Awake iron! Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 There is also the possibility that Thorne and Slynt accuse Jon of being a turncloak and that Jon decides to prove his loyalty by tracking the deserters and avenge Mormont. It could work storywise and show Jon as a capable leader. But then Jon wouldn't be sent to kill Mance to prove his loyalty. That would be a HUGE deviation from the book. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Awake iron! Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 The only real problems that I can see them facing is:1) how to make the delayed Wildling assault believableand 2) how to get around Alliser being there when it comes to Jon being told "The Wall is Yours" We might as well not get any "the Wall is yours" line in the show. Because:a) Predictably there will be no Donal Noye, no veteran warrior figure to go fighting the giants in the tunnels, living Jon "in charge".b) If the show delays the fight in the tunnels to episode 9, happening simultaneously to the battle in the Wall, then as you said, Jon will already be faulted as suspected of treason by Thorne & co., so he won't be in position to be left in charge of anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lady of Dragonstone Posted March 4, 2014 Share Posted March 4, 2014 5) The battles with the Wildlings from south of the Wall and Mance from beyond the Wall will take place concurrently (or at least very close together) and the entirety of E9 will occur at the Wall (it will be this season's Blackwater). This would logically lead to Stannis arriving at the climax of the episode. <snip> There have also been suggestions from some leaked reports during filming that Bran and co might possibly be captured by the mutineers at Craster's at the start of the season and that Jon's mission there would inadvertently free them (causing another Jon/Bran near miss). There is however no evidence thusfar in any of the footage or trailers that this is the case. The only thing we really know about Bran's story this season is that he's going to be really into touching weirwoods and that both Brynden Bloodraven and a "Child of the Forest" have been cast. Fist pump! I can't wait to see Stannis show up at the Wall. I'm not a fan of the Jon-filler, but as long as it doesn't stray too far or create an unnecessary subplot to solve later on , I'll be happy. I was really looking forward to see the struggle Bran & co. has with CH, making it to Bloodraven's hideaway. I hope they include at least some of it, I've always looked forward to those scenes in the TV show. :/ I can't believe we're already seeing him on the show. I hope they do him justice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Prince of Newcastle Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 I just hope the knights shout Stannis! Stannis! STANNIS!!!The new mutineer subplot could be good tbh. At least it's something new along with Yara's story and I'm sure they'll shoe horn in a few lines from different parts of the book so it at least feels right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talking Hodor Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 Everytime a major deviation is made to the TV series, GRRM kills a beloved character in The Winds of Winter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
binga Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 I do think they will be more faithful this season but Jon Snow's story has already been so butchered that it will probably not have the same emotional impact for me. The Jon Snow of the TV show went through a very different journey than the Jon in the books. They inexplicably cut out his most important character arc in the series and one of the highlights of Clash of Kings in exchange for cute Ygritte and Jon Snow high school romance. Producer/Director: "OMG Rose Leslie is so spunky! Lets cancel everything we have written and just follow her around and call it a day." Mance Rayder has no presence he is just some guy. Jon pops into the wildling camp for half a second and then just leaves. There is no exploration into who they are as a people or what Jon finds compelling about them. Contrast this with their development of the story in King's Landing/Robb's Camp and you will notice a huge difference. Sorry I needed to vent a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faceless Man Friday Posted March 5, 2014 Share Posted March 5, 2014 I do think they will be more faithful this season but Jon Snow's story has already been so butchered that it will probably not have the same emotional impact for me. The Jon Snow of the TV show went through a very different journey than the Jon in the books. They inexplicably cut out his most important character arc in the series and one of the highlights of Clash of Kings in exchange for cute Ygritte and Jon Snow high school romance. Producer/Director: "OMG Rose Leslie is so spunky! Lets cancel everything we have written and just follow her around and call it a day." Mance Rayder has no presence he is just some guy. Jon pops into the wildling camp for half a second and then just leaves. There is no exploration into who they are as a people or what Jon finds compelling about them. Contrast this with their development of the story in King's Landing/Robb's Camp and you will notice a huge difference. Sorry I needed to vent a bit. Well its bloody cold shooting in Iceland! Could be they did not have the shooting time to develop the story in that region. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lasicka Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 I do think they will be more faithful this season but Jon Snow's story has already been so butchered that it will probably not have the same emotional impact for me. The Jon Snow of the TV show went through a very different journey than the Jon in the books. They inexplicably cut out his most important character arc in the series and one of the highlights of Clash of Kings in exchange for cute Ygritte and Jon Snow high school romance. Producer/Director: "OMG Rose Leslie is so spunky! Lets cancel everything we have written and just follow her around and call it a day." Mance Rayder has no presence he is just some guy. Jon pops into the wildling camp for half a second and then just leaves. There is no exploration into who they are as a people or what Jon finds compelling about them. Contrast this with their development of the story in King's Landing/Robb's Camp and you will notice a huge difference. Sorry I needed to vent a bit. :agree: Jon just isn´t Jon, they´ve cut out everything that was making his arc so engaging and touching, his whole character development, his struggle... I´ve made my peace with that two seasons ago, and I´m not angry about it, just disappointed... Well its bloody cold shooting in Iceland! Could be they did not have the shooting time to develop the story in that region. Come on, they could have added some scenes, dialogues between characters in some TENT, if they so wished. You don´t need to be in Iceland for that! :frown5: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
achance76 Posted March 8, 2014 Share Posted March 8, 2014 I don't mind most of the changes that HBO has done. They seem to make sense. In fact some are brilliant. Replacing Boring Bolton for Tywin Lannister at Harenhal with Arya were the best scenes in the show as far as I am concerned. The tension was great, OH and then Littlefinger walks in...lol...C'mon! Brilliant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToTheWolves Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Not sure if it's been mentioned or if it matters but in the first trailer when we see Thorne saying "brothers tonight we fight!" Or something like that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wisenan69 Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 I do think they will be more faithful this season but Jon Snow's story has already been so butchered that it will probably not have the same emotional impact for me. The Jon Snow of the TV show went through a very different journey than the Jon in the books. They inexplicably cut out his most important character arc in the series and one of the highlights of Clash of Kings in exchange for cute Ygritte and Jon Snow high school romance. Producer/Director: "OMG Rose Leslie is so spunky! Lets cancel everything we have written and just follow her around and call it a day." Mance Rayder has no presence he is just some guy. Jon pops into the wildling camp for half a second and then just leaves. There is no exploration into who they are as a people or what Jon finds compelling about them. Contrast this with their development of the story in King's Landing/Robb's Camp and you will notice a huge difference. Sorry I needed to vent a bit.Agreed. I feel so disappointed with the changes to Jon's arc. IMHO the show has obscured the Wall/wildings to focus on the more "colorful" events south of the Neck. Bran and company (including CH) have also been reduced greatly. Sad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colonel Green Posted March 9, 2014 Share Posted March 9, 2014 Bran and company (including CH) have also been reduced greatly. I don't think Bran's story has been "reduced" much at all. He legitimately has very little happening in the books by this point. His four chapters in ASOS are: 1 - Reintro, Bran dreams, then they decide to go north to look for the 3EC. Adapted, more or less, with the addition of it being the Reeds' introduction. 2 - Knight of the Laughing Tree story. Excised, would have been extremey difficult to adapt. 3 - Bran's part of the Queenscrown incident. Adapted. 4 - Bran meets Sam and Gilly. Adapted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Draco_Dracul Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I'll admit I haven't read the books, so I'll take everyone's word for it that the lackluster season 2 arc was much better in the book, but I don't even see what was wrong with his season 3 arc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sertravisredbeard Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Although it might make for some good TV because of its revenge and action-themed elements, I think having Jon and Grenn head back to Craster's is stupid. Sure, they can go back to avenge Mormont, but do they not remember that there are ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND WILDLINGS between them and Craster's? That seems like a pretty sure way to get killed off doing something stupid. The only reason I can think of them having for doing this has to do with the shot we've seen of Rast giving a baby to the Others. If Grenn and Edd tell the brothers at Castle Black that Craster and now the deserters were giving babies to replenish the Other/White Walker army, they might decide to go kill the deserters to stop that from happening. It's still a dumb risk though. If the deserters are doing that, Mance will probably kill the mutineers at Craster's anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seneti Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Although it might make for some good TV because of its revenge and action-themed elements, I think having Jon and Grenn head back to Craster's is stupid. Sure, they can go back to avenge Mormont, but do they not remember that there are ONE HUNDRED THOUSAND WILDLINGS between them and Craster's? That seems like a pretty sure way to get killed off doing something stupid. The wildlings are not yet at Craster's, which is one more reason to go there (deserters at Craster's could be interrogated by Mance and might give away the true situation of the Watch, i. e. an organization with a dwindling number untrained people instead of the big badass black-clad army of experiences warriors). Sure, Mance has some idea of the NW's dwindling numbers, but keeping the true severity of the situation from his has been one of the NW's prime objectives both in book-verse and show-verse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser-Hodor Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 Perhaps Jon is being sent to Crasters by Thorne / Slynt, and this is being used to replace the storyline of Jon being sent to kill Mance in his tent to prove his loyalty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
binga Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I think the people who run the show are more comfortable with politics and traditional drama. They have a harder time with the fantasy and cinematic elements within the story. I think some of the directorial choices reflect this. They need to get more movie directors working on it. That is how they got the Blackwater episode to work. They needed to invite some of the excellent directors of the first season, like Tim Van Patten, back instead of taking more control over the show. Those season 1 directors just set the right tone for the show. They are underappreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Fixit Posted March 10, 2014 Share Posted March 10, 2014 I think the people who run the show are more comfortable with politics and traditional drama. They have a harder time with the fantasy and cinematic elements within the story. I think some of the directorial choices reflect this. They need to get more movie directors working on it. That is how they got the Blackwater episode to work. They needed to invite some of the excellent directors of the first season, like Tim Van Patten, back instead of taking more control over the show. Those season 1 directors just set the right tone for the show. They are underappreciated. I'd say S4 directors are a great bunch. Alex Graves did spectacular work with 3x04/05, absolutely breathtaking. D&D surprised me how good of a directorial debut their episode was - Hoster's funeral, musical chairs, Theon's chase... great stuff. Michelle MacLaren is a veteran director with a fantastic resume. Alik Sakharov proved he had an eye for cinematic moments. And of course there's Neil Marshall. I think the coming season will be just fine in this department. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tito5601 Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 anybody miss alan taylor? and any chance he could be back for season 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Fixit Posted March 11, 2014 Share Posted March 11, 2014 anybody miss alan taylor? and any chance he could be back for season 5 (Un)fortunately, he's made it to the big leagues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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