Aegon is real

[RoamingRonin]

Doesn't matter if Aegon's head was smashed in or not. Varys could still present (f)Aegon as the real deal. That detail doesn't matter.

[Sordelor]

Because she didn't know that it was fake to begin with?

And Varys didn't need Elia or Rhaenys, only a prince to mold into the perfect ruler, Elia and Rhaenys are too old, and they're women (not that i'm a misogynist or something, it's just the way Westeros works.)

1. You can see the difference between your own child and a random baby.

2. E+ R could help prove Aegon's real.

[Neilos]

I mentioned some time ago why I'm still leaning towards Aegon being legitimate.

Primarily, my reason is that thematically, it would be far more interesting were he real. Look at it from the point of view of Daenerys' story arc. Defeating a false claimant would be... essentially meaningless to her character progression. But coming up against a legitimate Targaryen heir...?

I think Aegon's purpose in the story is to demonstrate to Daenerys that legitimacy does not come from bloodline or family name; it comes from life experience and judgement. She still clings to the idea of 'Targaryen' as the rightful ruler of Westeros. Aegon, being legitimate Targaryen, demonstrates the falseness of that notion.

He is still the 'mummer's dragon'. Being Targaryen does not make you a dragon, after all, as we know from Viserys. Aegon is the same, a Targaryen, but a shallow and entitled little brat who will demonstrate to Daenerys that wisdom matters more than blood.

[Chatty Duelist]

1. You can see the difference between your own child and a random baby.

2. E+ R could help prove Aegon's real.

She was scared and in panic, how do you expect her to recognize him when's being raped by Gregor?

And it wasn't a random baby, it was a baby with Valyrian features.

And you're probably still going to say no but why?

Why don't you want him to be real? Do you think Martin will be a douchebag for doing that? For bringing a player this late into the game?

I am of the opinion that he is real.

[Ygrain]

Because she didn't know that it was fake to begin with?

Have you ever taken a close look at a one-year-old?

There is no way she wouldn't have recongized her own child of that age.

[Sordelor]

I mentioned some time ago why I'm still leaning towards Aegon being legitimate.

Primarily, my reason is that thematically, it would be far more interesting were he real. Look at it from the point of view of Daenerys' story arc. Defeating a false claimant would be... essentially meaningless to her character progression. But coming up against a legitimate Targaryen heir...?

I think Aegon's purpose in the story is to demonstrate to Daenerys that legitimacy does not come from bloodline or family name; it comes from life experience and judgement. She still clings to the idea of 'Targaryen' as the rightful ruler of Westeros. Aegon, being legitimate Targaryen, demonstrates the falseness of that notion.

He is still the 'mummer's dragon'. Being Targaryen does not make you a dragon, after all, as we know from Viserys. Aegon is the same, a Targaryen, but a shallow and entitled little brat who will demonstrate to Daenerys that wisdom matters more than blood.

Hope you don't want to say Dany is immune to fire?

[Sordelor]

She was scared and in panic, how do you expect her to recognize him when's being raped by Gregor?

She was allready with him before that.

[Chatty Duelist]

She was allready with him before that.

He was in his bed, she didnt go to him until she heard banging at the door.

Have you ever taken a close look at a one-year-old?

There is no way she wouldn't have recongized her own child of that age.

Yes i have, and boy do they look alike(Privacy reasons i'm not going to elaborate) . Especially when they have the same blood in their veins.

[Neilos]

Hope you don't want to say Dany is immune to fire?

Heh, no, not at all. I think "dragon" simply refers to somebody with the mettle and good judgement to lead (in the same sense that Jorah used the term: "Rhaegar was the last dragon, Viserys [and Aegon] is less than the shadow of a snake").

That's why Aegon is a 'mummer's dragon'. Not because he isn't a Targaryen, but because he's shallow, inexperienced, entitled, and gung-ho.

[Ygrain]

He was in his bed, she didnt go to him until she heard banging at the door.

Yes i have, and boy do they look alike.

Boy, you don't have a child of your own, do you?

[Sordelor]

Heh, no, not at all. I think "dragon" simply refers to somebody with the mettle and good judgement to lead (in the same sense that Jorah used the term: "Rhaegar was the last dragon, Viserys [and Aegon] is less than the shadow of a snake").

Then it's all right :)

[Jon's Queen Consort]

She was scared and in panic, how do you expect her to recognize him when's being raped by Gregor?

And it wasn't a random baby, it was a baby with Valyrian features.

So you think that a mother doesn't know how her child look like?

[Chatty Duelist]

Boy, you don't have a child of your own, do you?

Not of my own, but my youngest brother is a baby, and my younger brother (another one) looked exactly like him at his age.

Plus even if Elia went all:

"Come here sweetie, WAIT A SECOND! YOU'RE NOT MY BABY!, DAFUQ IS THIS? I'M GETTING OUT OF HERE! *The Mountain and Co enter the room* HO SHIT! DAFUQ! OMG OMG OMG!!!!!"

Yes i think i've illustrated my point.

Even if she realized that he was fake, it was too late.

[Mladen]

That's why Aegon is a 'mummer's dragon'. Not because he isn't a Targaryen, but because he's shallow, inexperienced, entitled, and gung-ho.

I have to ask where did you get that Aegon is shallow and entitled.

Yes i have, and boy do they look alike(Privacy reasons i'm not going to elaborate) . Especially when they have the same blood in their veins.

So, Varys didn't actually just find any boy, he also found boy with Targaryen blood. Oh, dear logic, why have you abandoned this thread?

[Sordelor]

Not of my own, but my youngest brother is a baby, and my younger brother (another one) looked exactly like him at his age.

Plus even if Elia went all:

"Come here sweetie, WAIT A SECOND! YOU'RE NOT MY BABY!, DAFUQ IS THIS? I'M GETTING OUT OF HERE! *The Mountain and Co enter the room* HO SHIT! DAFUQ! OMG OMG OMG!!!!!"

Yes i think i've illustrated my point.

Even if she realized that he was fake, it was too late.

Varys 'switched' the babys before Tywin conquered the city, I think.... I'm not shure about this tugh.

[RoamingRonin]

Not of my own, but my youngest brother is a baby, and my younger brother (another one) looked exactly like him at his age.

Plus even if Elia went all:

"Come here sweetie, WAIT A SECOND! YOU'RE NOT MY BABY!, DAFUQ IS THIS? I'M GETTING OUT OF HERE! *The Mountain and Co enter the room* HO SHIT! DAFUQ! OMG OMG OMG!!!!!"

Yes i think i've illustrated my point.

Even if she realized that he was fake, it was too late.

I lost it. Oh my God, this is my favorite post of all time.

[Fabio81]

But Elia could have agreed to the switch, especially if it happened moments before her room was busted.

[Sansa_Stark]

But that still means he has no right to the IT as that puts Dany ahead of him in the line of succession along with Jon. After them it is Stannis, according to the laws of inheritance. Aegon is dead last for the IT.

What if Daeron was a bastard the whole time?

What if the Blackfyres were the real heirs?

Do the same rules apply?

[Chatty Duelist]

I have to ask where did you get that Aegon is shallow and entitled.

So, Varys didn't actually just find any boy, he also found boy with Targaryen blood. Oh, dear logic, why have you abandoned this thread?

I didn't say he found a baby with Targy blood, a boy with Valyrian features suffices.

And Mummer's Dragon?

Varys was a Mummer.

Aegon is a Dragon

Hence Mummer's Dragon!

"FEAR MY SUPERIOR LOGIC MORTAL AND DESPAIR!!!"

But Elia could have agreed to the switch, especially if it happened moments before her room was busted.

Mayhaps.

Varys 'switched' the babys before Tywin conquered the city, I think.... I'm not shure about this tugh.

During, if Varys knew about the wildfire plot, he probably also knew what would make Aerys snap to use it.

So gets one of his spies to switch the babies at the last second and boom! There you have it.

[Mladen]

But Elia could have agreed to the switch, especially if it happened moments before her room was busted.

And she was clinging to the fake baby instead of looking for her own daughter?

I didn't say he found a baby with Targy blood, a boy with Valyrian features suffices.

And Mummer's Dragon?

Varys was a Mummer.

Aegon is a Dragon

Hence Mummer's Dragon!

"FEAR MY SUPERIOR LOGIC MORTAL AND DESPAIR!!!"

Yeah, because every baby in King's landing have Valyrian features. Again, Varys is not a mummer, he is a prophet, according to you.