Any predictions of Arya's fate?

[Yojimbo]

But the idea of suicide is out of question

I love how my pure speculation is out of the question, yet yours is not :lol:

George is that you? Could you pretty please send me a copy of tWoW early pretty please :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: :bowdown: and if it not George could you tell me where you bought your crystal ball from mine seems to be not working correctly :frown5:

[Sun]

My expectation for Arya, hmmmm...

Her ending will be bittersweet, I think. Her bitter will be in that she can never go home, by the time it is all is over she will have been too changed, she'll not belong to the North any longer. Her sweet will be that she is reunited with Nymera.

It sucks, doesn't it? I really can't think of a satisfying ending for Arya.

[Reek Havoc]

There's a natural pattern to Arya's story arc that leads me to believe she will not stay with the FM for much longer, but return back to Westeros instead. The pattern has its flaws, but it also has certain reasoning behind those flaws.

The pattern:

GoT - travels with her father and Sansa to KL. Trains with Syrio. Leaves KL with Yoren.
CoK- travels with Yoren. Trapped in Harrenhall. Leaves / escapes Harrenhall with Gendry and Hot Pie.
SoS - travels with Gendry and Hot Pie. Caught by the BwB and then by The Hound. Leaves for Braavos.
AFfC- short travel to Braavos. Introduction to HoBaW. Begins training.
DWD - continues training.

Travels. Adventure / experience / make new acquaintances. Leaves.

With the exception of DWD, the pattern holds true. However, the interruption of pattern was necessary because a.) true training could never be accomplished within the span of one book, and b.) I believe that I read somewhere that GRRM felt that since he had already left a lot of the more popular characters out of DWD, he didn't feel he that could leave all of them out. Arya would be the natural choice to go with simply because she was in need of training anyway, which forces her to stay put in Braavos for a while.

Then take into consideration the fact that the Mercy chapter was originally intended to go in the end of DWD. Maybe it was left out so that the reader would be left to wonder whether Arya would remain the "little girl lost" to the FM for the rest of her life. In Mercy, we see an almost re-awakening of Arya's identity. She's reminded of her list and given a reason to want to be Arya again.

So now back to the pattern and my prediction -

Leaves Braavos. Maybe she sees something in a dream through Nymeria that provokes her to leave, or maybe she hears word of something going on that she feels the need to be a part of.... it could be any number of things. Returns to Westeros and renews old acquaintances. Nymeria? BWB and LS? Maybe Theon? (That one's probably just wishful thinking on my part.) Depends on where GRRM takes her and where the ship that she sails on lands. Saves a couple lives, or maybe gets her own life saved. Reforms (or makes new) alliances. Maybe does a little dirty work (Freys? Boltons?).... but overall, I think Arya will spend WoW returning back to Westeros with her new training under her belt, regroup, and prepare for the Big Whatever that's about to go down in ADoS.

Arya is on a hero's journey. Too much time, writing, and effort has gone into her journey and training for it to be anything else. She's at the point where she has hit rock bottom, almost losing herself to her training with the FM, basically lost all hope regarding her family, friends, or future... It's time for her to rebound.

As for her ultimate fate, she'll either survive it all or die at the end. She's just too huge of a character for her to not do something that majorly impacts the end outcome.

[AnotherCrannogman]

I expect Arya will die. She has no huge role to play. I do hope she kills off some Lannisters. Would she join up with Dany? The old enemy of my enemy is my friend deal...

[Reek Havoc]

She has no huge role to play.

Okay, she may die, but c'mon...

All that training, only to do nothing with it... what would be the point? In a real life situation, sure I could see it happening. But from a writer's perspective, it makes no sense to devote that much time to explaining why a child would have the skills that she has acquired only to die with said newly acquired skillset left unused. Of course she's doing something big. I don't pretend to know what that something might be, but it will be something important.

[AnotherCrannogman]

I am not saying she will not kill some important people but this is game of thrones where if she did not do it there are a million other ways to die. What role will she play that c I understand only be played by her? Pretty sure that is really only royalty in these books.

[zeppelincheetah]

I think the end game will be a whole lot of very tough decisions. Arya has become so far apart from her family, carving a new identity that she will be on one side and they (Sansa) will be on the other side and they will hardly recognize eachother, but both will want to kill the other. Arya will have moved on from simply crossing off her list and will become a hired assassin. Sansa (who I think will be queen by book 7) will have heard about an assassin and she will hire good men to kill this assassin and Arya in turn will learn from whom these men were sent and go after Sansa (who will have fully taken the identity of Alayne). They finally come face to face and recognize who the other is at the last second.

[Yojimbo]

Okay, she may die, but c'mon...

All that training, only to do nothing with it... what would be the point? In a real life situation, sure I could see it happening. But from a writer's perspective, it makes no sense to devote that much time to explaining why a child would have the skills that she has acquired only to die with said newly acquired skillset left unused. Of course she's doing something big. I don't pretend to know what that something might be, but it will be something important.

But this has already happened to a Stark child, Robb. He was so close but yet so far. It can only take a few small steps and the Hero becomes the tragic victim. Ned shared th same fate, many others have aswell in aSoIaF. I love Arya's character but the only thing am hoping for her though her end story conclusion will be satisfying and a gripping read, which I know George is more than capable of doing, what ever he decides what Arya's fate maybe.

[Reek Havoc]

But this has already happened to a Stark child, Robb. He was so close but yet so far. It can only take a few small steps and the Hero becomes the tragic victim. Ned shared the same fate, many others have aswell in aSoIaF. I love Arya's character but the only thing am hoping for her though her end story conclusion will be satisfying and a gripping read, which I know George is more than capable of doing, what ever he decides what Arya's fate maybe.

Keep in mind, I never said she wouldn't die, I said she had something important to do and probably wouldn't die until the end. I'm not saying that I entirely disagree with your points, but I think there has just been too much effort put into her character for her to die without doing something major.... it would be incredibly anti-climactic. Just a few things to point out:

1. Robb was never a POV. Arya is not just a POV, but also a principal character, as stated by GRRM (The list of principals includes Tyrion, Jon, Arya, and Dany.) Not saying that saves her ultimately, but IMO it gives her a better shot at survival than a majority of the other characters. At least until almost the end of the books, anyway. Then all bets are off.

2. Robb never had any onscreen training. No time was dedicated to describing / explaining how it was that he came to have the skills (or lack thereof) to do what he was setting out to do.

3. Ned's beheading and his actions / discoveries preceding his death (the raven to Stannis, specifically. There are others but I'm rush typing atm, sorry) were necessary catalysts for the rest of the series.

My first post in the thread (#223) explains why I think she'll be around for a while. Given those factors, plus all of the loose ends she still has to tie up in order for her to have a satisfying grand finale, I just don't see her... uh... expiring.. much before the end of the books.

[A Man Has Said]

There's a natural pattern to Arya's story arc that leads me to believe she will not stay with the FM for much longer, but return back to Westeros instead. The pattern has its flaws, but it also has certain reasoning behind those flaws.

The pattern:

GoT - travels with her father and Sansa to KL. Trains with Syrio. Leaves KL with Yoren.

CoK- travels with Yoren. Trapped in Harrenhall. Leaves / escapes Harrenhall with Gendry and Hot Pie.

SoS - travels with Gendry and Hot Pie. Caught by the BwB and then by The Hound. Leaves for Braavos.

AFfC- short travel to Braavos. Introduction to HoBaW. Begins training.

DWD - continues training.

Travels. Adventure / experience / make new acquaintances. Leaves.

With the exception of DWD, the pattern holds true. However, the interruption of pattern was necessary because a.) true training could never be accomplished within the span of one book, and b.) I believe that I read somewhere that GRRM felt that since he had already left a lot of the more popular characters out of DWD, he didn't feel he that could leave all of them out. Arya would be the natural choice to go with simply because she was in need of training anyway, which forces her to stay put in Braavos for a while.

Then take into consideration the fact that the Mercy chapter was originally intended to go in the end of DWD. Maybe it was left out so that the reader would be left to wonder whether Arya would remain the "little girl lost" to the FM for the rest of her life. In Mercy, we see an almost re-awakening of Arya's identity. She's reminded of her list and given a reason to want to be Arya again.

So now back to the pattern and my prediction -

Leaves Braavos. Maybe she sees something in a dream through Nymeria that provokes her to leave, or maybe she hears word of something going on that she feels the need to be a part of.... it could be any number of things. Returns to Westeros and renews old acquaintances. Nymeria? BWB and LS? Maybe Theon? (That one's probably just wishful thinking on my part.) Depends on where GRRM takes her and where the ship that she sails on lands. Saves a couple lives, or maybe gets her own life saved. Reforms (or makes new) alliances. Maybe does a little dirty work (Freys? Boltons?).... but overall, I think Arya will spend WoW returning back to Westeros with her new training under her belt, regroup, and prepare for the Big Whatever that's about to go down in ADoS.

Arya is on a hero's journey. Too much time, writing, and effort has gone into her journey and training for it to be anything else. She's at the point where she has hit rock bottom, almost losing herself to her training with the FM, basically lost all hope regarding her family, friends, or future... It's time for her to rebound.

As for her ultimate fate, she'll either survive it all or die at the end. She's just too huge of a character for her to not do something that majorly impacts the end outcome.

Patterns like that are the worst possible predictors in literature, especially when they have exceptions as this one does.

It looks like it might be something, it could even be something deliberately done by GRRM,

but the chances are very good that it's just coincidence.

When a character is uprooted from their home and family, it's pretty likely that they're going to travel around quite a bit looking for a new home and so on.

This is especially true when they're being pursued or have a price on their head as Arya does.

Now that there is a fake Arya out there, it's doubly important for the people (Littlefinger, Boltons and Lannisters) who created the fake to get rid of the real Arya.

So naturally we're going to see her moving around a lot, going where no-one expects her to be, and taking on a series of false identies.

It's necessary for her survival.

Smart girl.

[DaughterOfThe9Moons]

1. Robb was never a POV. Arya is not just a POV, but also a principal character, as stated by GRRM (The list of principals includes Tyrion, Jon, Arya, and Dany.) Not saying that saves her ultimately, but IMO it gives her a better shot at survival than a majority of the other characters. At least until almost the end of the books, anyway. Then all bets are off.

2. Robb never had any onscreen training. No time was dedicated to describing / explaining how it was that he came to have the skills (or lack thereof) to do what he was setting out to do.

3. Ned's beheading and his actions / discoveries preceding his death (the raven to Stannis, specifically. There are others but I'm rush typing atm, sorry) were necessary catalysts for the rest of the series.

:agree: Far too much time has been poured into her story line and her characterisation to have her killed until right before the end (if at all).

[Yojimbo]

Keep in mind, I never said she wouldn't die, I said she had something important to do and probably wouldn't die until the end. I'm not saying that I entirely disagree with your points, but I think there has just been too much effort put into her character for her to die without doing something major.... it would be incredibly anti-climactic. Just a few things to point out:

1. Robb was never a POV. Arya is not just a POV, but also a principal character, as stated by GRRM (The list of principals includes Tyrion, Jon, Arya, and Dany.) Not saying that saves her ultimately, but IMO it gives her a better shot at survival than a majority of the other characters. At least until almost the end of the books, anyway. Then all bets are off.

2. Robb never had any onscreen training. No time was dedicated to describing / explaining how it was that he came to have the skills (or lack thereof) to do what he was setting out to do.

3. Ned's beheading and his actions / discoveries preceding his death (the raven to Stannis, specifically. There are others but I'm rush typing atm, sorry) were necessary catalysts for the rest of the series.

My first post in the thread (#223) explains why I think she'll be around for a while. Given those factors, plus all of the loose ends she still has to tie up in order for her to have a satisfying grand finale, I just don't see her... uh... expiring.. much before the end of the books.

And I can see where your coming from aswell, and I really can't disagree. But in the same vain why can't Arya's death be the necessary catalyst that move the story foward? There been alot of talk in this thread about Arya returning to Westeros, but is it also possible she could go to Essos? Say for example; "The kindly man sends Arya on a mission to kill the "Queen", from Arya's POV there would be only one queen; Cersei. Arya would jump at the chance for this. Say the boat she takes arrives at Meereen not Kings Landing? Will Arya not furfill the Kindly Mans order, after all, it would not be that he lied to her, Arya wants Queen Cersei dead, not the faceless person Arya keeps on telling the Kindly man she is "Who are you child?" "No one". Maybe Arya's attempt on Dany's life is what gets Dany's arse moving to Westoros? Maybe it would the "straw that broke the camels back" and sends Dany over the edge in to madness (mad queen theory) But if Arya was to fail, it may or may not be the end of Arya and her story. Thus completing her role for a catalyst for the story to move foward and ultimately leading to her tragic end.

This is one of the reason I love Arya's charater (and aSoIaF) so much, Arya character could lead to little or no consequences in the grand scheme of things, she could also lead to massive changes in the story. All we as the reader can do is guess until George release's this infomation to us. The hope I have with all of us is this, as long as George manages to deliver a satisfying conclusion to Arya's story, does it really matter where her fate takes her? For Good or for Bad? But I just can't buy into the theory that just because George has written so much about Arya she has to be of great importance, as I said she could just be a tragic victim in the story of aSaIaF. Hell this a not a new thing in story telling, why did Shakespeare write so much about Romeo and Juliet? After all they both got knocked off in the end?

[Reek Havoc]

And I can see where your coming from aswell, and I really can't disagree. But in the same vain why can't Arya's death be the necessary catalyst that move the story foward? There been alot of talk in this thread about Arya returning to Westeros, but is it also possible she could go to Essos? Say for example; "The kindly man sends Arya on a mission to kill the "Queen", from Arya's POV there would be only one queen; Cersei. Arya would jump at the chance for this. Say the boat she takes arrives at Meereen not Kings Landing? Will Arya not furfill the Kindly Mans order, after all, it would not be that he lied to her, Arya wants Queen Cersei dead, not the faceless person Arya keeps on telling the Kindly man she is "Who are you child?" "No one". Maybe Arya's attempt on Dany's life is what gets Dany's arse moving to Westoros? Maybe it would the "straw that broke the camels back" and sends Dany over the edge in to madness (mad queen theory) But if Arya was to fail, it may or may not be the end of Arya and her story. Thus completing her role for a catalyst for the story to move foward and ultimately leading to her tragic end.

This is one of the reason I love Arya's charater (and aSoIaF) so much, Arya character could lead to little or no consequences in the grand scheme of things, she could also lead to massive changes in the story. All we as the reader can do is guess until George release's this infomation to us. The hope I have with all of us is this, as long as George manages to deliver a satisfying conclusion to Arya's story, does it really matter where her fate takes her? For Good or for Bad? But I just can't buy into the theory that just because George has written so much about Arya she has to be of great importance, as I said she could just be a tragic victim in the story of aSaIaF. Hell this a not a new thing in story telling, why did Shakespeare write so much about Romeo and Juliet? After all they both got knocked off in the end?

I've thought of that myself, and Arya ending up in Meereen is almost equally possible, you're right. I have a hard time picturing the FM sending her there to kill someone as important as Dany, though.... or even kill outside of Braavos at all, while still in training. But that doesn't mean she couldn't go as assistant or trainee. I just don't see them making it her job to see to it that Dany is taken out.

You're right, it could go many different ways. But, just for the record, even if she was a tragic victim, it doesn't necessarily take away from her importance.

[Rhaegar Targaryen's Ghost]

I've thought about the people she could be sent to kill, and aside from the common ones i've seen (Jon, Cersei, Littlefinger) i really think that it could be Catelyn that she has to go after. Something about the FM respecting the dead, and UnCat not being truly dead or alive, I think an Arya-UnCat showdown could be in store. It would also allow her to get back at the BWB members she so desperately wants revenge on for the whole "let the Hound go" thing.

[idler]

:idea: That's an easy one:

As they were leading their dragons behind a pair of direwolves over the smoking ashes of the Twins with the charred corpses of Others beyond count, the King turned with a sad face to his dashing young ally from Braavos, only recently chosen for Sealady.
"I will miss you, little cousin, but who knows..."
They said it together.
"...different roads sometimes lead to the same castle."

[Chad Brick]

Well, I see that

1: Show-Melisandre clearly prophesizes that she and Ayra will meet again

2: The Hound is alive

3: Show-Melisandre tells the Hound that he has something to do for the Lord of Light, which he clearly has not done yet

4: Melisandre is on Arya's list

So Arya attempts to assassinate Melisandre, and for some reason, the Hound is there, and kills Arya before she can kill Melisandre? Perhaps it would be better if somehow Martin were to bring us around to the point that we WANTED Melisandre to live and Ayra's mis-guided assassination attempt to be foiled? And of course, having Ayra die precisely because of her earlier lack of mercy would be fitting.

[Daenor]

Well, I see that

1: Show-Melisandre clearly prophesizes that she and Ayra will meet again

2: The Hound is alive

3: Show-Melisandre tells the Hound that he has something to do for the Lord of Light, which he clearly has not done yet

4: Melisandre is on Arya's list

So Arya attempts to assassinate Melisandre, and for some reason, the Hound is there, and kills Arya before she can kill Melisandre? Perhaps it would be better if somehow Martin were to bring us around to the point that we WANTED Melisandre to live and Ayra's mis-guided assassination attempt to be foiled? And of course, having Ayra die precisely because of her earlier lack of mercy would be fitting.

Personally i wouldn't make a lot of speculations based on the show.They alter things somewhat and sometimes they merge characters.So this could mean anything.Plus in the books those people have never met thus far.One thing for sure is that in the show Mel iirc prepares the viewers for Arya's future training by predicting that she's gonna kill a lot of people.

[You Lie]

And I can see where your coming from aswell, and I really can't disagree. But in the same vain why can't Arya's death be the necessary catalyst that move the story foward? There been alot of talk in this thread about Arya returning to Westeros, but is it also possible she could go to Essos? Say for example; "The kindly man sends Arya on a mission to kill the "Queen", from Arya's POV there would be only one queen; Cersei. Arya would jump at the chance for this. Say the boat she takes arrives at Meereen not Kings Landing? Will Arya not furfill the Kindly Mans order, after all, it would not be that he lied to her, Arya wants Queen Cersei dead, not the faceless person Arya keeps on telling the Kindly man she is "Who are you child?" "No one". Maybe Arya's attempt on Dany's life is what gets Dany's arse moving to Westoros? Maybe it would the "straw that broke the camels back" and sends Dany over the edge in to madness (mad queen theory) But if Arya was to fail, it may or may not be the end of Arya and her story. Thus completing her role for a catalyst for the story to move foward and ultimately leading to her tragic end.

This is one of the reason I love Arya's charater (and aSoIaF) so much, Arya character could lead to little or no consequences in the grand scheme of things, she could also lead to massive changes in the story. All we as the reader can do is guess until George release's this infomation to us. The hope I have with all of us is this, as long as George manages to deliver a satisfying conclusion to Arya's story, does it really matter where her fate takes her? For Good or for Bad? But I just can't buy into the theory that just because George has written so much about Arya she has to be of great importance, as I said she could just be a tragic victim in the story of aSaIaF. Hell this a not a new thing in story telling, why did Shakespeare write so much about Romeo and Juliet? After all they both got knocked off in the end?

I can't disagree with you even though the obvious would be Arya staying alive until the end and then all odds are off. But I've tried to think what would be a climax on Arya's story that doesn't involve the "ice and fire" collision and can't think of anything that makes sense so I reached the conclusion that there's still a lot more to come for her. I thought about what you said and the theory of going to Meereen but do we really need another POV there? And by reading the last Daenerys chapter in DWD, we can assume that there will be a change in her mind whether it will lead her back to Westeros or turn her to the "dark side". Also, I feel that if she is still not convinced to go to Westeros, that's why Tyrion is there for. So something else I was thinking is if Arya leaves Braavos she could end up somewhere in Essos like you said but maybe Volantis? Like on a mission to kill one of the Triarchs and "accidentally" help Dany take over the city while her army is surrounding the walls of Volantis? I mean we know the volantene fleet is sent to Meereen so that could add in its importance other than providing Dany with a fleet to sail back. And Arya could also (over)hear a convo between Dany and Tyrion that one of his desires is to see Cercei dead and that would turn "no-one" back to Arya Stark.

That's just speculation but I would like to hear another theory that would make Arya not surviving until the end and still not make GRRM from an unpredictable and unconventional writer to a weirdly cynical writer just for the sake of shocking the audience.

[Daenor]

I find it hard to believe they'll send Arya who is just an apprentice on some rather important mission whether it is in Braavos or another place.Any option concerning the direction towards which she'll move,be it west or east, is possible.There's her ultimate goal of returning to Westeros in order to try get her revenge so we could see her moving there.There's her wish to see a dragon which some people interpret it as a forshadowing she'll move east and meet with Dany(although i have to say that Martin hadn't been very generous with his characters concerning their wishes).In any case this i don't think her path will be determined through an FM mission.

Edit: Found that quote i was looking. "Do you have any idea how costly they are? You could hire an army of common sellswords for half the price, and that’s for a merchant. I don’t dare think what they might ask for a princess"

This was said from LF at the small council (A Game of Thrones, Chapter 33, Eddard, p 355).This means that the price for a target can dramatically increase depending on his importance.Which leads me further more to the conclusion i made before.If they value their "job" that much they won't be sending a young apprentice for someone important

[purake]

I would start paying more attention to the show, its starting to pass the books in terms of quality, its facilitating the story much much better than GRRM has been able to do in the books. perfect example was Jayne westerling.... GRRM left that as a loose end, and obviously told the writers"well yeah not gonan do anything with her anyway, kill her" GRRM lost a little bit of structure right around robbs death (which I loved) and oberyns death(which I hated), the show is structuring the story very well, the clues in the show can be very telling, and sometimes I feel its becoming more of GRRMs real vision