Orphan Black Take 2: Expect some differences from the Original

[Zorral]

No want prequel.

It's going backwards.

General Grant would not do this. He had an absolute horror of backtracking.

[SpaceChampion]

Simians, Cyborgs, and Women: Reinventing Nature by Donna J. Haraway.

That's apparently where the episode titles from this season are from.

 

 

[mcbigski]

On 4/15/2016 at 10:34 AM, denstorebog said:

Well, season 4, but yes, it was great.

And the more I think about why it was great, the more my suspicions about why season 3 sucked so much are confirmed. This was the first episode in two years that didn't mention Proletheans, the military, Castor, Leeda, Topside, Siobhan's mother, clone infections or any of that other shit that has been cluttering up the last two seasons. Hell, I was fine with Neolution vs. Proletheans back in season 2; it had a nice structure and contrast going on between the two factions. But since then, Orphan Black has become an utterly bloated mess.

Leekie's sidekick did mention that Beth was the first Leda clone she'd ever met it person, but that was more of a throwaway.  But between Paul, Beth, Olivier, and Leekie, that was a lot of characters I thought we'd never see again.  Pretty wild ride for the first episode.  Wasn't really sure when Beth was running down the fire escape if we'd have another whole episode or two of flashbacks or if they'd wrap it up then.

Was I the only one who thought both of the paramedics were guys at first?  If Mika didn't tell Sara about a white guy and black woman, I'd have missed that entirely.

[First of My Name]

1 hour ago, mcbigski said:

Was I the only one who thought both of the paramedics were guys at first?  If Mika didn't tell Sara about a white guy and black woman, I'd have missed that entirely.

You weren't, I was convinced the black one was male until Mika said otherwise.

[HexMachina]

I also thought they were both men.

I think there is still scope for more Beth flashbacks too. It ended with her shooting Maggie Chen, but iirc there is a fair amount of time between her shooting Maggie and her committing suicide, right?

[HexMachina]

Another very strong episode. I like that they do seem to be tightening the focus this season - DYAD is gone so big bad is pretty much Neolution. Plenty of intrigue there without going into incoherence.

The other stuff was great too. Particularly liked Alison's resentment towards Helena. That must be hard. She can never have a child of her own but Helena gets two. 

Poor Fee. Don't look for your birth family, you have all your sestras! More seriously though, I can well understand why he is doing it. Sarah actually has her own biological family. Her and S had a blood relationship. He probably feels very isolated/outcast thinking about that.

"I need you to tell me Delphine is alive."  Cosima.  

Liked the Beth flashbacks. But did they really never search her house until now?

The end bit and these cheek implants are creepy.

Heres hoping the quality persists!

[SpaceChampion]

Agreed, strong episode.  Did Mrs. S ever say why she ever took Felix in anyway?  It'd be too much if he's another missing genetic experiment, but all things considered it's kind of weird S decided to foster him given she had to be able to flee with Sarah at a moment's notice.

[Arkash]

Okay, I feel like many people will think the show is jumping the shark with the whole Neolution-parasite, but personally I'm definitly in ! Looking forward to see where that will lead us ! 

[HexMachina]

2 hours ago, Arkash said:

Okay, I feel like many people will think the show is jumping the shark with the whole Neolution-parasite, but personally I'm definitly in ! Looking forward to see where that will lead us ! 

Pretty sure they had someone with one of some parasites at some stage last season too, so it's not like it's totally out of the blue. I quite like it too though, very creepy.

2 hours ago, SpaceChampion said:

Agreed, strong episode.  Did Mrs. S ever say why she ever took Felix in anyway?  It'd be too much if he's another missing genetic experiment, but all things considered it's kind of weird S decided to foster him given she had to be able to flee with Sarah at a moment's notice.

Hmm. I'm not sure if I'm remembering this rightly or not, but I thoug Mrs. S had been taking in all sorts of kids besides Sarah. Wasn't Felix just another of them?

[SpaceChampion]

I don't know.  I've been wanting to rewatch season one, so will keep my eye out for that.  But wouldn't be surprised by a retcon.

[HexMachina]

Just had a quick read of a wiki page (fan edited of course but still) which seems to say he was already with Sarah when Mrs S adopted her. So Mrs S probably took in both so Sarah wasn't parted from her friend

[denstorebog]

Yeah, Season 4 is shaping up to be the one that undoes the mess of Season 3. At this point I'm extremely curious whether the Castor clones are gonna show up again, or if the writers realized that they did more harm to the plot than good. If they stay completely absent in favor of a tighter clones-vs-Neolution plot, I'll be happy as a bug. Although, in hindsight, it'll only make the failure of Season 3 all the more obvious if the male clones were a one-off plot device.

(Although I suppose that the subplot with whats-her-name who married that Castor clone makes it inevitable that we'll go back to that shite again at some point.)

[Martini Sigil]

I for one almost forgot how much I love Allison.... her first appearance "crafting" was utter joy

[Arkash]

Each time Alison is on my screen I remember that yeah, she's definitly the most crazy of them all in her own way ! She's amazing ! 

And personally, I wouldnt mind seing some Castor clones again this season, cause I really liked Ari Millen's performance and wish to see him back in the story ! 

[HexMachina]

Just seeing Alison's enthusiastic aerobics was enough to get me smiling. 

But I like that she isn't just the eccentric one. She also does really well with the more emotional scenes, and her relationships with the others, especially Felix, have been great

[shadowbinding shoe]

I found this series last year and loved it. The one actor playing multiple roles trope is one I love and Tatiana does it fabulously.

The series isn't perfect. There are a lot of logical defects, heh heh, in the story. But still it's well worth watching.

The Castor storyline didn't bother me. Maybe because I started watching the series mid-season so I didn't have to wait for each chapter to air.  In retrospect, while Seth, Rudy and Mark were memorable, I only noticed the Miller clone reading through the show's character pages (I knew there were more clones in the base but nothing beyond that.) The Castor-actor does a good job with what he's got, though. I saw a behind the scenes interview where they said it's much harder for him since, unlike the Leda clones, all the Castors have the same accents and can't do too much with hair and makeup so there's less to distinguish them by. The site also mentioned a new, Suave-Castor-clone planned for this season. Could add to the series but I have my doubts. Mark's character, on the other hand, though a great one, only makes sense if he joined the Prolifeans at an early age. He's highly inodctrinated in their culture. Would a newcomer be that way? But his backstory is that he joined the farm after leaving the army, so he must have been in his twenties by then. Also, if that Castor baby they dug up was an unenhaced original version of the Castor line, why would the Prolifeans bother with him? They're all about breeding the genetic enhancements into their population. So he'll be just another dead Castor clone. Useless. Speaking of the Prolifeans' plans, if their leader succeeded in his plan, all the woman and little girls in his community would bear Helena's fertilized eggs and by the next generation everybody would be brothers and sisters. What then? Incest much? (Though this actually fits how a lot of male-leader cults operate so I'm not criticizing the show here)

As for Paul, it seems he's universally hated here. I don't mind him too much. Between season 1 beginning and season 3 he was boring. Just keep saying how into Sarah he is and doesn't want her harmed. But he was pretty good in season 3. His role is wooden, So it's not entirely the actor's fault he's annoying and boring.

I rewatched the whole series before starting the new season and the scene where Sarah reveals she's a clone (just before he drugs her into Bethihood) gains new meaning with his clone-handler background. It's not just about finally learning the truth about his role. Does he suddenly see her as like one of his Castor charges? He feels responsible for them.

The new season is going in a horror-film direction (maggots growing inside you for some nefarious purpose, maybe mind-controlling you). I hope that won't happen. Please keep the light tone in this series? I'd prefer if there was less action scenes  or intricate conspiracy plots and more introspection about being clones. Does knowing about the others drive them to try to accentuate their differences from the others so they remain unique or the reverse? (Sarah says one time in season 1 to one of the others that they all like to scratch their chin or something like that. That's about it. Sarah disbelief that her clone is a soccer mom is just left hanging) We met the various Leda versions and learned some of the influences that made them who they are, but it's been very sketchy so far. If I was Alison or Sarah I'd be fascinated why one version of me turned lesbian while the others didn't. But we know nothing about Cosimah's formative years. There's even less about the Castors.

The Dyad-Sarah clash worked, in large part because Rachel became the face behind Dyad/topside.

Now I'm not even sure if that was the focus of the Dyad/Topside/Neolutionist clone research. Maybe it was about what diet, lifestyle, excercise and climate make the best host for cheek-maggots. Ewww.

 

Edit to add - I don't think Helena fertilzed eggs would be used as stem cells source. It makes sense, sure, but this whole series been about how each clone is a human being with all the rights of one and how precious your biological babies are. The embryos will all be implanted at the end of the series into the wombs of happy moms to perpetuate the Leda genome.

[Arkash]

Speaking of Rachel... looking forward to meet back our favourite former-cyclop next episode ! 

[Werthead]

Yeah, Season 4 got off to a great start. But I also thought Season 3 was pretty good, mainly because you can actually see the producers realising they were muddling the mythology and then came up with an executed a rescue plan which also told an entertaining story at the same time. The way they wrapped up Dyad, the Proletheans and Castor by the end of the third season and saw them all off quite elegantly without it being too abrupt (a la Nikki and Paulo syndrome) was very well done.

Interesting to see where they go. Season 5 will be the last season, so either this is the start of a 2-season story, or they're going to have two relatively self-contained stories to go out on.

[HexMachina]

1 hour ago, Werthead said:

Yeah, Season 4 got off to a great start. But I also thought Season 3 was pretty good, mainly because you can actually see the producers realising they were muddling the mythology and then came up with an executed a rescue plan which also told an entertaining story at the same time. The way they wrapped up Dyad, the Proletheans and Castor by the end of the third season and saw them all off quite elegantly without it being too abrupt (a la Nikki and Paulo syndrome) was very well done.

Interesting to see where they go. Season 5 will be the last season, so either this is the start of a 2-season story, or they're going to have two relatively self-contained stories to go out on.

I didn't know season 5 would be the last one, interesting. Hopefully having the ending in sight means the writers will be able to keep a tighter focus this season and next.

Do we know whether Delphine is really dead on the show? I seem to have a vague recollection of filming conflicts and not wanting to commit one way or the other to whether she survived or not. Have I remembered that rightly? Or am I talking balls again?

[SpaceChampion]

As far as I know, there's nothing specific either way.  The actress has a lead role in another show, but I doubt she couldn't really make time for a brief appearance.  Given Cosima has no closer there, I really doubt Delphine is actually dead.