Are Stannis Fans conservatives?

[Fanless Mace]

Theory: Stannis appeals more to those who tend to like conservative political candidates and politics in real life, and he is less appealing to those who tend toward the liberal side. (For the record, I'm trying not to say that either conservatism or liberalism is better, but for full disclosure, I will let you know I am both a liberal and NOT a Stannis man):

1. Law and Order:
Conservatives tend to like justice that is meted out in black and white, with no nuance. For instance, conservatives in America back "three strikes" laws and strict Sentencing Guidelines that eliminate the ability of judges to consider mitigating circumstances. We see a similar approach to justice when Stannis cuts of Davos' fingers for smuggling offenses even as he knights him for saving the day via said smuggling. In the same vein, Stannis's respect for the rule of law is what compels him to seek the throne; he is guided by duty and honor, it would seem, more than by desire. I'm not even sure he WANTS to be king, he just knows pursuing his birthright is the right thing to do. Stannis's respect for the legal rights of succession is so significant that it drives him to righteous (he would say) fratricide - again, a black and white solution to his brother's intransigence (somehwat akin to invading Iraq?). In general, Stannis follows the letter of the law, with little wiggle room. And the liberals cringe.

2. Religious subservience

Of all the contenders for the throne, none is more devout than Stannis. He is the only one who turns to a spiritual advisor with any regularity, and he will not make a move without deeply considering Mel's input. True, Stannis is not so dogmatic as to become a puppet, but consider that he turned his entire focus to the North at barely a word from Mel; the big decisions come from R'hollor via Mel, and Stannis governs as a servant of the lord. In the US, at least, most politicians who likewise allow significant religious dogmatic intrusion into their daily deliberations, and those who speak most vehemently about the rule of the lord taking precedence over the rule of man, they tend to be conservatives. And in fact, it is generally conservatives who make an issue of including more religion in civic life - witness US rightwing-led legislation to curb the incursion of Sharia law (um, yeah, right), fights to post copies of the 10 Commandments on courtroom walls and to allow prayer in schools, and de facto litmus tests for national candidates who must prove their Jesus-Is-My-God bona fides (yes, the left candidates need to do this too...mostly to attract, or at least not repel, religiously-conservative independents).

In all of this, I am trying to avoid too much of a judgment call - I certainly respect Stannis more than I do many actual conservative politicians (I find him more deliberative and willing to solicit other opinions than many real politicians seem). But let me leave it with this:

POLL

Are you a Stannis-is-the-rightful-king person? And if so do you tend towards conservatives? Or, are you anti-Stannis, and do you tend towards liberalism?

[Beorn Snow]

You raise interesting points.

Clearly Kings Landing is a liberal haven with all the moon-tea abortions going on.

(Just kidding. I´m from Iceland and am probably a wildly socialist person by american standards, still pro-Stannis most days, although I´m sure he won´t win).

[The Weirwoods Eyes]

Not read through yet as need to go get the kids from school, But I'm Stanis indifferent and very left wing.

[Fanless Mace]

Clearly Kings Landing is a liberal haven with all the moon-tea abortions going on.

I suspect Stannis would do something about that...

[OnionAhaiReborn]

I love Stannis. I don't base that on 'Stannis-is-the-rightful-King,' but I think he's a great character and I'm willing to defend him in a lot of ways (though not all). I'm definitely not conservative.

[Chaircat Meow]

And the liberals cringe.

You buy Stannis really doesn't want the throne just because he says so? You think he's genuinely devout and not just using Mel for his ambitions? Moreover, being interested in impartial justice and possessing a genuine sense of religion are hardly exclusively conservative traits.

POLL

Are you a Stannis-is-the-rightful-king person? And if so do you tend towards conservatives? Or, are you anti-Stannis, and do you tend towards liberalism?

I consider myself Stannis-neutral and I'm relatively conservative, although I'm British, so that will make me more left-wing than many in the American republican party.

[The Dornishman's Widow]

I hold a generally favourable view of Stannis, and an extremely unfavourable view of conservative politics.

You gave very valid points about what could attract conservatives to Stannis, but I do think he also has several things to offer us lefties as well. In particular I get a strong equality vibe from him: He doesn't like the nobility and the powerful bending the law that should be for everyone, while valuing the advice of morally upright lowborn Davos much higher than that of his better born but corrupted/immoral/stupid peers, which proves a higher level of open mindedness than you'd think at first glance.

[E-Ro]

No. This thread has been done before and it's always a stealth attack on stannis and his fans. I love stannis a lot and it has nothing to do with my real life political views.(I'm def not conservative)

Also how is stannis the most devout? He's an atheist.(same as me) he says he stopped believing in gods when his parents died. And that all justice and goodness in the world comes from men not gods.

[Fire and Blood!]

I'm quite conservative and one of the most anti-Stannis people on this forum. By the way his religion is one of the things I hold against him, I am a religious person myself but I strongly oppose all who try to force a foreign religion on a native populace.

[The Drunkard]

Can you explain the Iraq part?

Anyway, I really disagree with the alleged devoutness of Stannis. He makes his opinion of religion very clear in (I think) the first Davos chapter; he doesn't care for any gods that would let the world turn out the way it has, but he recognizes Melisandre's power. In regards to the North, it was at Davos' word that he went to the Wall, and that was to battle the wildlings first and foremost. Melisandre had been harping on about the real enemy being to the North and the WOTFK being relatively minor for a while, but Stannis was still intent on uniting the realm and taking the throne first. And then there's Edric, where it took almost an entire book's worth of convincing to get him to strongly consider it after starting out completely opposed to the idea, nevermind Mel's/Selyse's/Axell's insistence.

I voted for Australia's Labour party in the recent election (which would be our more left-wing party of the two major ones), but my views tend to be more aligned with a group in our more right-wing party that doesn't seem to have much say anymore. I have no idea what this makes me in American terms.

[Arthur Dayne's Honor]

I'm more Liberal in most regards than conservative and I'm fond of Stannis.

[Bob Sacamano]

I am a Stannis fan. People would call me conservative, but that's a loaded term. But my opinion varies on the respective topic.

[Northbound]

Oh boy! Talk about a thread that could get heated quickly! :leaving:

For the record and people can take it how they wish. I'm a U.S citizen, served in the Army for 6 years and now a Wildlife officer in the State of Florida(Law Enforcement). I do not belive in religon. I can not stand the GOP or Tea Party("conservatives").

BUT I LOVE STANNIS!

[Ser_Cortnay_Penrose]

I would say that American conservatives and Stannis Baratheon are both generally: not at all compassionate toward the needy and suffering, willing to engage in war to achieve a political ends, resolute and unwavering "constitutionalists" in the sense that the prioritize the word of the law over the human judgements of right and wrong.

Now, I've siad repeatedly, and will say again, that Stannis is not the stoic executer of and objective law and duty that he so loudly purports to be, and that GRRM has given us many clues to that. I believe Stannis will cave at the moment of truth, when all eyes on are him, and it will be his downfall. And in that way, he very much resemble a liberal politician, hahahah

[Neilos]

Stannis is not devout. He believes what he sees-- and when he saw something in the flames, he concluded there was power there. He gave up belief in the gods, he said himself, and there's not been any solid reason to think he's changed. He sees power in Melisandre, not divinity.

I'm pretty much a Stannerman, and I'm left-wing IRL.

[Fanless Mace]

No. This thread has been done before and it's always a stealth attack on stannis and his fans.

My interest is purely sociological, I'm not here to bash Stannis or his fans. I may be wrong, but I'm sincere in my interest.

As for "this thread has been done before," perhaps; but with thousands of new visitors to the site every year who want to have dialogue, we get to rehash stuff.

[BitsOfBrains]

I guess I am a sort of independent, but I probably vote for the more liberal candidate 70/30.

I like Stannis as a character, but i think I would hate living under his rule.

Religious extremism, legislating morality, victim blaming, etc.

[Lord Jennings]

I am a Stannis fan. People would call me conservative, but that's a loaded term. But my opinion varies on the respective topic.

Well put - I'll throw my hat in that ring.

[Fire and Blood!]

By the way maybe I should have noted that I'm a Bulgarian and being conservative by our standards may not be the same as conservative by U.S. standards.

[Northbound]

Personally, I have no idea how people can call themselves either Liberal or Conservative. No one person, is one or the other.