Mdoggy Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I am starting to think Ned might not be as dead as we think. Sansa has proven to be an unreliable narrator (hence the Unkiss with the Hound) George R.R. Martin said he was setting her up as an unreliable narrator. When I read that i began to wonder why Sansa needed to be an unreliable narrator. What event has she witnessed that here presence has made any other outcomes highly unlikely? My first thought was Arya and Joffery's fight but then I started to wonder if her unreliability could mean Ned was not dead. She was the only one really close to the beheading that knew him extremely well. Sure everyone else knew him a bit at court but they knew him as a noble lord and any difference in appearance could be blamed on the time he spent in the Black Cells. Sansa was the only one who knew Ned as more than just a Lord. When I first saw the Ned is not Dead theory I thought it was possible if not for Sansa. Now that Sansa has been purposely cast as an unreliable Narrator, I am more willing to accept the Ned is not dead theory. I cant think of another key event that she witnessed that her unreliable narration would change anything. This is a bit of a Crackpot theory but it kinda makes sense to meThoughts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mladen Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 And those people at Baelor's sept, including Cersei, Janos Slynt, Varys, LF, Joffrey, KG, are they all unreliable too? Sansa is not the only one whom we hear Ned is dead from. Also, Mdoggy, welcome to the boards. May you have nice and pleasant time here :cheers: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OberynBlackfyre Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 dude Ned is DEAD. King of the Lichyard. Old bone jones. So dead, his name his Dead Ned. Welcome to the board! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Field of Asphodel Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 You are making vast sweeping assumptions based on very little information. Sansa was unreliable about "the Unkiss" back in whichever book she reflected on that. Who knows - if you ask her about it now, she might admit they never kissed. Every character is a little unreliable at times. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Crannogman Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I used to hope Ned was alive still and clung to the straw that Sansa was an unreliable narrator so he may be alive, however as people have said to me- what role would Ned do that someone else couldn't do in him being alive. Furthermore wouldn't Ned being alive take away from the heart wrenching brutality of the series as the generally good guy who was looking out for his family was killed.Ned is dead, ned is dead :crying: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myhousigilisthehousecat Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 NED, it rhymes with DEAD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maester Pedant Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 What would be the point of Ned being alive? From a narrative point of view, it makes a lot more sense if he is dead. Ned being alive after all that happened because everyone believes he is dead - more than that everyone is so sure that he is dead that no one ever doubts it - would just cancel one of the most interesting and consequential plot points in the books. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord_Tyrell Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 It was Arya's chapter. I bet you feel intelligent right about now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MyLittleFinger Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Well lets see, that scene is in Arya's POV, she recognizes him as her dad. She witnesses Slynt and Payne shove him down and hears the chop and the screams and Yoren tells her not to look so...ya he's with Arthur Dayne and Rhaegar chilling with Howland Reed and Ashara Dayne and Ben Stark at Greywater Watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonCon's Red Beard Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 He's dead because his character is played by Sean Bean. They wouldn't let a character played by Sean Bean to survive, isn't? "Hello, GRRM. We're considering Sean Bean to play Ned Stark" "Ok, I think it's a good choice" "yeah, but we want to be sure first: he's dead, right?" "Like, really really dead? He won't return? Never?" "No, guys. You have my word: he's dead for sure." "Ok, thanks". "Good. Do we call Bean now?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ser Greg of House House Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Oh God. EVERY POV IS AN UNRELIABLE NARRATOR IN SOME WAY OR ANOTHER! Some more, other less, depending on the situation. It's not supposed to mean Sansa is crazy and everything she sees is false. Also because the grand 'unreliable narrator' bit is about the kiss, and she wasn't SEEING it, she was REMEMBERING it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ned's Little Girl Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I think you're misunderstanding the idea of unreliable narrator. Her POVs as they are happening are not unreliable. However, some of her later recollections are different than the contemporaneous event, like the UnKiss. We know it didn't happen, because we saw in her POV that it didn't. It's only later, when she thinks back to that event, that she remembers a kiss. That's the unreliability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Queen Sansa Stark Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 According to this theory everyone in Westeros is an unreliable narrator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TreyWickedMagician Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Red Wedding didn't happen. Catelyn and Arya were unreliable narrators. Robb, his bannerman and entire northern army is at the Greywater Watch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~DarkHorse~ Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 edit- I figured out how to make a hyperlink! :D Ned is dead, baby! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tellus Explorer Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 I am starting to think Ned might not be as dead as we think. Sansa has proven to be an unreliable narrator (hence the Unkiss with the Hound) George R.R. Martin said he was setting her up as an unreliable narrator. When I read that i began to wonder why Sansa needed to be an unreliable narrator. What event has she witnessed that here presence has made any other outcomes highly unlikely? My first thought was Arya and Joffery's fight but then I started to wonder if her unreliability could mean Ned was not dead. She was the only one really close to the beheading that knew him extremely well. Sure everyone else knew him a bit at court but they knew him as a noble lord and any difference in appearance could be blamed on the time he spent in the Black Cells. Sansa was the only one who knew Ned as more than just a Lord. When I first saw the Ned is not Dead theory I thought it was possible if not for Sansa. Now that Sansa has been purposely cast as an unreliable Narrator, I am more willing to accept the Ned is not dead theory. I cant think of another key event that she witnessed that her unreliable narration would change anything. This is a bit of a Crackpot theory but it kinda makes sense to meThoughts? There were other witnesses to Ned's death, a very PUBLIC execution.... So I can't see his death being an account that was recorded wrongETA: I agree however that Sansa has a lot of unreliable source for information..... So I never trust anything that happens to her when there isn't another coherent character to back up the facts of the event. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Abominable SnowOther Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 your all Summer Childs! Ned lives, it is [post=https://i.imgur.com/TsECbjg.gif]known Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rhaegar I Targaryen Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 So we are now fairly certain that Ned's alive ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Light a wight tonight Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 Poor Ned, lost his head, now he's dead. 'Nuff said. I mean, it was Ilyn Payne with the sword, not Uri Geller. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Field of Asphodel Posted April 12, 2014 Share Posted April 12, 2014 ETA: I agree however that Sansa has a lot of unreliable source for information..... So I never trust anything that happens to her when there isn't another coherent character to back up the facts of the event. Seriously? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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