"Dracarys," or, "Be careful with that word ..."

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Apple Martini

My quote button thing doesn't work so couldn't reply directly.

Yes, dogs may often be trained to respond to foreign commands (just as Dany used HV for her dragons) however this is used as a scare tactic. It is more confusing to hear foreign words used for command than your own language but animals respond to emotion and energy more than verbal commands.

As for the dragons response to the Unsullied, put any animal in there with them, they will react too.

That still doesn't preclude the possibility that someone with the appropriate air of authority (whether it's real or not) could use "dracarys" as a command successfully.

[Illusion]

I agree, as I said before it is possible for others to command an animal to respond, however animals are very smart at assessing situations etc. You really cannot 'fake' confidence with animals, they see right through you.

With appropriate familiarity with the dragons and genuine 'intentions' (whether good or bad) there may be a opportunity for someone to use them for their design....but I feel if it happened it would be short-lived. I just have this feeling the dragons will always see Dany as their 'Mother' should anyone ever try to kill her with one of her 'children'. BUT as for the dragons fighting each other......different story.

[Dany Girl]

That's possible. But it still leaves the door open for at least some chaos before Rhaegal and Viserion "bond," as well as the possibility that they could bond to someone who's against Dany and follow that person's commands over hers.

Absolutely, I don't disagree completely with your point. If they do bond to someone against Dany, that person will either have to figure out Dany's commands, or spend time retraining them. Aegon, for instance, has not been around Dany, therefore does not know her commands. Same with Jon. They'd either have to be told (and Dany won't tell her enemy, and likly no enemy from SB will make it to Westeros) or retrain. If by some miracle Tyrion does ride a dragon, he might have had the chance to learn the command.

I also agree that in hindsight using dracarys as the command, then hanging around an area where High Velarion is commonly known was a mistake. Many people will know the command, and this will have the ability to cause havoc. We don't know for sure if the dragons were responding to Dany in Astapor, the Unsullied, or if they originally were listening to Dany but then got caught up in the blood and commotion of the day. They're still young dragons, and sadly not very well trained (Dany's biggest mistake in my opinion). It could be any of the 3, or all 3. Likely it stated when Dany gives the command, then once the running and screaming started the dragons just start acting on their own, like wild animals in a slaughter.

[Lord Rahvin]

You're missing the fact that "only Targaryens can ride dragons" looks very likely to be pure BS. Saying the "dragonseeds" prove you need Targ blood to ride a dragon, because they had Targ blood and rode dragons---while the only evidence they had Targ blood was the fact that they rode dragons---is pretty circular logic.

Again, circular thinking or not, unless theres been a known non-dragonblood rider, then it holds up...

Regarding Nette, her unconventional method of bonding suggests she just a commoner?

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

Again, circular thinking or not, unless theres been a known non-dragonblood rider, then it holds up...

Regarding Nette, her unconventional method of bonding suggests she just a commoner?

The point is that it's possible that Nettles is a non-dragonblood dragonrider. And yes, your logic is circular.

Or her unconventional method of training suggests that there are ways to bond with a dragon that don't involve having Valyrian blood.

[yolkboy]

Or her unconventional method of training suggests that there are ways to bond with a dragon that don't involve having Valyrian blood.

Those methods could be meaningless if she had BotD though. The whole scenario could just as feasibly be a red herring ploy from Grrm. One thing I'm certain of - Grrm wants us to be uncertain. Cheeky man.

[Lord Rahvin]

And Jon is a Targaryen, whether his heritage is revealed at the time he rides a dragon (if he does) or not. That is not the same as a non-Targaryen riding a dragon.

I agree Jon is Targ, my point is to the average reader Jon's lineage remain a mystery, by making that statement GRRM ensures the big cliffhanger remains intact to the bitter end.

What if Tyrion mid-way through WoW hops on the back of 1 of Dany's 3? As some might suggest, this makes Tyrion Targ?

[Lord Rahvin]

Absolutely, I don't disagree completely with your point. If they do bond to someone against Dany, that person will either have to figure out Dany's commands, or spend time retraining them. Aegon, for instance, has not been around Dany, therefore does not know her commands. Same with Jon. They'd either have to be told (and Dany won't tell her enemy, and likly no enemy from SB will make it to Westeros) or retrain. If by some miracle Tyrion does ride a dragon, he might have had the chance to learn the command.

I also agree that in hindsight using dracarys as the command, then hanging around an area where High Velarion is commonly known was a mistake. Many people will know the command, and this will have the ability to cause havoc. We don't know for sure if the dragons were responding to Dany in Astapor, the Unsullied, or if they originally were listening to Dany but then got caught up in the blood and commotion of the day. They're still young dragons, and sadly not very well trained (Dany's biggest mistake in my opinion). It could be any of the 3, or all 3. Likely it stated when Dany gives the command, then once the running and screaming started the dragons just start acting on their own, like wild animals in a slaughter.

Personally I don't think Dani hangs on to all 3 of those dragons for very much longer anyway. Eventually they seek out riders, friend or foe.

[Lord Rahvin]

The point is that it's possible that Nettles is a non-dragonblood dragonrider. And yes, your logic is circular.

Or her unconventional method of training suggests that there are ways to bond with a dragon that don't involve having Valyrian blood.

Maybe?

[Lord Rahvin]

Those methods could be meaningless if she had BotD though. The whole scenario could just as feasibly be a red herring ploy from Grrm. One thing I'm certain of - Grrm wants us to be uncertain. Cheeky man.

Absolutely what im saying...

[yolkboy]

It's just occurred to me that the only way Jon could outright PROVE he has Targ blood - is if only Targs can bond with dragons and he is able to do so.

Artifacts in the crypts, witness testimony etc. don't cut it for me, not as undeniable evidence.

[Dany Girl]

Personally I don't think Dani hangs on to all 3 of those dragons for very much longer anyway. Eventually they seek out riders, friend or foe.

I aagree, she can't keep them all. She's already bonded to Drogo, and a rider may only ride 1 dragon. The hope, from her perspective, is to have 2 allies ride the others. If she gives one to an ally, she'll teach them the commands. But if an enemy gets one, they'll have a harder time of it, unless they have a turncoat on their side that knows Dany's commands.

[RoamingRonin]

Personally I don't think Dani hangs on to all 3 of those dragons for very much longer anyway. Eventually they seek out riders, friend or foe.

Sadly, this seems to be where the story is heading. She never suspects one of her dragons is capable of "betraying" her.

[Lord Rahvin]

It's just occurred to me that the only way Jon could outright PROVE he has Targ blood - is if only Targs can bond with dragons and he is able to do so.

Artifacts in the crypts, witness testimony etc. don't cut it for me, not as undeniable evidence.

Its good point, only strengthens my case...

[Lord Rahvin]

I aagree, she can't keep them all. She's already bonded to Drogo, and a rider may only ride 1 dragon. The hope, from her perspective, is to have 2 allies ride the others. If she gives one to an ally, she'll teach them the commands. But if an enemy gets one, they'll have a harder time of it, unless they have a turncoat on their side that knows Dany's commands.

My guess is once bonded, rider/dragon will communicate differently then Dani/Drogon.

[Dany Girl]

My guess is once bonded, rider/dragon will communicate differently then Dani/Drogon.

Doubt it. GRRM's dragons are dumb creatures. They're not direwolves, riders aren't wargs. I don't think there is an over abundance of mysticism surrounding ridding, I think rather it's like riding a horse like Stranger. Stranger only allows Sandor near him, only listens to Sandor. I think this is a much more likely bond example than warging would be.

[Lord Rahvin]

Doubt it. GRRM's dragons are dumb creatures. They're not direwolves, riders aren't wargs. I don't think there is an over abundance of mysticism surrounding ridding, I think rather it's like riding a horse like Stranger. Stranger only allows Sandor near him, only listens to Sandor. I think this is a much more likely bond example than warging would be.

The word "bonding" should be used very loosely

[Lord Rahvin]

But "bonding" HAS to suggest something...gotta be Dragonblood.

You wouldent say the Hound bonded his mount???

[assjfjgjsgjljljglgjfjsduar]

But "bonding" HAS to suggest something...gotta be Dragonblood.

You wouldent say the Hound bonded his mount???

Why are you so dead-set on the dragonblood thing? Even the maester writing the novella doesn't claim to know everything about dragons and their riders. Don't you think that this family has a vested interest in spreading the myth that only they can ride dragons, lest someone else try to take one? It reeks of propaganda and especially after reading TPatQ I'm amazed people aren't more skeptical about it.

[Ser Creighton]

I tend to believe GRRM at his word, that it was a freak incident.

See that wasn't his word, that was your word, he said miracle. And miracle and freak are not synonyms of each other and nobody has every really argued the semantics of freak and miracle because they really are not the same thing.

Miracle, an amazing and wonderful event.

Miracle, an even that appears inexplicable by the laws of nature so is held to be supernatural in origin or an act of god.

Freak generally has a negative connotation and does not involve the supernatural or violate the laws of nature. Abnormal and abnormality are synonyms of freak.

You can freak out but can you miracle out?

Now you picked freak for a reason, I know you know the quote because you have used it many times before.

In truth I on't think Martin will give the in depth explanation people want. He skipped over it a lot in his latest book even mentioning it's not really known how it works exactly. Bond, blood, training, and if you pay attention different ways were used for people to get there Dragons, and it was the dragons that picked the rider. You had reason like blood, food, because they had been ridden before and were more accustomed to a rider but that was not always the case, blood was not always the case, etc...

So if there is no repetitive pattern for the bonds, then either all the answers are right, or none of the answers are right and it's something else. Personality also seems to play a part, as the dragons either adopt some the riders personality being some sort of magical bond, and if that is at least part of the case then perhaps dragons bond with people with similar traits to themselves. Martin has made it clear the dragons have personality, and their personalities are all different.

What we have not seen is a non Targ blooded rider, everyone so far was suppose to have Targ blood. I would not be surprised if Martin leaves the answer to your question somewhat ambiguous.