Angalin

A Compendium of Theories v.2

252 posts in this topic

aren't there 6 or 7 parts to the great northern conspiracy ? where can I find the links to the rest?

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aren't there 6 or 7 parts to the great northern conspiracy ? where can I find the links to the rest?

Here you go: http://acornhall.tumblr.com/

Includes links to the various threads on this forum as well as Yeade's seven part essay, Lady Gwyn's 'Grand Riverlands Conspiracy' and Bran Vras' 'The Winterfell Huis Clos.'

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Here you go: http://acornhall.tumblr.com/

Includes links to the various threads on this forum as well as Yeade's seven part essay, Lady Gwyn's 'Grand Riverlands Conspiracy' and Bran Vras' 'The Winterfell Huis Clos.'

Thanks!

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Here you go: http://acornhall.tumblr.com/

Includes links to the various threads on this forum as well as Yeade's seven part essay, Lady Gwyn's 'Grand Riverlands Conspiracy' and Bran Vras' 'The Winterfell Huis Clos.'

Thank you!!!!

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Satin = Tansi a girl pretending to be a boy in the NW. Just like Danny Flint. Maybe who Hoster Tully was talking about on his death bed. More likely im just crazy.

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Satin = Tansi a girl pretending to be a boy in the NW. Just like Danny Flint. Maybe who Hoster Tully was talking about on his death bed. More likely im just crazy.

I thought Hoster was talking about Tansy on his death bed because it was the Tansy Tea he made Lysa drink to have an aborition. Thus all the jabbering about 'all the blood' and whatnot.

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I thought Hoster was talking about Tansy on his death bed because it was the Tansy Tea he made Lysa drink to have an aborition. Thus all the jabbering about 'all the blood' and whatnot.

I think he was being facetious.

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This might be a bit of a crackpot theory, but I've been thinking about the Faceless Men and the religion of R’hllor. What if they were hired to execute the prophecies or support Melisandre's "magic" for example killing off Balon Greyjoy? Melisandre sorts Stannis out with a glowing sword, it's not something he went off and did by himself or by accident, so I don't think it's far fetched that they/Melisandre would be trying to make certain prophecies happen. I'm sure the religion of R'hllor has money, or maybe even more out there has converted one of the FM to their cause.


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I know everyone favours Mance as the author, but I still think Stannis wrote the Pink Letter. http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/89829-stannis-wrote-the-pink-letter-long/



And I know everyone thinks Stannis was duped by the Mance/Rattleshirt switch but... http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/91687-stannis-knew-about-the-mancerattleshirt-switch/



But there's also something shady about Ser Robert Strong: http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/114294-the-genesis-of-ser-robert-strong-shadow-assassin/


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This might be a bit of a crackpot theory, but I've been thinking about the Faceless Men and the religion of R’hllor. What if they were hired to execute the prophecies or support Melisandre's "magic" for example killing off Balon Greyjoy? Melisandre sorts Stannis out with a glowing sword, it's not something he went off and did by himself or by accident, so I don't think it's far fetched that they/Melisandre would be trying to make certain prophecies happen. I'm sure the religion of R'hllor has money, or maybe even more out there has converted one of the FM to their cause.

Melisandre doesn't have the resources to pull out some thing like that.

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Just came fresh off the Howland Reed = High Septon thread.



Please add this to the OP, it is an extremely strong and textually supported theory.



Thanks.


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Just came fresh off the Howland Reed = High Septon thread.

Please add this to the OP, it is an extremely strong and textually supported theory.

Thanks.

I have a feeling this thread has been abandoned or not checked in a while because nothing has been added to the OP in a while.

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I have a feeling this thread has been abandoned or not checked in a while because nothing has been added to the OP in a while.

I've been trying to contact the OP, shmoove, to amend the theory and include the massive amount of new evidence I've supplied. I'd love to create a new thread to include this information, as I find it most relevant, but I'm afraid it would just be locked up (as I've had some unexplained issues with this before) - see links in signature ;)

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Just came fresh off the Howland Reed = High Septon thread.

Please add this to the OP, it is an extremely strong and textually supported theory.

Thanks.

Link to the theory please

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http://asoiaf.westeros.org/index.php/topic/116209-spoilers-all-two-nights-watchtheir-true-history;-the-others-purpose;-tnk;-etc/




Basically (cut and pasted):



Before I begin, let me just state this topic was started out of the "Others Being Misogynist" thread, it kinda got off topic, so I wanted to place my thoughts here out of respect for the original poster.



That being said, a LOT of this topic is heresay, not a lot is known about The Others, and all knowledge we have to go on is from word-of-mouth characters in-book, and the Game Of Thrones prologue. This topic is meant for constructive theoretical thinking, and deconstructive, with what little information we have to go on.



This isn't a thread for sarcasm, or useless pointless disagreement: back up your statements with facts, and realize this is a subject that not only would be controversial according to what we know so far, but attempts to focus on the hints given, rather than how the story is progressed, and a lot on how the story may progress. There are theories that are in fact crackpot contained here, however they are supported by actual fact. In my eyes, all theories are crackpot until theyre read on paper or seen onscreen.



I give you, The LB Theory:




A few facts that we know:


-HBO slipped up on the reveal on the 'leader' of the Others, confirming him as the Night's King. Don't think they'd deviate something this large, from the books.


-In THAT scene, there were The Night's King, and 12 Others around him.


-The Night's King, was the 13th Lord Commander, of the Night's Watch.


-It can be debated, that the previous 12 MAY, or MAY NOT, be the 12 Lord Commanders before him


-It may not be debated, that there was once a Last Hero, and he had 12 companions, it MAY be debated, that there is some connection here.


-It may NOT be debated, that Ned and Benjen Stark, told Jon, that there was "once" nobility in the Night's Watch


-It may NOT be debated, that along with volunteers, The Night's Watch also contains liars, murderers, rapists, and poachers, and those that may or may not have committed treason


-It may NOT be debated, that Sam told Jon, that all records regarding the Night's King (and those before him), were deliberately and purposely destroyed, leaving us to go on the "word-of-mouth" from the 14th Lord Commander and then forth.


-Fact: There was no female Other in that circle of 13, in THAT episode (and only that one that we have to go on). There's also been, no evidence, book or otherwise, of a female Other, there have been female Wights (dead bodies brought back to life, given the "ice gift," as i'll hereby call it), but no female Others (living bodies, given the "ice gift") (UPDATED, see, Final Thought)




The possibility that The Night's King, & The 12 STILL uphold the basic tennets of The Night's Oath:


-I shall hold no lands: As far as we know, The Others may, or may not, be nomadic (I support that they are, however THAT episode demonstrated an ice-altar in which TNK Turned Craster's boy into an Other, as well as what appeared to be a crag-like dwelling) (the way around this, is that even The Night's Watch, hold lands, i.e. The Wall, it's castles/forts, and even The Gift was up for inheritance) If we go strictly on book knowledge, they own no lands other than dwell, north beyond the wall.


-I shall father no children: The Others as far as we know, have some sort of agreement or "contract" (debatable) with Craster, and the wildlings north of the wall. According to Craster's stipulations, he keeps his daughters, he gives away his sons, and he lives undisturbed. By The Others TAKING Craster's children and, according to that episode Turning the boys into Others, they're not "fathering" anyone -- they're TAKING them.


-I shall take no wives: The Others take Craster's BOYS, and Turn his BOYS, leaving no females to wife. We do NOT know, if there were females taken from the other wildlings to uphold compliance with them (Old Nan stated to Bran, wildlings would sell their daughters, she specifically states daughters, but a common theme is rumors can be false and "words are wind")


-I shall live and die at my post: Wights are dead. Others, are living. If The Others are in fact following The Night's Oath, then they havent died, and are STILL serving it right now..


Conclusion: It MAY, be possible, The Others, or at least the 13, are the Old Night's Watch, prior to The Night's King's exile, and continued through him and wildling children-turned-Others. If The Others are rooted in being wronged, and TNK seeks vengeance, he's turning Craster's boys into soldiers, and forming his own possible "Night's Watch." I believe the secret tothe questions, why boys, why craster's, why wildlings, lies in the blood. I think First Men blood, is the common ingredient. I think it's what activates, and can make someone an Other. This, is a theory. This would also make anyone WITH First Men blood, a potential candiate for the Ice Gift.



-Also: It's rumored, yes, RUMORED, that Bran The Builder ALLEGEDLY built The Wall. I have no problems believing he built the castles, and forts. In fact, in Catelyn I in AGOT, she says "allegedly." She also recollects, in the godswood with Ned that those eyes on the heart tree may have seen him lay the first BRICK (not ICE).


-The Wall, is made of Ice, along with castles/forts of brick


-Ice, is an element The Others seem to manipulate, it's their element, and where ever they go, the cold follows


Conclusion: The Others originally built the wall, the reasoning is debatable (perhaps, to keep everyone else OUT of their realm)




The Only Possible Way I See Jon Returning:


-Old Nan tells Bran a lot of people believed The Night's King was a Bolton, but she's sure he was a Stark.


-The current grudge in the north, is Jon Snow & Ramsay Snow, two bastards, same surname, and both hold interests in winterfell. (Old Nan's irony? Foreshadowing? Or prediction for the NEXT Night's King...)


-I forget if the Boltons have old northern first-men blood or not, but the Starks, do.


-At the Wall, Jon switched Mance Rayder's baby, with Craster's baby, and sent Sam off with Mance's "kingsblood" baby


-At the Wall, Craster's last baby, is thought to have kingsblood (the thought is that he's still Mance's), when in actuality, he's the last baby that "belongs" to The Others.


-Melisandre is at The Wall, and Melisandre believes Craster's baby, has kingsblood which is said to power her magic


Conclusion: Melisandre, could very well be sacrificing a baby that "belongs" to the Others. If there is any pact, contract or anything there, something may go wrong, with her ritual... or, there may be some Other intervention ;) Jon may not be, well, Jon. In fact, he might have a new eye color..




The Night's Watch's Turn To Darkness And Corruption:


-The Night's King was said to be exiled for being with a female Other


-There have been ZERO female Others mentioned, or seen, on episodes or books, and the only one we know of is the Nights Queen, via word of mouth of the 14th Lord Commander and from him through time


-All histories remember, have been purposely destroyed, so it's strictly whatever he said, happened


-The Others right now, appear to be holding the basic tennets of The Night's Oath


-Conclusion: There is no female Other. The 14th Commander overthrew The Night's King, with his brothers, and forced him out, erased all records of anything that contained information that may contradict anything he said, and made up the story of The Night's King's female Other for his reasoning. This is based primarily off of the facts, FACTS, that there have been NO female Others read about, or SEEN in episodes, AND the fact that all the children taken from Craster are MALE. the debate can be, we dont know if the other wildlings sacrificed females, or if Old Nan had any truth to her rumors at all.


Other Possibility: When he was exiled, he went north, where he inevitably met his doom with The Others, except, if he was a Stark or Bolton, he had First Men blood, and ended up getting Turned.




Stipulations That Would Need To Be, For Any Of This To Happen:


- If The 13 are the lord commanders, they would all need to have first men blood


-Craster, and Craster alone, is the only one that needs first men blood (all his children get more potent, with each generation he incests with), though they would NEVER be pure first men blood (the FIRST mother had to come from somewhere, it's rumored she lived in that town they visited when they went on the great ranging. or... hmm, was that his mother, i forget, it's been awhile)




Final conclusion: The Others, have a purpose, and that purpose is vengeance. The want nothing to do with Westeros. They want what was theirs -- the giant block of their power, The Wall. If they wanted Westeros, they couldve went around it in the bay of ice, or the bay of seals (Patchface: i will lead it! we will march into the sea and out again!...) It's the Night's Watch that wronged THEM, the night's watch took their wall, built on it, and claimed it was theirs through bran the builder. Stipulation: furthermore, the cotf and the Others are enemies. to prevent retaking, they built the weirwood door and fused their magic with it, similar to the one around Bloodraven's cave (cannot pass unless with a night's watch member). However, what no one realizes, The Night's King IS a member of the Night's Watch... If not normal Others, HE can pass. If my theories of him continuing The Old Night's Watch are accurate, they can ALL pass without a problem.





Separate Crackpot Theory (Disregard, It Means Nothing And Is Outside Of This Post): The Wall will get destroyed. The Night's King is a Stark, and longs to be at rest in Winterfell's crypts. The Wall, is stopping him. Furthermore crackpot, his Night's Queen is locked/buried in Winterfell's Crypts, and that's why the struggle. That's why the "warmth," and why catelyn in Catelyn I AGOT says (paraphrase) by the godswood where Ned is polishing Ice, "winterfell's godswood, unlike riverrun's, was surrounded in decay." The Queen, is locked, beneath the earth, in a weirwood cell beneatht he weirwood tree, and she's absorbing the life, and cold, to sustain her (thus causing, the decay, and "warmth" of winterfell). Once The Night's King is laid to rest in winterfell's crypts, Jon will become The Night's King In The North, AS, an Other.




Final Thought: The secret of activating human, to Other, lies in the blood. There's a reason they choose wildlings, and Craster. I believe it's first men blood, which flows in Stark veins, and most of the houses in the north that old nan mentions to Bran. There's a clue there, in that chapter, and she's telling Bran how the Others make Others. My opinion is that Craster had First Men blood, and that it's that same blood, that's a catalyst in activating the Other, in someone. That's why he was so protective over his daughters, because the blood must be as pure as can be, and that's the contract the Others had with Craster, and the other wildlings, that shared this blood bond. The secret to why and how the Craster debacle happened, lies in the purity of the blood. He protected his daughters for a reason. If any one of them got pregnant with someone else,that didnt have first men blood, and that baby was taken, the baby might not have turned Other, and then they would have come back to him for a reason why. One can further speculate, that those without FIrst Men Blood, turn wight. If any of that scene, the 13, is accurate, than not all of the 12 other lord commanders were alive, and yet, they are Other. Yet, if they had First Men blood, this relieves that stipulation. The secret isn't living body=Other; dead body=wight; the secret is First Men blood=Other, everyone else, living OR dead=Wight. Otherwise, they wouldnt have been so meticulous in choosing who would have received the Ice Gift. The common elements that tie int he mysteries of The Others, The Night's King, and wights, as well as Craster's children = First Men Blood



Edited by Lord Blazfemur

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Satin = Tansi a girl pretending to be a boy in the NW. Just like Danny Flint. Maybe who Hoster Tully was talking about on his death bed. More likely im just crazy.

I thought Hoster was talking about Tansy on his death bed because it was the Tansy Tea he made Lysa drink to have an aborition. Thus all the jabbering about 'all the blood' and whatnot.

I think tansy tea is a likely explanation, but we do actually see a Tansy in ASoS a "buxom red-haired innkeep" Arya meets while with BwB.

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