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lokisnow

Bakker XXIII: Priapic Godlings and Whoresome Folks

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Yeah, Joe Abercrombie is the self proclaimed authority on the subject, and even he will tell you that there is no clear definition for grim-dark.


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Erratum: when Happy Ent starts a Bakker thread, he meticulously uses the search function to actually count how many threads there have been before, and gives that thread its proper numeral, no matter the juvenile naming schemes invented by less meticulous boarders.

Yeah, I thought we were using a definitive numbering scheme.

At least we just have to look at the last thread HE created.

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Yeah, I thought we were using a definitive numbering scheme.

At least we just have to look at the last thread HE created.

Or you know... people can get over whatever disdain for me exists, stop uselessly generating more content to be immediately buried here, and start contributing to the monument that is Second Apocalypse, where a little more order is possible...

But who am I to stop the madness...

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I had no idea Ent's numbers were meticulous, I'm happy to abide by his numbering given it is accurate.

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Well, it's just sort of evolved organically.

I am pretty sure it’s a Warhammer 40Kism.

ETA: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/grimdark

he shorthand term “Grimdark” entered online usage as early as May 2008, when it was used as a descriptor in a blog post on the Wizards of the Coast[5] about the newly released expansion set Shadowmoor. The blog post, titled “The Two-Sided Coin,” details the vision of the writers behind the expansion set. The author notes that they wanted to create a dark world without getting too “grimdark,” as there is still humor and hope in this game’s world.

This disproves the claim that grimdark presupposes humour. In fact, humour is an antidote to grimdark.

(In your face, Joe.)

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I had no idea Ent's numbers were meticulous, I'm happy to abide by his numbering given it is accurate.

I counted after the last thread and yeah it was accurate.

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I am pretty sure it’s a Warhammer 40Kism.

ETA: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/grimdark

This disproves the claim that grimdark presupposes humour. In fact, humour is an antidote to grimdark.

(In your face, Joe.)

Originally it was, yes... but it has grown so much since then that I don't think the original usage really applies anymore. And besides, many of the 40K books have significantly more humor than anything even Abercrombie puts in his work and certainly more than Bakker.

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I've always thought of grimdark as teh same as it's origin (ie - WH40k)



That is ridiculously over the top in it's bleakness and grittiness. Sometimes to the point that it's funny.


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Picking up this question from the previous thread:

Not necessarily a discrepancy. The separate deity Ajokli could very well be condemned by the Tusk (and hence frowned upon by other cults following the Kiünnat faith), but still be treated as a valid aspect of God within Inrithism.

That's an interesting explanation. I assumed that the Tractae and/or other texts of Inrithism were in complete conformity with the Tusk, but discrepancies (as between the Old and New Testaments) may well be an explanation. I just wondered if Kellhus had placed the Idol in the Temple, knowing that Kelmomas' twinned soul would leave him open to possession.

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Or you know... people can get over whatever disdain for me exists, stop uselessly generating more content to be immediately buried here, and start contributing to the monument that is Second Apocalypse, where a little more order is possible...

But who am I to stop the madness...

Madness, in relation to the "spike" for TUC on amazon - my practice is to buy the kindle edition asap upon release which means generally from amazon.co.uk rather than from amazon.com - books are mostly released earlier in the UK than in America. Even when the release date is the same, amazon.co.uk typically releases the book at midnight GMT whereas the US release is at least 4.5 hours behind. However not everyone can buy with equal ease from the UK and US sites. I should also add that UK prices are slightly higher (which I swallow to get the book earlier) even when converted to dollars.

The bottom line is you should have separate strategies for US and UK websites.

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I don't mind in the least, I'll add one final thought: the obvious time to go for the Big Spike is within one hour of the book becoming available through amazon (assume midnight as the default time)- this way nobody has to wait. However for those who can't or won't prefer a midnight purchase, there should be a nominated second wave time- say 10.30 AM or 4.30 PM. This way you also have a Big Spike followed by mini spikes.



Tor has a whole bunch of innovative marketing techniques RSB and his publishers could try, changing prices on amazon to $2.99 for 2-3 days in the weeks running up to the release of TUC for the earlier books, selling the first trilogy as a combined ebook for $9.99, maybe even creating a "taster" ebook - for free.


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Why doesn't Bakker put the False Sun as a free ebook release on amazon? Perhaps even the Four Revelations of Cinial'jin...


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Madness, in relation to the "spike" for TUC on amazon - my practice is to buy the kindle edition asap upon release which means generally from amazon.co.uk rather than from amazon.com - books are mostly released earlier in the UK than in America. Even when the release date is the same, amazon.co.uk typically releases the book at midnight GMT whereas the US release is at least 4.5 hours behind. However not everyone can buy with equal ease from the UK and US sites. I should also add that UK prices are slightly higher (which I swallow to get the book earlier) even when converted to dollars.

The bottom line is you should have separate strategies for US and UK websites.

wait, I can put amazon.co.uk ebooks on my american kindle? I assumed I couldn't, but there are a couple back catalog books I really want that are available on kindle on the .co.uk site that are not available in the states.

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I don't mind in the least, I'll add one final thought: the obvious time to go for the Big Spike is within one hour of the book becoming available through amazon (assume midnight as the default time)- this way nobody has to wait. However for those who can't or won't prefer a midnight purchase, there should be a nominated second wave time- say 10.30 AM or 4.30 PM. This way you also have a Big Spike followed by mini spikes.

Tor has a whole bunch of innovative marketing techniques RSB and his publishers could try, changing prices on amazon to $2.99 for 2-3 days in the weeks running up to the release of TUC for the earlier books, selling the first trilogy as a combined ebook for $9.99, maybe even creating a "taster" ebook - for free.

This is what Wilshire and I have concluded as well: that we should do a big spike and coordinate some smaller spikes over the course of the following days. One big spike alone will actually work against us (though really we don't have to worry about this as Bakker does hundreds of thousands of sales and we'll be lucky to coordinate moment of a 100 purchases - I can only hope - so we actually don't really have to worry about the secondary spikes too much).

Lol - do you think if Bakker's publishers were doing this work for him that I would step up at all to pimp the man like I do? No offense to his pushers but they do only what they contractually obliged to do: pay Chapters (here in Canada), etc, a bunch of money to put a handful of copies on a table for opening week or whatever...

Pretty sad, I think.

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Lol - do you think if Bakker's publishers were doing this work for him that I would step up at all to pimp the man like I do? No offense to his pushers but they do only what they contractually obliged to do: pay Chapters (here in Canada), etc, a bunch of money to put a handful of copies on a table for opening week or whatever...

Pretty sad, I think.

Hmm..it is sad. He should be able to release the False Sun as a free ebook on amazon without involving his publishers. Perhaps that would be a good first step?

I really do believe that most of the reasons I've come across for his relative unpopularity- absence of humour, allegations of misogny, the grimdarkiness of his work, alleged lack of strong female characters etc etc don't preclude a greater readership. Poor marketing and accessibility is really holding him back...

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Hmm..it is sad. He should be able to release the False Sun as a free ebook on amazon without involving his publishers. Perhaps that would be a good first step?

I really do believe that most of the reasons I've come across for his relative unpopularity- absence of humour, allegations of misogny, the grimdarkiness of his work, alleged lack of strong female characters etc etc don't preclude a greater readership. Poor marketing and accessibility is really holding him back...

I definitely don't know enough about his contractual obligations to the publishers, whether or not he can release TSA content himself (like the Atrocity Tales anthology he has planned - False Sun and Four Revelations are only two of a number of planned narratives stretching from the Nonman Tutelage to the First Holy War).

Agreed about the poor marketing and accessibility.

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I definitely don't know enough about his contractual obligations to the publishers, whether or not he can release TSA content himself (like the Atrocity Tales anthology he has planned - False Sun and Four Revelations are only two of a number of planned narratives stretching from the Nonman Tutelage to the First Holy War).

Agreed about the poor marketing and accessibility.

It seems a fine distinction between posting it for free on his website, and releasing it as an ebook...but maybe he can't take that further step, as you say, for contractual reasons.

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I'm embarrassed to say that I had to look up the definition of "priapic." I have now done so. Incredible.


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