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(Theon sample spoiler) How does the Iron Bank perceive the Others threat?


MidnightKiss

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Does the Iron Bank believe that the Others are a serious threat to the whole of Westeros?



I don't know if the Bank has property or other tangible investments in Westeros. It's certainly plausible. These investments are in danger because of the Others. They will have lent gold to many people in Westeros and if those people die or their lands are overrun with Others and wights then they won't be repaid.



They may believe that the Others do have an army but won't come past the Wall. If the Others attack in strength, will the Bank give money to the Wall/Night's Watch? To protect their investments in Westeros?



In their meeting with Stannis I don't recall them acknowledging the Others as a reason to lend him gold. They only did it because he was willing to take on the crown debts.



The Iron Bank certainly seems intelligent. Do they perceive the Others as a threat? Will they?



Also is it at all possible that the Others could cross the Narrow Sea? Can it freeze over? There are bad things in the water in the beyond the Wall. Could they attack Braavos?




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I think you might ask the wrong question.



If the Iron Bank actually does know the full extent of the threat posed by the Others their investments in Westeros would be the least of their concerns.


As far as we know the Others will bring about the long night, a catastrophic climate change that, in time, will destroy Bravoos too.


Humans in Westeros and Essos will face starvation alike if winter continues forever.



In that case, backing Stannis would be a matter of self preservation, although i doubt the bankers have already seen the full picture.


Most intelligent characters don't give a damn about doomsday prophecies (Thyrion) and that probably won't change until winter is there.



However there is wide speculation that the iron bank is heavily influenced or even controlled by the faceless men.


And who knows what these death worshippers are up to, maybe they are longing for the end of the world.


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Another thought occurred.



Since the faceless men know a lot about death and ways to kill people, would they also know (or have in their history books) ways to kill Others? Maybe we don't need to know any more ways to kill them apart from any kind of fire variant. But they could have obsidian or valyrian steel weapons (assuming they work) in their armory.


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I'm just assuming the Iron Bank are either as oblivious to the threat of the Others as everyone in Westeros is, or they are underestimating it. I think the only reason they are there to back Stannis is to get the debts paid back that the Lannisters refuse to pay.


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The IB agreed to a loan to LC Jon Snow. If there is no Night's Watch, they can't get that loan paid back either. For the IB though, it's all risk vs reward. If they think giving money to someone further south (to fight the WW) is more likely to protect their real investment in the IT, they'll send their support there. If they think the WW are going to cause the destruction of Braavos, then Braavos will commit to a full war against them. I know the Sealord is the official leader of Braavos, but it seems like the real power is between the IB and the FM.


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  • 3 weeks later...

I'm just assuming the Iron Bank are either as oblivious to the threat of the Others as everyone in Westeros is, or they are underestimating it. I think the only reason they are there to back Stannis is to get the debts paid back that the Lannisters refuse to pay.

I agree. I don't think anyone other than the NW and Wildlings even think about the WW. I'd assume they'd back either the NW or the dragons, or both, if they were fully aware of the threat.

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Does the Iron Bank believe that the Others are a serious threat to the whole of Westeros?

I don't know if the Bank has property or other tangible investments in Westeros. It's certainly plausible. These investments are in danger because of the Others. They will have lent gold to many people in Westeros and if those people die or their lands are overrun with Others and wights then they won't be repaid.

They may believe that the Others do have an army but won't come past the Wall. If the Others attack in strength, will the Bank give money to the Wall/Night's Watch? To protect their investments in Westeros?

In their meeting with Stannis I don't recall them acknowledging the Others as a reason to lend him gold. They only did it because he was willing to take on the crown debts.

The Iron Bank certainly seems intelligent. Do they perceive the Others as a threat? Will they?

Also is it at all possible that the Others could cross the Narrow Sea? Can it freeze over? There are bad things in the water in the beyond the Wall. Could they attack Braavos?

I agree that the IB may not fully grasp the enormity of the threat posed by the Others, however, with Tycho having directly negotiated with both Jon Snow and Stannis they definately know that (a) winter is coming, and b) the wildlings have fled south....which you would think would lead to c) why?

The IB (like Littlefinger, Varys, etc etc) understand the POWER of money. They understand the role they play in "geo-politics" as it were, as evidenced by the court of Kings Landing getting their knickers in a knot just at the IB's presence. These are not just humble money lenders - if the book characters are playing the game of thrones, then the Iron Bank is gambling/profiting on it.

From the books, we see that the IB require everything to be documented. If the IB are as big and powerful as they are made out to be, you can be sure that the documentation obliges the family line or in the case of the NW, the group - i.e. not individuals - secured by land and/or chattel. Provided the obligation falls to someone with legitimacy, then their position is protected - i.e. they would be reluctant to lend to the "last of his name".

The IB rely on these pieces of paper for enforcement - I understand the idea of using FM to facilitate "regime change" rather than a debt collection service. Varys and Littlefinger would also be quite intimate with the IB, and arguably have been change agents for profit as well.

Is there a risk from the Others - sure, but you'd have to look at the capacity of the IB, and if they can capitalise on the opportunities to follow.

After all, If they are the lender of last resort, then who will fund the clean up the mess post-invasion and assumed defeat of the Others?

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I agree that the IB may not fully grasp the enormity of the threat posed by the Others, however, with Tycho having directly negotiated with both Jon Snow and Stannis they definately know that (a) winter is coming, and B) the wildlings have fled south....which you would think would lead to c) why?

The IB (like Littlefinger, Varys, etc etc) understand the POWER of money. They understand the role they play in "geo-politics" as it were, as evidenced by the court of Kings Landing getting their knickers in a knot just at the IB's presence. These are not just humble money lenders - if the book characters are playing the game of thrones, then the Iron Bank is gambling/profiting on it.

From the books, we see that the IB require everything to be documented. If the IB are as big and powerful as they are made out to be, you can be sure that the documentation obliges the family line or in the case of the NW, the group - i.e. not individuals - secured by land and/or chattel. Provided the obligation falls to someone with legitimacy, then their position is protected - i.e. they would be reluctant to lend to the "last of his name".

The IB rely on these pieces of paper for enforcement - I understand the idea of using FM to facilitate "regime change" rather than a debt collection service. Varys and Littlefinger would also be quite intimate with the IB, and arguably have been change agents for profit as well.

Is there a risk from the Others - sure, but you'd have to look at the capacity of the IB, and if they can capitalise on the opportunities to follow.

After all, If they are the lender of last resort, then who will fund the clean up the mess post-invasion and assumed defeat of the Others?

^ Clever. Very, very clever.

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The Iron Bank doesn't care about the others. The IB cares only about the money. The bank donated huge sums of money to Westeros and thinks that the debts will be repaid by Stannis if he sits on the Iron Throne. The Others are nothing to Braavos to pose a threat to the Iron Bank and the whole donating system the Free City of Braavos has established. In my opinion the Iron Bank just wants the money and Stannis is the means to get the whole sum repaid.


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