic or refuses to apply logical reasoning whenever they hit the obstacle to their theory.
  4. As far as I could tell there is no need to have the mother be affected physically with some gene change in the egg cells in her ovaries ... Martells already married into the same Lyseni family as did Viserys II (around the same generation), and thus the Martells may be carriers of recessive Valyrian genes. The Targ and Valyrian features fit the descriptions of various types of albinism. Before anyone protests against Valyrians are Albinos... There are multiple types of albinism and the severity differs individual and per type. Hell you even have types that allow for cooler areas of the body to have normal melanin production (real world example - Siamese Cats), allowing for Daynes to be carriers of such a form of albinism; or a type where children can tan normally from a certain age. Not all albinism has to take the form of Bloodraven's and even he has no issues whatsoever with acuity, even though he definitely should, for his eyes are red, implying that neither layer, nor even the one serving as screen against in-falling light, of his retina has any pigment. The latter should make it impossible for him to have the acuity to shoot arrows with the acuity of a hawk, and yet he can. So, whatever you believe, George is definitely only using a fantasy-form of albinism. Notice how Daynes and Hightowers are all houses who thrived and reigned on islands, that are famous location for genetic drift and therefore allowing recessive genes to become a phenotype on islands, including spontanenous albinistic forms of mutatiation over the passed 1000 years. Genetic drift would also apply to Lys AND and the Valyrian peninsula. In Leech's original thread I worked out the family tree: I think it likely that George just happened to pick the firstborn whenever deciding appearances of mixed phenotype marriages with a Targ to have the non-Valyrian features, when the marriage had the following set-up Targ (aa) and non-Targ (aN) with a being some form of recessive albinism and N being a not-albinistic gene. Very simplistically there's a 50% chance that a child would look like a non-Targ in such a marriage (have aN), and 50 % that it does have Valyrian features (aa). But as a writer, and especially if you have a thematic thing for the "rightful heir" (aka firstborn, regardless of gender) not looking like he or she's supposed to look. When you have emperors and kings in your fantasy series, trouble logically follows whenever the heir to the throne isn't an expected "match": "it's a girl! => let's dance with dragons," or "he doesn't look like a Valyrian => His dad is a bastard, not fathered by the king! Yeah, sure full Valyrian, but wrong brother." There wouldn't be a Dance of Dragons if Viserys I's heir had been a son. Daemon Blackfyre wouldn't have been given Blackfyre if Daeron had been wed to some Valyrian looking woman or a non-Dornish and his heir Baelor hadn't looked so Dornish. Looks don't have that big an impact if you're not the heir or potential rival to the inheritance.
  5. Do you really believe that Mormont knows that Craster sacrificed his sons to the Others? I don't at all. Mormont does not know who Craster's "gods" are. Jon never fully informs Jeor about what Gilly hinted at, and the show version certainly is not the book version - no son is born to Craster when Jon is around, Jon never follows Craster, heck Jon has never even seen an Other with his own eyes by the end of aDwD. So, no, Jeor does not actually know that Craster is in an alliance with the Others... What Craster does insofar Mormont can know appears to be infanticide - leave a newborn out to die either by the cold, hunger or taken by predators. Mormont's behavior supports this is how he interpretes it. Mormont obviously does not believe that Craster's gods are any different from the seven or the old gods, or that they even exist... If he believed Craster's gods were real, he wouldn't be offering to raise the sons at the Wall. Mormont does not have the same information that Jon or the reader has on this. Mormont doesn't even close his eyes on the evil man Craster is - he explicitly tells Jon that he left the axe on the table all night for one of his wives to take it and kill Craster. While we consider infanticide morally reprehensible, it was not an uncommon practice in hunter-gathering societies: lacking modern surgical means and unrelaible birth control methods women had a high risk of ending up pregnant while they did not want a child. Unlike a full farming society, semi-sedentary hunters do not need dozen of children as cheap labor. Hunting and gathering requires long term training - training in the hunting weapon, learning the lay of the land, experience and developed intellect for strategy, memorizing plants, reocgnizing this plant from that plant and not ending up picking and cooking the poisonous berries. So, if you have a newborn who you have to teach all of that still, or an 8 year old who's beating you at a strategic game, but you only have food for one child stored away for winter, then that society will push for the 8 year old to survive over the newborn infant. To the brothers of the NW the context they see is that of infanticide. They themselves find the practice abhorrent, but understand that Craster's lifestyle and society is so different that infanticide makes the difference between only a newborn dying or a nuclear family dying. Infanticide is likely not even an uncommon practice amongst Free Folk in general (for the antropological-social reasons I already mentioned that apply in real world too). I would even say that Free Folk committing occasional infanticide is likely the reason why the Others tolerated them for so long. Craster subverted it, by making it look as if he's committing infanticide, but instead providing the Others with "sons". Nor is Craster an honest man to Mormont, whatsoever... Craster plays Mormont like a bear hunter - relying on the fact that while bears understand human tongue, they lack understanding of the double entendre.
  6. Littlefinger is a "small man". Arya describes Littlefinger as "small" when she notices him at Baelor's Sept shorlty before Ned's beheading. It doesn't make any woman above average height... though Catelyn is indeed above average height (as is Sansa)
  7. As Arya says in her first chapter of the series: girls matter And your question possible solved my questions surrounding why George has Orys Baratheon take everything Durrandon, but the name, in contrast to how Houses managed to continue their name evenif they had been in similar circumstnaces. Think House Dustin for example, House Reed... conquered and defeated, daughter taken to bride, etc... names still exist. Or think of the hint that the name Arryn precedes the Andals and thus originally was an FM name, combined with weirwood thrones and such ... as if the Andal Arryns adopted the family name of a First Men house, despite the fact that they looked down on and warred FMs. Considering all this, Orys Baratheon's pasting his name on everything Durrandon is quite unprecedented. (Funny that Argilac was called the "arrogant" one when all three men involved in the downfall of House Durrandon were arrogant). And then we have the present story of House Stark, where possibly the survival of the name House Stark will depend on the Ned's Little Girl. Do we know of any bastard of house Baratheon who might do the opposite of Orys, because he's not arrogant, and do what I propose Brandon the Builder might have done - adopt the Stark name?
  8. I think it is related to this. Bran's explanation on how the mountain clans in the North point out who's the chief of their clan suggests this strongly. And in aDwD, these clans do not just award Starks with loyalty and such respect, they do it to the name Ned, making it "The Ned" I'd say: by marrying one Brandon the Builder wasn't an Orys Baratheon. The latter is the type who takes everything: castle, only heir but female, sigil, words, but the name. There's circumstantial evidence that such a "paste my name on it, because I'm male" on important houses or clans is a rare event in the history before conquest (it is a tactic in full fashion at the moment in the series with the most greedy of houses: Lannisters, Freys, Boltons... not the best of company). And yet with all the warring and Long Night and such we can be certain that the continuing of clans and houses must have depended on the last heir quite a few times and that chances are high that such an heir was female. In fact, there are tricks and tales in the North that help Northern women in continuing their house without losing their house name to the father of their children: think of the Mormont women (Maege and Alysanne) for example. Or what about the Stark daughter and her son with Bael. What if the Last Hero was a Stark, but died, while Brandon the Builder wed the Last Hero's sister or cousin or daughter, and the continuance of the Stark name depended on her. In such circumstances, Brandon could offer to take on the Stark name, to honor his wife's clan and beloved heroic kin who sacrificed everything for humanity. So, I can go with a scenario where the Last Hero was "The Stark" according to remaining Northern Mountain Clan custom. He saved everyone, but died. The Stark clan was down to a female heir and Brandon wed her, building a castle (and a wall), and he took her name. More, let's say we accept that Brandon the Builder and his father are son and grandson of Garth: what's to say they even had a last name, or had Garth's. One of these Brandons could have been a "bastard" no? Brandon of the Bloody Blade does have a "double entendre" no? Ned's brother Brandon also liked his blade bloody. Brandon of the Bloody Blade may have been more like King Robert, and Brandon the Builder could have been one of his bastard sons who wasn't trained in war, but apprenticed by a stonemason or something.
  9. Yup, the Grasslands are depicted as the "origin" location of pretty much every society of Planetos, including possibly the First Men. Not sure whether Huzhor is indeed Hugor, let alone Azor... certainly not if we consider the thousand of years in between those cultures. Extra: Amai is actually a Dutch word, an expression that we use especially in Flanders comparable to people using "OMG!" or "wow!" or "amazing!". It's an expression that ethnically stems from the 100 year war, when English soldiers strayed into the Flemish region. Their "oh my!" was bastardized locally into the dialect word "amai!". George knows the ethnic RW origin of "amai", because he attaches the correct meaning to Huzhor Amai: the Amazing. Huzhor is suspiciously phonetically close to the Dutch "Hoezee" (which is Dutch for Hurray).
  10. Correct that the "7" colors IRL is an agreement, and it could be more using hues or less...And George can choose to adopt and apply Newton's 7 colors. Something George in fact did when he related 7 colors to 7 archetypes and a crystal is a symbol "crown" of the Faith. A similar color scheme is used in Mereen. I don't think that this means that Ghiscari are necessarily the originators of the Andal faith. Instead I guess Ghiscari and Andals both noticed rainbows and how certain pisms and pyramidic objects could scatter light into rainbow colors. Maybe the Ghiscari consider the hue between blue-green (what we in Dutch refer to as "apple-blue-sea-green") as an 8th color, similar to how we consider the hue between yellow and red "orange". But since noble families are tied to a certain pyramid and certain color, and George already used 7 colors in another culture, it seems a reasonable answer that octarchs have to do with the number of noble families in Mereen. And that Newton could have decided on 6 or 9 colors doesn't change the fact that George used the established "7 colors" in two Planetos cultures.
  11. The noble families tend to have a certain color range that they wear. Hizdar's kin for example wears a range of purple, and the pyramid from which Dany rules has purple marble and purple pillars. Other families and pyramids have a different color. The color theme is also featured in the arena for the benches. Now, if noble families and pyramids refer to a certain color, then likely there are at least 7 noble families and pyramids? So, just as the Andal 7, the Ghiscari certailnly use the 7 colors of the rainbow as well. There are 2 "colors" that are not with those 7: white and black. If we consider color as "light" diffracted by a crystal say, then the 7 rainbow colors combine together as "white light", and thus the 8th color/family would be white. If we consider color from a pigmentation angle, then mixing all the colors combines into black. Anyway, I'd say the Octarch is based on 8 families and pyramids, and thus 7 + 1 colors.
  12. The marriage is between Sam and Gilly: Gilly the girl called after a flower, who's stolen by Sam (who also donned Mormont's bearskin as Mormont dies). The mutiny ends with a bear being killed (Jeor) and a stand-in bear (Sam) rescuing/stealing/wedding the "girl".
  13. More memory-soul related examples for Ned. Where does Arya hear Ned's voice talking to her? Through the weirwood of Harrenhal, where her father is somehow tied to the memory of the HH tourney and Knight of the Laughing Tree. Even more interestingly: initially, Ned's words are the words that Arya "remembers" her father telling her. It is only when she hears her father speak a second time that we get a shift to her father talking with Arya in the HH present about the KL conversation that Arya remembered of the past before his death. Clever trick of George into confusing the reader into assuming rationally that Arya's just remembering and not actually hearing Ned. Jon's dream with Ygritte in the pool ties in with that "Maidenpool" idea of mine and how Ned's bones got lost. In any case, to Jon the weirwood with Ned's face is the WF weirwood, and the pool is the WF pool. It's a dream, but the naked woman in a pool and turning into mere bones while Ned's face has become a weirwood face definitely fits this "memory"-"bones"-"soul" triad. Hmmmm... the blood makes me consider the different results of Drogo, Beric & Catelyn, and ice wights. Many suspect that Drogo's horse spirit got pushed into Drogo (and thus Drogo lost his soul, and instead was a horse's soul in human flesh). There was a blood sacrifice of the horse (and symbolically horses often do mirror their riders or aspects of them in the books), and shadows danced in the tent - so blood magic + shadowmagic. Physically Drogo seemed to be completely fine: any damage seemed to be gone. But the memory of who Drogo was seemed to be gone. Beric & Catelyn have trouble remembering their life and are vastly focused on their last missions, emotions and experiences of their life. So, they have a "soul" but one with "tunnel vision". While the damage "seals" (at least with Beric), it is still visible and present and a handicap or a dent or scar. But their blood runs somehow. Might be black blood, but it gets pumped around (I don't want to imagine how that at all works with LS's cut throat... I'm getting Monty Python & Holy Grail images when I follow that thoughtline). The wights under Others' control do not physically heal at all. There's not even scar tissue. The blood certainly doesn't run, but pools into the extremities (hands and feet) udner influence of gravity, and they don't seem to remember anything, other than perhaps muscle memory. Hence they are soulless. Beric and LS are called fire wights, but I'm pretty sure there's some weirwood related magic going on there, and they still have some memories, a personality too, and their blood doesn't pool into the extrimities like the ice wights. In other words - blood and soul may be tied more than we think. Maybe what's so damaging to Beric and LS is the fact that they are severely traumatized: the physical trauma is related to their emotional trauma. You can be as strong, confident or at peace with yourself as possible, but the moment you go through a severe physical trauma or shock this will impact you emotionally in a way you have no control over. The resulting emotion and behavior may differ greatly between individuals, but it will affect anyone. I suspect that is why their souls are so damaged. Worse, they can never truly recover from the soul trauma, because they don't truly heal, and thus their souls are "warped".
  14. Agreed - When Lady Barbrey reminisces of Brandon, her admiration for him, etc she sounds like the ex-love affair on the side who still tells herself that her lover would have left his wife, but didn't for the children and then he died in some car accident. More this lover also boasted to her about how he loves to shag women. In one paragraph, Lady Barbrey declares Brandon to be a player, a conquerer of girls, declares how he boasted about it to her, and she looks down on the "other women" (because he fooled them all), but it was "true love" between Brandon and herself. Yeah, right... Chances that Barbrey's beliefs about Brandon's feelings for her and how he does not want Cat are true are 0.0000000000001%
  15. Which of course derives of the cursed Gold of the NIbelungen. Tolkien borrowed the "golden ring" motif of the Nibelungen hoard (as well as Smaug on his stolen hoard in the Hobbit), but as a "gold mine" you have the "hoard" aspect. For those unfamiliar with it: The Nibelungenlied is most famously rewritten into Operas by Wagner. It's actually a Northern Saga, that has been retold in several versions, including in the Germania area, and eventually set in a historical context of the kingdom of Burgandy and Saxons and the Huns. At the heart of the deadly drama is a gold hoard/treasure of a people called the Nibelungen. The Nibelungen are a people of mist and shadow (ghostly, ethereal). And this giant hoard of golden treasure belonged to them, including a ring. The wearer of the ring is the "owner" of the hoard. Only the Nibelungen as a group can safely own it. Anyone who is not a Nibelung who keeps the hoard or takes something from it for themselves will eventually find their death. For example, one of the Nibelungs was a dwarf and he wanted the hoard for himself. The Nibelungs are immortals, but they cast this dwarf out and made him mortal. He plots to have other people fetch the hoard for him (sort of like Jafar tries to use Aladin). His actions caused a dragon Fafnir to steal the hoard. Fafnir terrorizes the kingdom of Burgandy and a hero volunteers to liberate Burgandy from the dragon's terror. This is Siegfried/Sigurd (depending on the versions and iterations). He manages to get into the dragon lair and kill Fafnir with his magical sword. He used the dragon blood to drench himself to protect himself from any future harm (a leaf drops onto his back and the dragon blood never touched that area, so he's vulnerable there), and finds the hoard. The NIbelungen appear, thank him for slaying the dragon and ask him to return the hoard back to them, warning him not to take anything from the hoard, because if he does it will invoke a curse onto him. He completely ignores their advice, takes the ring and thus takes ownership of the hoard, has the hoard moved and stowed away in the castle of the king of Burgandy. Everybody recognizes it's Siegfried's treasure, but the king of Burgandy and his sister want to keep the treasure in Burgandy and have Siegfried become an ally through marriage. His heart is pledged already to Brunhilde/Gudrun (shieldmaiden/queen of Iceland/former Valkyrie turned human), but through a magical potion Kriemhilde (the sister of the kng of Burgundy) makes Siegfried fall in love with her and forget the woman he loved. Meanwhile the king of Burgandy wants to wed Brunhilde/Gudrun himself. There's only one problem: she set a tough test, knowing that only Siegfried can succeed in it. The king has Siegfried wear a disguise (so it appears to Brunhilde that Siegfried looks like the King of Burgundy) and succeed in the test. This is how Brunhilde is tricked into marrying the king of Burgundy, and how Siegfried was tricked into marrying the king's sister - for the gold and because both royals try to use deception to get what they want without ever considering the feelings , promises and desires of the other two. More, they're both so arrogant and entitled about it that they easily betray their deception. When Brunhilde learns how Siegfried deceived and betrayed her, she has her husband vow to have him killed. But she then learns how Siegfried was tricked himself with a magical potion and she commits suicide on his pyre. Kriemhilde ends up wedding Atilla the Hun and uses him to avenge the murder of Siegfried (and her children) by warring her brother. Anyway: the Nibelungen were right...the gold is cursed. And Kriemhilde and her brother initially seem decent Christians, but are completely without shame and honor, very selfish beings...not unlike the Lannisters. I certainly think you could argue that the Casterlys have something akin to the Nibelungen (including disappearing), and the Lannisters to the ambitious Burgandy royals. In the Nibelungenlied version of Wagner there's also another advising character who faithfully "serves" Burgundy - Hagan. He's the plotter, giving Kriemhilde the potion, and helping the king into finding the arguments to convince Siegfried into playing along with the deception of Burnhilde. I think LF and Hagan have some similiarties too. I wrote an essay about Craster and how much he compares to the claims of evil like the Blood Emperor a year ago: https://sweeticeandfiresunray.com/2016/08/30/crasters-black-blooded-curse/ it's more from the angle of bears and rams (and a bear curse), suggesting an answer to what happened at the very least to Benjen's fellow brothers and how Craster may be involved with that, the many hints of how he practices cannibalism, and also provides the evidence that Craster never established guest right per custom at all, except once, and that one time he did do everything that set up guest right, he was hte first to break it. Now that is indeed very interesting.