"Dracarys," or, "Be careful with that word ..."

[tze]

“Freedom!” she sang out. “Dracarys! Dracarys!”

“Dracarys!” they shouted back, the sweetest word she’d ever heard. “Dracarys! Dracarys!” And all around them slavers ran and sobbed and begged and died, and the dusty air was filled with spears and fire.

Dany specifically mentions the air filling with "fire" after the Unsullied start yelling "dracarys". Given that Astapor, which seemed to wonderful the first time around, looks so very different in retrospect, it would make a certain amount of sense for the specific thing that makes Dany feel so triumphant here (the slaves yelling "dracarys" and the air filling with fire) to actually be a harbinger of (unforeseen to Dany) terrible things in the future. Not just because we know the dragons' destructive power will grow as they do, but also because the dragons are breathing fire here as the "dracarys" command is yelled by people other than Dany.

I think it worked for Jorah cause Viserion doesn't have a rider.

Also only Viserion responded, and Viserion has been shown to be the dragon that looks likely to bond to someone easily compared to Rhaegal.

Drogon (who I believe is bonded to Dany) for instance just responded to the word but didn't unleash flame.

Actually, I think there could be another explanation. The first "dracarys" scene comes right as the dragons first start breathing fire. That's why Dany mentions "I won’t need to char their meat over a brazier any longer"---prior to this, she'd had to do just that to get the dragons to eat. As Drogon chars and eats a piece of meat, Dany casually mentions

“Stop that, Rhaegal,” Dany said in annoyance, giving his head a swat. “You had the last one.

Then Jorah says "dracarys", all three dragons turn, and Viserion---the one dragon that apparently hadn't breathed fire in the closely preceding moments---breathes fire. This would be very consistent with the idea that the dragons' capability of breathing fire has limits (particularly here, as they're just learning to breathe fire). Viserion breathes fire while Drogon and Rhaegal do not simply because Viserion is the only one of the three that hasn't breathed fire in the immediately preceding moments. Drogon and Rhaegal don't breathe fire because both are still in their respective "refractory periods".

That would also line up with what happens with Grazdan. When Dany says "dracarys", all three dragons try to respond, but Drogon is the only one to actually succeed:

Dany shrugged, and said, “Dracarys.”

The dragons answered. Rhaegal hissed and smoked, Viserion snapped, and Drogon spat swirling red-black flame.

It is rather weird that Rhaegal and Viserion, who we know will respond to the "dracarys" command with fire, respond in a way here that doesn't involve actual fire. Particularly that Rhaegal "hiss[es] and smoke". It's like he's trying and almost succeeding, while Viserion is trying but not succeeding at all. If the point is that dragons don't have limitless supplies of fire, but have to replenish themselves (with food, rest, what have you), then what we've been seeing hasn't been a dragon responding more strongly to any certain person's command, but rather the dragons responding when each of them is physically capable, which isn't necessarily all the time.

Unless im missing something, any rider MUST have blood of the dragon.

You're missing the fact that "only Targaryens can ride dragons" looks very likely to be pure BS. Saying the "dragonseeds" prove you need Targ blood to ride a dragon, because they had Targ blood and rode dragons---while the only evidence they had Targ blood was the fact that they rode dragons---is pretty circular logic.

I think she probably chose valayrian because it was from her heritage, and given the people in her "khalasar" at the time, valayrian was not really the common tongue. She had a mixed group, so using Dothraki, or the common tongue, would have been dumbass.

I think a strong factor was the fact that she chose "dracarys" back when she was still heading for Westeros. Things became (really) problematic when she decided to stick around in Essos, a place where High Valyrian was far more commonly used than in Westeros. That said, even in Westeros High Valyrian isn't necessarily a smart choice for a command, because the nobility and the maesters are more likely to understand High Valyrian than, say, Dothraki or the dialects of the Free Cities.

More likely because it is the language of Valyria, from whence the dragons came?

Anyway, why would a dragon understand a word without being trained to do so? As I mentioned, there is an implication that there is some sort of genetic language memory.

As in, I trained my dogs to sit when I say Fffft. Or go to their bed when I say Sleepytime. That's the language they know, and I chose these words because I'm the boss.

The dragons didn't understand "dracarys" "without being trained to do so". Dany specifically says she chose "dracarys" to train them, not that she realized they would breathe fire whenever she randomly said "dracarys".

If the Valyrians did use verbal commands (which is far from certain, but for the sake of argument), I'd be amazed if they chose "dracarys" as a trigger word. That would have been asking for disaster.

Nettles is ambiguous. Presumably that was to create doubt in the mind of the reader, so we would be having debates as we are now.

All of the "dragonseeds" are ambiguous, not just Nettles. I'm pretty sure that's the entire point.

[LordStoneheart]

So I think regarding all this, my take is that Daenerys' choice of Dracarys isn't necessarily bad. I know there are a lot of Valyrian speakers around but I think the dragons will ultimately only listen to Dany and those around her that they are familiar with. I don't think any random person will be able to walk in front of them and order Dracarys.

I think this can be a problem if the people Daenerys allows the dragons to be close to pose a threat to her. like what if Jorah gets back to her, gets rejected again, and decides to use a little dragonfire on his own?

He would not outright lie. There's being ambiguous and then there's lying. He doesn't lie.

Agreed. in fact, I've never really seen him say "this is true/untrue" about most theories and questions.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Absolutely not a lie..."dragonriders need not be Targ", a very calculated comment to throw off the readers. Jon will presumable ride soon??? Probably long before his lineage is discovered?

And Jon is a Targaryen, whether his heritage is revealed at the time he rides a dragon (if he does) or not. That is not the same as a non-Targaryen riding a dragon.

[yolkboy]

Absolutely not a lie..."dragonriders need not be Targ", a very calculated comment to throw off the readers. Jon will presumable ride soon??? Probably long before his lineage is discovered?

Where's the quote for this??

IIRC Grrm said THE THIRD HEAD need not be a Targ. (Correct me if wrong).

This, to me is NOT the same as saying a dragonrider need not be a Targ.

Third head=dragonrider is an assumption certain readers have made,

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Dany specifically mentions the air filling with "fire" after the Unsullied start yelling "dracarys".

Hey, so maybe they were obeying the "order" after all.

But god you guys what is the point of all this?!

Where's the quote for this??

IIRC Grrm said THE THIRD HEAD need not be a Targ. (Correct me if wrong).

This, to me is NOT the same as saying a dragonrider need not be a Targ.

Third head=dragonrider is an assumption certain readers have made,

This too.

[PatrickStormborn]

And yet here you are.

Well... duh? I read the OP because I thought it might argue something I hadn't heard before. But, considering that other people using "dracarys" to command the dragons was a huge plot point, of course I'm underwhelmed.

The Unsullied shouted Dracarys as Dany did, so it went along with her plan. The point of the thread it to consider what happens when someone shouts Dracarys when Dany doesn't want dragonfire everywhere.

I'm sorry I had to type that out for you.

Thanks for being rude about it, but I already addressed that in my original post. There's no narrative purpose for anyone to use "dracarys" against Daenerys, unless they had already taken her other two dragons, in which case using "dracarys" against her would be the least of her problems.

[Aerys Ahai Reborn]

But didn't GRRM already say the third rider didn't have to be a Targ?

In the HotU, Rhaegar says the dragon has three heads. Dany interprets this to mean three dragon riders. GRRM said that one of the three heads does not necessarily need to be a Targ.

Now, did Rhaegar - who was wrong with tPtwP prophesy twice (himself and Aegon) - know whatever his "three heads" meant? Did he know there would be dragons back into the world and these three heads would ride them? Are the three heads even three different people?

[Lord Rahvin]

yeah don't know how we went off of tangent... not surprised.

[PatrickStormborn]

But didn't GRRM already say the third rider didn't have to be a Targ? Maybe OP is onto something, and language is the first bonding key.

He said that the dragon has three heads, "but the third head will not necessarily BE a Targaryen", implying that the first two heads of the dragon will be Targaryens, and the third head will have Targaryen blood but not identify as a Targaryen (whether that's because of being a bastard, offspring of a Blackfyre/other Targaryen branch, or identifying with a different house remains to be seen).

[WeaselPie]

In the HotU, Rhaegar says the dragon has three heads. Dany interprets this to mean three dragon riders. GRRM said that one of the three heads does not necessarily need to be a Targ.

Now, did Rhaegar - who was wrong with tPtwP prophesy twice (himself and Aegon) - know whatever his "three heads" meant? Did he know there would be dragons back into the world and these three heads would ride them? Are the three heads even three different people?

Well, three dragons, three "heads of the dragon"... I somewhat side with Dany on the interpretation that there will be three riders.

As for Rhaegar, maybe dragons being reborn was part of the prophecy? Dunno.

But yes, I do think the three heads of the dragon are three different people, and not a metaphor. We have enough characters to accomplish this, don't we? :)

ETA my point about language is that there are only a few characters said to know Valyrian, which might point to one of the "dragon riders" if this is what is meant by "heads of the dragon

[RoamingRonin]

Let it be known she was still in the process of training her dragons. It was clearly something new she had been working on seeing as how Ser Jorah wasn't even aware (and we know how much he clings). Her dragons were also young at the time. But since it's Daenerys Targaryen we're talking about, perfection is expected immediately.

On another note... It seems kind of I dunno, stupid, to believe there's a chance someone might approach Dany nonchalantly and say, "Hey, girl! It's hot as dracarys out here" and Drogon will set the nearest living thing on fire.

[Illusion]

At that stage the dragons had just learned responding to Dracarys meant food, greediness had already been observed.

Dany softly said the command and Jorah expressed the same word in a similar fashion.

People who have familiarity or a relationship with an animal can have influence but many only fully respond to the owner or 'master' entirely. As for 'attack' commands the animal has to see a perceived threat to persue. Animals have their own minds and are capable of assessing whether to obey or not, particularly by someone who is a stranger.

So, no, highly doubt just anyone could shout, speak or whisper Dracarys and the dragons will respond. Otherwise they would be pointless in the first place.....

Police Dog Handler to Attack Dog: SEIZE.....dog attacks criminal

Criminal to Attack Dog: SEIZE......dog attacks Handler

Pointless and not going to happen..... why would it happen with the dragons?

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

At that stage the dragons had just learned responding to Dracarys meant food, greediness had already been observed.

Dany softly said the command and Jorah expressed the same word in a similar fashion.

People who have familiarity or a relationship with an animal can have influence but many only fully respond to the owner or 'master' entirely. As for 'attack' commands the animal has to see a perceived threat to persue. Animals have their own minds and are capable of assessing whether to obey or not, particularly by someone who is a stranger.

So, no, highly doubt just anyone could shout, speak or whisper Dracarys and the dragons will respond. Otherwise they would be pointless in the first place.....

Police Dog Handler to Attack Dog: SEIZE.....dog attacks criminal

Criminal to Attack Dog: SEIZE......dog attacks Handler

Pointless and not going to happen..... why would it happen with the dragons?

Actually, I'm pretty sure that a lot of police officers in, say, the U.S. will use German commands for their dogs for that very reason, at least in part to keep criminals from getting a feel for what specific commands mean.

I'm also curious as to why the dragons seem to have responded to the Unsullied's use of "dracarys."

[WeaselPie]

Actually, I'm pretty sure that a lot of police officers in, say, the U.S. will use German commands for their dogs for that very reason, at least in part to keep criminals from getting a feel for what specific commands mean.

I'm also curious as to why the dragons seem to have responded to the Unsullied's use of "dracarys."

Reminds me of how Rosie in Water for Elephants only knew her commands in Polish....

[Dany Girl]

I'm just going to throw this out there as far as training goes:

Mu boyfriend had a dog before we got together, this dog is very well trained. He listens to everything he's told to do by people he sees as an authority to him, but if Jonathan gives a contradictory command then say me, he'll listen to Jonathan over me every time. My dad can get him to sit when Jonathan approves or doesn't contradict the command, but if Jonathan tells him to do something different, the dog always listens to Jonathan.

I believe the same will likely occur with a dragon (it's really just an overgrown fire breathing flying dog after all :) ). Whomever the dragon "belongs" to will have absolute authority over the dragon, but those close to that person may also be able to command them to some extent. Drogo will likely listen only to Dany as they're bonded, but Viserion and Rhaegal will have more flexibility until they bond to someone. I hope that makes sense.

[yolkboy]

So, no, highly doubt just anyone could shout, speak or whisper Dracarys and the dragons will respond. Otherwise they would be pointless in the first place.....

Well it might turn out akin to Dany giving everyone her pin number.

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

I believe the same will likely occur with a dragon (it's really just an overgrown fire breathing flying dog after all :) ). Whomever the dragon "belongs" to will have absolute authority over the dragon, but those close to that person may also be able to command them to some extent. Drogo will likely listen only to Dany as they're bonded, but Viserion and Rhaegal will have more flexibility until they bond to someone. I hope that makes sense.

That's possible. But it still leaves the door open for at least some chaos before Rhaegal and Viserion "bond," as well as the possibility that they could bond to someone who's against Dany and follow that person's commands over hers.

[WeaselPie]

... and we do have the dragon horn to consider. So there is magic yet to be involved in training/bonding to a dragon.

[Lady Beyond the Wall]

Actually, I'm pretty sure that a lot of police officers in, say, the U.S. will use German commands for their dogs for that very reason

Yes

That's possible. But it still leaves the door open for at least some chaos before Rhaegal and Viserion "bond," as well as the possibility that they could bond to someone who's against Dany and follow that person's commands over hers.

Quentin

[Illusion]

Apple Martini

My quote button thing doesn't work so couldn't reply directly.

Yes, dogs may often be trained to respond to foreign commands (just as Dany used HV for her dragons) however this is used as a scare tactic. It is more confusing to hear foreign words used for command than your own language but animals respond to emotion and energy more than verbal commands.

As for the dragons response to the Unsullied, put any animal in there with them, they will react too.