Benjen as coldhands

[ghosts in winterfell]

Mostly this. Leaf said long ago and I don't think that 2 years are long ago for someone who is 200 years old.

For some strange reason I believe that is the NK, but lately I have the crackpot idea that he is the LH.

I'm assuming LH stands for the Last Hero? I've taken to the Daemon II Blackfyre theory, but this one would be pretty awesome!

Leaf said long ago to Bran who was worried about the immediate danger to Coldhands. Compared to immediate danger, 2 years is a long time ago. Leaf was reassuring Bran, not giving him a history lesson.

2 years wouldn't seem very "long ago" to someone who is 200 years old.

[Jon's Queen Consort]

I'm assuming LH stands for the Last Hero? I've taken to the Daemon II Blackfyre theory, but this one would be pretty awesome!

Yes Last Hero the only thing that doesn't match is the LH was not a member of NW as far as we know.

[achance76]

I am hoping that this suggestion is not ridiculed too much.

Is it possible that "Coldhands" is perhaps the very first man of the nights watch? Perhaps a criminal in the age of heroes that redeemed himself fighting the others and sacrificing himself to end them in that age. In doing so he took on some of the others traits. Explaining why he cannot go past the wall. And that he is newly awakened. We can insert alot of the previous theory details and speculation here also.

Perhaps all of the nights watch men were supposed to use him as an example of the honor that was the original intention of the order, or part of it anyway. If the fact that there were spells cast during the building of the wall among one of the things forgotten, why not "Coldhands"?

Crazy thought I guess. Maybe Sam will find an old book about it.

But I don't see this ever being fully explained. Lost to the ages and imagination I suppose.

[ghosts in winterfell]

I am hoping that this suggestion is not ridiculed too much.

Is it possible that "Coldhands" is perhaps the very first man of the nights watch? Perhaps a criminal in the age of heroes that redeemed himself fighting the others and sacrificing himself to end them in that age. In doing so he took on some of the others traits. Explaining why he cannot go past the wall. And that he is newly awakened.

Perhaps all of the nights watch men were supposed to use him as an example of the honor that was the original intention of the order.

Crazy thought I guess.

But I don't see this ever being fully explained. Lost to the ages and imagination I suppose.

I have my own personal little crackpot that Coldhands is one of the 79 sentinels.

[FittleLinger]

I haven't read the whole thread, I just felt that here is the right place to put this. Firstly, I will say that I am not decided on whether Coldhands is Benjen. I'm honestly, truly at 50-50. Now, on a recent reread I noticed this.

Right before Leaf tells Bran that "they killed him long ago", she says that she has studied the common tongue for the sole purpose of being able to communicate to Bran. Which to me inidicates that the possibility remains that by "long ago" she means long ago according to Bran's lifespan. This is the biggest clue that is used by people that it cannot be Benjen, but I remain unconvinced due to Leaf's admission that she's all about Bran so to say.

[Big Daddy]

I'm not decided one way or another on Coldhands being Benjen or n ot. I just know that the mystery has gone on FAR too long and I want an answer to it. Whether Benjen's alive or dead I want the answer in the 6th book and not have to wait until the 7th

[Big Daddy]

I'm not decided one way or another on Coldhands being Benjen or not. I just know that the mystery has gone on FAR too long and I want an answer to it. Whether Benjen's alive or dead I want the answer in the 6th book and not have to wait until the 7th

[Queen Whore]

I doubt that it's Benjen, first because of the 'long ago' comment, and also because Bran would still recognize his uncle. It's not that hard to identify a family member, even with only eyes visible.
Coldhands calls himself 'Bran's monster' and I feel like that has to be a clue to something...maybe someone who was a servant to the first Brandon, NK? I don't know.

[stateofdissipation]

The case for Coldhand's being Benjen.

For:

Coldhands was or is a member of the Nights Watch and was most likely from south of the wall originally.

Coldhands is a warg. The only character we have seen riding a wild beast for a mount was a warg. Coldhands rides an Elk. Starks are the only characters south of the wall that are known to be wargs.

Could be a warg. Could be BR that is the warg. Could be CH is a meat puppet.

Coldhands conceals his face. Bran might recognize his uncle or at least family.

Benjen and coldhands are described as Gaunt

Coldhands does not replace his garments with newer ones from fallen members of the night's watch. His garmets are clearly from the Nights Watch and are worn and gray. He has not had the garmets he is currently wearing for more than a couple of years. In short, his clothes seem to come from around the time Benjen disappeared.

Against:

Case against rests on the idea that Coldhands died a long time ago. Had the three eyed crow initiated the story, that would clearly be the case. However, the statement was made to ease Bran's immediate concern about coldhands. To the three eyed crow 2 years is not a long time. To Bran's concern for the immediate welfare of Coldhands, 2 years is a long time.

[Northernmonkey]

Coldhands died a long time ago so he can't be Benjen. All the people earlier in the thread trying to explain that away are really clutching at straws. If Coldhands was Benjen, then GRRM wouldn't have said that he died long ago.

[stateofdissipation]

Coldhands died a long time ago so he can't be Benjen. All the people earlier in the thread trying to explain that away are really clutching at straws. If Coldhands was Benjen, then GRRM wouldn't have said that he died long ago.

the died a long time ago was not in a history lesson. It was said in a reassurance to Bran about coldhands facing the wights.

Now if you are talking about an interview....the first book was a long time ago....

[Northernmonkey]

the died a long time ago was not in a history lesson. It was said in a reassurance to Bran about coldhands facing the wights.

Now if you are talking about an interview....the first book was a long time ago....

I don't think that explanation makes sense. If it was just to reassure Bran then GRRM could have made them say something like "they can't harm him now". If Coldhands was Benjen why would GRRM put it a deliberately misleading statement?

Leaf says "he died a long time ago" - I think that's a clear straightforward statement that means exactly what it says. I don't see how you can interpret that as meaning something else.

[stateofdissipation]

ALTERNATIVES.

Benjen is somewhere north of the wall for 2 years plus searching for something but never running into anybody. A minor character from book 1 comes riding to the rescue in book 6 or 7. That means GRRM left the one of the most important characters in the books out of the majority of the books and left the deciding battle againsts the Others off page. That is if he has an impact. If he does not have an impact, bringing him back is pointless.

Lets face it Benjen is dead.

I don't think that explanation makes sense. If it was just to reassure Bran then GRRM could have made them say something like "they can't harm him now". If Coldhands was Benjen why would GRRM put it a deliberately misleading statement?

Our way is down. You miúst come with me now

Bran shivered again, 'the ranger'

He cannot come.

They'll kill him.

No, they killed him long ago.

Does that sound like a history lesson.... or don't worry about that?

The same speaker put her life in the context of history....born in the time of the dragon. Leaf is not 200.. Leaf walked the world of men for 200 years and then came back home.... We do not know the age at the start or how long ago the return was.

Notably the speaker did not say 'he died when I was young`

[FittleLinger]

I don't think that explanation makes sense. If it was just to reassure Bran then GRRM could have made them say something like "they can't harm him now". If Coldhands was Benjen why would GRRM put it a deliberately misleading statement?

Leaf says "he died a long time ago" - I think that's a clear straightforward statement that means exactly what it says. I don't see how you can interpret that as meaning something else.

If you are refuting the statement that they are going to kill him in the next minutes, it does make sense to say long ago, if it happened two-three years ago. It's nog grasping at straws at all, it's equally plausible.

[stateofdissipation]

1. Night's Ranger

2. Thin...

Does that remind anybody of a character in the books?

Benjen

1. Rides a wild beast and commands birds: Warg

2. What family is known to have wargs?

Does that remind anybody of a house in the books?

Stark

Killed by wights of the Others...

The Others are as dead as the children of the forest , gone eight thousand years. Maester Luwin will tell you they never lived at all. No living man has ever seen one. ^[16]

”

– Eddard Stark to Catelyn Stark

The newer Others are 3 years old at most.

Coldhands is either 3 years dead at most or at least 8000 years dead?

[jon stark I]

What I really find interesting is how Clodhands is a undead and how he still has normal eye colour.For him to return normally or partially normally there has to be a red priest to do the kiss.And we know that he was from the night's watch so how did he get the kiss?How is he still normal and not a wight?Maybe it was BR who was warging the Coldhands.Can someone answer my questions?

[Ser Greg of House House]

It's just that from a storytelling point of view I don't see why Martin would keep it from us if he was Benjen. He's the first name on the mind of the reader. Of course there's reason to keep it from Bran, but it would be easy to put in a tip to let the reader know. Like he did with Bloodraven.

I understand the face-covering points to someone Bran would know, but I believe he's just disfigured becase you know... he's dead. And that would creep Bran out.

I don't like latest Bran chapters. Of course it's interesting because we get to see a lot of things from the CotF, but Martin artificially creates a shroud of mystery because there's no conflict whatsoever. He keeps us blind and at a certain point it's like: "Ok. We get it. There's something going on and it's very very creepy. But it's getting boring. Tell me a story."

[stateofdissipation]

What I really find interesting is how Clodhands is a undead and how he still has normal eye colour.For him to return normally or partially normally there has to be a red priest to do the kiss.And we know that he was from the night's watch so how did he get the kiss?How is he still normal and not a wight?Maybe it was BR who was warging the Coldhands.Can someone answer my questions?

We know Coldhands has dark eyes and not the blue eyes of a wight.

The red god's resurrections of the dead are different than the wights... which coldhands is a wight... undead rather than formerly dead.

BR warging into coldhands, the elk and the ravens would actually work. I can't find a thing that would exclude it. However, he seems to have companions as well as his warging and leaf seems to think that BR and the ranger are distinct persons.

[stateofdissipation]

It's just that from a storytelling point of view I don't see why Martin would keep it from us if he was Benjen. He's the first name on the mind of the reader. Of course there's reason to keep it from Bran, but it would be easy to put in a tip to let the reader know. Like he did with Bloodraven.

I understand the face-covering points to someone Bran would know, but I believe he's just disfigured becase you know... he's dead. And that would creep Bran out.

I don't like latest Bran chapters. Of course it's interesting because we get to see a lot of things from the CotF, but Martin artificially creates a shroud of mystery because there's no conflict whatsoever. He keeps us blind and at a certain point it's like: "Ok. We get it. There's something going on and it's very very creepy. But it's getting boring. Tell me a story."

Nights Watch, Ranger, Warg are as many clues to Coldhands being Benjen as the red eye, white hair, and birthmark are clues to TER being Blood Raven. I agree it comes across as contrived like R+L=J and the like...

[Ser Greg of House House]

Nights Watch, Ranger, Warg are as many clues to Coldhands being Benjen as the red eye, white hair, and birthmark are clues to TER being Blood Raven. I agree it comes across as contrived like R+L=J and the like...

It's much more obvious with Bloodraven, that's why even before it was confirmed (I think it was) I guess it was taken as fact. While almost nobody thinks Coldhands is Benjen (at least that's my impression).

I feel sometimes people try to hard to look for clues etc. and forget that Martin is telling a story. I could be wrong, of course, but I don't see why he would keep Coldhands identity a secret if he was Benjen. It's not like it would be a twist or anything.