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Tyrion + Tysha = Podrick


Hippocras

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Maybe. But he doesn't seem to have anyone in house Payne that actually gives a damn about him or even knows who he is. So I doubt they would care.

Flimsy - Tyrion and Brienne both noted that the story was full of holes. This is not my assessment of the backstory, but something that both characters noted in their POVs

Quotes? I remember nothing of the sort, only both noting that he is reluctant to tell it.

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Pod may be Tysha's son but I highly doubt that the father of her child could be worked out without a DNA test.

it would be difficult yes. She did have two full weeks at least alone with Tyrion before the gang rape though, so by normal rules of conception timing matters more than numbers - more likely Tyrion than anyone else because more days to make it happen.

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Was Tysha old enough to give birth? And even if she was, how unlikely is it that she could have gotten Tyrion's child instead of anyone else from the Lannister army (which is extremely fucked up).

This would be a neat twist though.

If she was old enough to menstruate then she was technically old enough to give birth. Whether she and/or the child could survive would depend on her development. There have been girls as young as nine who have successfully carried babies to term and delivered them.

As to the paternity it is just as likely she could already have been carrying Tyrion's child before the raping occurred as it is that she wasn't. Generally speaking as far as sperm and egg go, the first to get there wins.

This is an interesting theory. Not sure there's much textual support for it, but who knows what will come out with TWoW?

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Pod's lineage can easily be traced so I doubt he's Tyrion's bastard. Tywin wouldn't care so much for a bastard anyway.

Can it? Everyone who he claims knew him is gone or dead.

Why would Tywin care so much about a minor branch Payne who no other Payne even cares about then? The official story is at least as unlikely.

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I gotta say "No," on this one, because if there is a Tyrion/Tysha child floating around--and that's by no means a foregone conclusion at this point--it's far more likely to be Lanna. Not only does the age fit as with Pod, but the name fits (Lanna = Lannister name), her mother's murky backstory and insistence on wedding her johns fits (suggesting some past trauma involving marriage), and her looks fit as well (fine, golden hair). There aren't going to be two Tyrion/Tysha kids, for obvious reasons (unless they produced twins, and barring the Tyrion + Tysha = Penny/Oppo theory, I think we can rule that out), so if it's going to be anyone, it's going to be Lanna and not Pod.



Besides, it's not that we don't have a backstory for Pod, we do have one courtesy of Brienne, and it's fairly detailed. If GRRM wanted to suggest anything about Pod's true parentage, he would have left it considerably more ambiguous. Also, I'm pretty confident that one way or another, we're going to learn where Tysha wound up, and if Tysha is Pod's mother, that question wouldn't be answered, since the story ends with Pod's mother running off with a singer; making Tysha Pod's mother would not provide the closure I expect we'll receive on that front. Also, even if Pod were Tysha and Tyrion's child, how could that information possibly become known? Tywin and Kevan are dead, Pod's mother is long gone, and Pod believes the story he told Brienne.



Pod could very well be one of the younger generation who winds up achieving greatness, but I imagine it will have absolutely nothing to do with his parentage--Payne, Lannister, or otherwise--and everything to do with the virtues he possesses in his own right. Besides, considering how quickly House Lannister's stock is plummeting these days, a blood connection to that family would not exactly enhance Pod's prestige or chances of moving up in the world.




1. Podrick is awesome and I can't help thinking there is more to him than we know so far.


Well, sure, but one can be awesome without that occasioning questions about one's parentage, otherwise we'd be wondering about the parentage of half the characters (...although that seems to be going on a fair bit already, in between Aegon, Sweetrobin, Darkstar, etc. etc.). :D





2. He is about the right age. Shy like Tysha.


Tysha was shy when it came to losing her virginity, as I recall, but was she shy in general?





3. It is entirely plausible Jamie, out of guilt, might have found a safe place for Tysha after the gang rape with a minor member of house Payne. Alternately, but less plausibly, Tywin might have ordered the Payne in question to take her in.


Others have addressed this point better than I could, but that really doesn't sound like Tywin...or Jaime, for that matter.





4. This would explain why Tywin was unwilling to execute Podrick for his crimes. Being from house Payne (the reason given to Tyrion) would not be enough. Being Tyrion's son would make him kin.


Pod's status as a Payne was enough, as we find out in AFFC:





Podrick had shared the ham and might have shared the rope as well, but his name had saved him.


Nor do I have any recollection of Tyrion or Brienne questioning Pod's backstory.



Now, having said all that, I will say that there are a few things which make me wonder about the "Tyrion and Tysha's child is Pod" theory:



1. We never learn Pod's hair or eye colour in the books, even though GRRM usually describes one or both traits and almost always does so for characters of a similar level of prominence in the books as Pod. It's an odd omission.


2. The Amok portrait shows him with dark hair, and the artist has said that GRRM checked his portraits for canon compliance. (Also, for what it's worth, TV Podrick is portrayed by a dark-haired actor.)


3. Tysha had dark hair ("long dark hair and blue eyes").


4. Brienne's POV specifically mentions that Pod cannot remember what his mother looked like, a curious detail to include if there was nothing significant about his mother's appearance that would have been a tipoff for the readers.



Probably nothing, due to all the reasons I previously mentioned, but it makes me wonder.


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The point on the sailor's wife and her behaviour suggesting marriage trauma is a good interpretation and possible.



Maybe though, since Tysha was not a whore to begin with, I just really want for her to have not turned into one. Maybe it is silly but that is just so sad.


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The point on the sailor's wife and her behaviour suggesting marriage trauma is a good interpretation and possible.

Maybe though, since Tysha was not a whore to begin with, I just really want for her to have not turned into one. Maybe it is silly but that is just so sad.

I really think one's opinion of whether Pod or Lanna is Tyrion's child depends how optimistic your view is with respect to Tyrion's arc. Lanna being Tyrion's child would be very dark, as it would mean his daughter became a prostitute, that his wife not only was forced to become a prostitute to support herself but also suffers from PTSD as a result (praying for her love to return to her, marrying her johns). Pod being Tyrion's child would mean that he had a chance to know his child, that his child is completely devoted to him despite being ignorant of Tyrion's relationship to him, and that Tysha recovered sufficiently from her traumatic experience to fall in love again.

If you think Tyrion's arc is going to keep on piling the darkness and despair, the revelation that Lanna and the Sailor's Wife are Tyrion's daughter and wife (respectively) seems the more reasonable of the two theories. If you think, on the other hand, that Tyrion's arc will have some sort of light at the end of the tunnel that won't be another train, then Pod as Tyrion's child and Tysha as the woman who got over Tyrion and her rape and managed to fall in love again seems much more likely, even if the evidence doesn't otherwise seem to support it.

...I dunno, though. Given Tyrion and Tywin's issues with prostitutes, it would be strangely fitting if Lanna, a prostitute, turned out to be Tyrion's child, and much thematically richer than Pod being Tyrion's child. Didn't Tywin once tell Tyrion that he wouldn't let Tyrion turn Casterly Rock into his whorehouse? If Lanna somehow learns her parentage, manages to travel to Westeros, and is the only Lannister left standing at the end of the series, that utterance could very well turn out to be prophetic.

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The point on the sailor's wife and her behaviour suggesting marriage trauma is a good interpretation and possible.

Maybe though, since Tysha was not a whore to begin with, I just really want for her to have not turned into one. Maybe it is silly but that is just so sad.

It would not only be sad, this is not the important point for me. There may be a higher likelihood that victims of abuse are not in touch with their own self and body and are more likely to allow themselves to get abused again.

And yet it is so cliché. The poor downtrodden whore..... I would want Tysha to have saved herself, to have built a life of her own as successful shopowner, farmer, merchant or merchant's wife or whatever. The victim who does not stay victim, who wins herself back. The proverbial agency for female characters - here it could have happened. Please no cliché.

Where is Pod in that story? I don't know but I would like him to be a main character.

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I always have a hard time buying that Tyrion/Tysha would have had a child, regardless of who that kid is said to be. Tysha was raped by over 50 men, that's a lot of trauma on her body, especially her reproductive organs. She's also very young when it happens. I cannot imagine a 13 year old girl surviving a rape that brutal without major internal injuries, the kind that would make it so she could never bare children.

I just find it hard to believe that Tysha could have survived that kind of brutal attack and not miscarried if already pregnant or be left barren. 50+ men is unimaginable. Her lady parts would be most likely be severely damaged, especially without any medical attention.

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I always have a hard time buying that Tyrion/Tysha would have had a child, regardless of who that kid is said to be. Tysha was raped by over 50 men, that's a lot of trauma on her body, especially her reproductive organs. She's also very young when it happens. I cannot imagine a 13 year old girl surviving a rape that brutal without major internal injuries, the kind that would make it so she could never bare children.

I just find it hard to believe that Tysha could have survived that kind of brutal attack and not miscarried if already pregnant or be left barren. 50+ men is unimaginable. Her lady parts would be most likely be severely damaged.

Yes, in real life, I absolutely agree that that would be the case, but GRRM's shown himself willing to play fast and loose with biological and medical realities before ("the seed is strong" Baratheon super-genes, for one). I don't think we can rule out any Tysha child theories on that basis.

ETA: gammaerys' point about Lollys is a good one. If one ASOIAF character bore a healthy child despite being raped by 50 men, no reason to believe that Tysha couldn't have done the same.

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There are a slight little chance that Tyrion might be Pod's father, but very very very thin. And thin as it might be, it's still more probable than Tysha being the mother.

Was Tysha named after Tywin? Hmm.

I've always thought about that...

I always have a hard time buying that Tyrion/Tysha would have had a child, regardless of who that kid is said to be. Tysha was raped by over 50 men, that's a lot of trauma on her body, especially her reproductive organs. She's also very young when it happens. I cannot imagine a 13 year old girl surviving a rape that brutal without major internal injuries, the kind that would make it so she could never bare children.

I just find it hard to believe that Tysha could have survived that kind of brutal attack and not miscarried if already pregnant or be left barren. 50+ men is unimaginable. Her lady parts would be most likely be severely damaged, especially without any medical attention.

Apparently, doesn't apply in ASOIAF. Lollys was raped by 50 men and she got a relatively good pregnancy. Even Bronn speaks of having a child with her.

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It would not only be sad, this is not the important point for me. There may be a higher likelihood that victims of abuse are not in touch with their own self and body and are more likely to allow themselves to get abused again.

And yet it is so cliché. The poor downtrodden whore..... I would want Tysha to have saved herself, to have built a life of her own as successful shopowner, farmer, merchant or merchant's wife or whatever. The victim who does not stay victim, who wins herself back. The proverbial agency for female characters - here it could have happened. Please no cliché.

Where is Pod in that story? I don't know but I would like him to be a main character.

I do also hope that if Tysha ever turns up, that she is not a whore, because although victims of sex abuse turning to prostitution does occur (we know Shae ran away from home rather than be raped by her father), having that happen to every such character would be cliche and also reinforces assumptions that a sexually abused woman is somehow "ruined" when it comes to having a healthy sexuality. Not saying every prostitute is a victim, some certainly do choose that profession voluntarily, but I doubt Tysha would have. Also, she wasn't thrown out in the street penniless, she actually was left with a substantial amount of money, so she would have options other than prostitution. She could have lived off that money until she found some other way to make a living, or even just found another man to marry.

I also hope she isn't a whore to prove Tywin wrong. It seems he really did see Tysha as a gold-digger who was no better than a whore. (For similar reasons, I really hope A + J = T is wrong. If Tyrion really was a bastard, that would seem to validate much of what Tywin said and did to Tyrion)

ETA: I'm not sure if either Tysha or Lollys actually were raped by 50+ men. That just seems to be a number GRRM likes to use when it comes to gang-rape. But even if they were, it does seem that biology in Westeros is not meant to completely line up with RL biology, even if he tries to approximate it. (For example, boiling wine would actually be less effective for disinfection than cold rubbing alcohol, because boiling it would reduce the alcohol content.)

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Pod, Tyrion's son?

I've always wondered why Pod reminded me so much of Tyrion?

Doesn't he have the same mismatched eyes like Tyrion? What was it, one green eye and one black?

Or maybe it's his hair. I always remember Pod having platinum blond hair...

Or is it his height? The last time I saw Pod he was shorter than Tyrion...

No, no, I remember! It's Pod's infamous political savvy! He's not training to be a squire, he's training to be a political mastermind and battle commander, to completely and utterly win the game of thrones! So like Tyrion!

Gee, with all those similarities, it makes me wonder why I never suspected Tyrion was Pod's dad before!

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