Moosicus Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 So I’m sure you all well remember Kahlan leading the naked army against the Order, but there’s an interesting bit just before. When she gives a speech (a pretty long one that I’ll not reproduce) to the troops before the battle she offers them a chance to leave and some take her up on that offer. I offer this up as the Terry Goodkind Quote of the Day. “If you should choose to join in this battle, you will follow orders without question,†she said. “But for this time only, you may speak your mind freely, without retribution. If you have something to say, then let all hear it now, or else hold it to your grave.†One man pulled his arm free of another. He glowered up at her. “We’re men. We don’t follow women into battle.’ Kahlan blinked at him. “You follow Queen Cyrilla.†“She is our queen, we fight on her behalf. She doesn’t lead us in battle. That’s left to men to do.†Kahlan narrowed her eyes. “What is your name?†He glanced around at his fellows, and then held his chin up. “I’m William Mosle. And we’ve been trained by Prince Harold himself.†“And I,†Kahlan said, “was trained by his father, King Wyborn. King Wyborn was my father, too. I am half sister to Queen Cyrilla and Prince Harold.†There were astonished murmurs throughout the crowd. Without taking her eyes from Mosle, she lifted a hand to silence them. “But that does not count for command. You are soldiers. Your duty is to follow the orders of your commanders, and they the queen, and she must follow commands of the Central Council of the Midlands. The council of the Midlands follows the orders of the Mother Confessor. “For now, I fill that office. My family name is, like your queen’s, Amnell, but I’m of Confessor blood, first, and last. I am the Mother Confessor of the Midlands and as such, if I say you’re to march into a lake, then it’s your duty to march until you’re breathing water and seeing fishes. Does that make it clear enough for you, soldier?†A few other men were shoving at Mosle, urging him to go on with their grievances. “It means you can order us, it doesn’t mean you know what you’re doing.†<As we all know, questioning the Mother Confessor is tantamount to suicide. Snip.> She held out a finger and swept it slowly over their heads. “Choose, then. With us, or not. But choose this day for all time.†Kahlan drew her hands back inside her warm fur mantle and waited in silence while men discussed and argued among themselves. Tempers flared, and angry oaths were given. Men gathered around Mosle, and others moved away from him. “I’m leaving, then,†Mosle called out to the others. He thrust his fist in the air. “I’ll follow no woman into battle, no matter who she is! Who’s leaving with me!†About sixty or seventy men gathered about cheered their support for him. “Go, then,†Kahlan commanded. “Before you become caught up in a battle you do not believe in.†<snip> Mosle turned and pushed his way back through the throng, his new men in tow. As they left the gathered soldiers, Kahlan carefully counted their numbers. Sixty-seven. Sixty-seven who would leave. <Snip. She later has a meeting with the captains.> “And now, Captain, I must give you an order you are not going to like.†She looked to his blue eye. “I want you to send men after Mosle and those who went with him. Send enough to be sure to accomplish the deed.†“Deed?†“They must be killed. Send a force with instructions that they are to pretend to join with Mosle’s men, so they don’t scatter when your men approach. Send your cavalry behind, but out of sight, in case they’re able to take to the woods. When they are surrounded, kill them. There are seventy-six <I could have sworn it was sixty-seven>. Count the bodies to make sure they are all dead. I will be very displeased if even one escapes.†His eyes were wide. “But Mother Confessor…†“I take no pleasure in this, Captain. You have your orders.†She turned to the three Mud People. “Prindin, go with the men he picks. Make sure those who departed are killed to a man.†Prindin gave her a grim nod. He understood the unpleasant necessity of what she was doing. Captain Ryan tensed in near panic. “Mother Confessor…I know those men. They’ve been with us a long time. You said they were free to go! We can’t…†She laid a hand on his arm. He suddenly recognized the threat that represented. “I am doing what I must to save your lives. You have given your word to follow orders.†She leaned a little closer. “Do not add yourself to those seventy-six.†He at last gave a nod and she removed her hand. His eyes told it all. Hate radiated from him. “I didn’t know the killing was to start with our own men,†he whispered. “It does not. It starts with the enemy.†Captain Ryan pointed angrily up the pass. “They’re going in the opposite direction of the Order!†“And did you think they would go to the enemy in plain sight of you? They intend to circle around.†She turned and started off toward a tent that had been left up for her. Captain Ryan, trailed by Chandalen, Prindin, and Tossidin, followed her, unwilling to concede. “If you were so concerned, why did you let them go! Why didn’t you let the men kill them when they would have!†“Because I had to give all those who would renounce us and abandon their fellows the chance to do so†“What makes you think all of the ‘traitors’ departed? There could be spies, or assassins, among us.†“Yes, there could be. But I have no evidence of threat at the moment. If I find there are, I will have to deal with them then.†Kahlan came to a stop before the tent. “If you think I may be making a mistake about those men, I assure you, I am not. But even if I were, it is a price that must be paid. If we let them go, and even one of them betrays us, we could all be killed in a trap tonight. If we die, there will be none to stop the Order for a long time. How many thousands would die then, Captain? If those men are innocent, I’ll have made a terrible mistake, and seventy-six innocent men will die. If I’m right, I will be saving the lives of untold thousands of innocent people. “You have you orders. Carry them out.†<Snip. Later on, after her nap, Mosle is brought back.> Kahlan glowered over at Captain Ryan. He stood with one thumb hooked in his belt. “I thought, Mother Confessor, that you would want to execute this man yourself. Since he seems to have personally offended you so.†He held his knife out toward her, handle first. Kahlan ignored the knife and turned instead to the men holding Mosle. “Release him, and stand away.†She felt as if she were still in a sleep, still in a dream. But she wasn’t. There was no option. As they stepped back, she reached out and snatched Mosle by his arm. He froze in fright for an instant, and then tried to back away. But he had no time to escape. She was touching him now. He was hers. Her sleepiness vanished in a sucking rush <???> as her power ignited. She gave no thought to what she was about to do; there was no choice. She was committed. She gave herself over to it. <Kablammo, she uses her power on the poor schmuck and commands him to tell her what he was going to do after leaving the camp.> It all came babbling out in a rush. “I was going to the camp of those other men, the Imperial Order you called them, and I was going to ask to join them. I was going to take all my men with me so they could join too. I was going to tell them of the presence of the Galean recruits, and of your plans, so they would be pleased with us, and would let us join with them. I thought they had a better chance than you, and I didn’t want to die, so I was going to join with them. I thought they would be pleased if I brought them men to add to their ranks. I thought they would be pleased if I brought them men to add to their ranks. I thought they would be pleased with us if we could help them crush you.†He burst suddenly in sobs. “Oh, please, Mistress, I’m so sorry I thought to do you harm. I wanted them to kill you. Oh, please, Mistress, I’m so sorry I intended you harm. Please, Mistress, tell me how I can gain your forgiveness. I will do anything. Please command me and it will be done. Please, Mistress, what do you wish of me?†“I wish for you to die,†she whispered in the icy silence. “Right now.†William Mosle crumpled forward, against her boots, and thrashed in racking convulsions. After a few long, agonizing seconds, he was still, his last breath rattling from his lungs. <So whaddaya know, she was right all along. How ‘bout that?> ~Terry Goodkind, Stone of Tears Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinDonner Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Ye Gods, I'd forgotten all about that! But it's so obvious when you think about it - anyone who questions Kahlan's brilliant naked-whitewash battle plan and the wisdom of sending a tiny force against a huge one is not simply a coward or a pragmatist, he must be on the side of EVIL! Even though Kahlan herself initially tried to talk them out of attacking the enemy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MinDonner Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Because I'm bored, here's another song... How did he do that? I wanna know! How can I tell how he kills his foes? (Did he study at school?) Oh no! You need to see! (Did someone show him the rules?) Oh no! You make believe! If you wanna tell How Richard fights so well It's in his sword! (That's where it is!) (Oh yeah! Or did he train for years?) no girls! He's just too thick! (Or practise cutting off ears?) no girls! That's just cos he's sick! If you wanna tell How Richard fights so well It's in his sword! (That's where it is!) yeah!! It's in his sword! (That's where it is!) Oh, oh, oh, honey! Make him fight! Find out what you wanna know! Send in the troops and your warrior lords, He'll bring death with his sword! (How 'bout some basic training, at least, come on!?) no no no! That's not the way! You're not listenin' to all I'm sayin'! If you wanna tell How Richard fights so well It's in his sword! (That's where it is!) Oh, yeah ! Its in his sword! (That's where it is!) mmmm ! Its in his sword! (that's where it is) mmmm it's in his sword Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alytha Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zadok Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Richard would certainly be proud of that QOTD. Kahlan makes a completely illogical assumption and orders the slaughter of her own men, but what do you know, she was right in the end! I also wonder where they got the extra nine bodies to make up the 76(even though Kahlan had carefully counted 67) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Errant Bard Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Mindonner you should try to compile a playlist for Sword of Truth, just like Scott Lynch did for tLoLL. That way we can all sing the quotes along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxom 1974 Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Actually, that passage is possibly one of very few that has any semblence of coherence to it. Casting aside those who won't work for her and suspecting that they'd betray her...Kahlan made some actual sense...it's not prettily written, but then, it isn't meant to be prettily written for me, is it? But the 10 magical extra men she had killed...that's just...someone smack Terry's editor with the moral celery. I mean, what the hell, man? What the hell...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zap Rowsdower Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Actually, that passage is possibly one of very few that has any semblence of coherence to it. Casting aside those who won't work for her and suspecting that they'd betray her...Kahlan made some actual sense...it's not prettily written, but then, it isn't meant to be prettily written for me, is it? But the 10 magical extra men she had killed...that's just...someone smack Terry's editor with the moral celery. I mean, what the hell, man? What the hell...? I"m going to have to disagree with you here on this one Jaxom. Please see my essay below. But first of all thank you, Mad Moose for that quote. I have wanted to see that posted for quite some time. This post is almost a perfect example of everything that is wrong with Goodkind. Out of an infinite number of ways he could have written that scene, Goodkind, with preternatural, unerring instinct chose the most vile and stupidest of them all. For those of you who have not read this book, please allow me to elaborate on the situation, so that you too, can bask in the full glorious stupidity that is Terry Goodkind. The situation is this: an Imperial Order army of vast size, has invaded a couple of peaceful Midlands kingdoms. The Imperial army has been looting, raping, murdering, and generally having a merry old time. The troops Kahlan was giving a speech too? Those were the soldiers of one of the recently invaded countries. It simply makes no sense at all for any of them to want to join up with the Imperial Order. Considering the scale of destruction the Order has wrought, surely some of the people in Kahlan’s little army have had a relative, a sister, daughter, or mother who has been raped/tortured/murdered by the invading army. Doubtless, ALL of them know at least a friend who has lost someone they care about. Even if some of them found the thought of serving under Kahlan intolerable (I know I would), would these be the sort of people who would switch sides and start helping the Order just as soon as they got out of sight of Kahlan’s camp? That is not all. Before Kahlan showed up, this small ragtag army was about to engage the Order on the battlefield (none of them having the military acumen to developed a plan to strip down in the dead of winter, paint themselves white and then attack the enemy naked). If I remember correctly, they were going to try to engage the Order in the mountains or something, where the narrow paths would prevent the Order from bringing their numbers to bear. The ragtag army was prepared to do this, even though it would have likely resulted in their deaths. No indication is given that the 67 traitors Kahlan had executed had any problems with laying down their lives in a futile effort to defend their homelands. They were ready to bravely sacrifice their lives- then Kahlan showed up and suddenly these same people are nothing but dirty stinking cowards who just can’t wait to betray their comrades (however, if I were too be perfectly honest, I might think of switching sides if I found out Kahlan was going to be my leader. Imagine if you had suddenly been told that your glorious new leader was Adolph Hitler. It would certainly cause me to question the morality of my side). The whole scenario is utterly ridiculous. Imagine if you will that Osama bin Laden had suddenly died, and his sister took command of Al-Qaeda. Now, I have no doubt that a lot of the rank and file might have problems with taking orders from a woman (people squatting in caves and clutching AK-47s generally not being the most of progressive-minded of people). However, would these same people suddenly decide that taking orders from bin laden’s sister was so bad, that they would suddenly turn themselves into the nearest military patrol and pledge an oath of loyalty to the US? Goodkind is not content to have made an ass of himself, oh no! He won’t rest until he has made himself a hypocritical ass as well. Later in the book, Kahlan’s army has set up camp and to keep her location a secret, she has ordered her patrols to murder anyone traveling nearby roads, since she thinks they might be spies for the Imperial Order (instead of say, refuges fleeing from the ruins of their homes and farms, as I would have thought). At the same time, Zedd and Addie are traveling these very same roads. Zedd and Addie are losing their memory because of an underworld spell, and they are desperately searching for someone who can cure them. Zedd and Addie have hired a carriage and a driver to take them to a healer. Lucky for them, they picked the only carriage driver in the entire world who would not end up getting them brutally murdered by Kahlan’s army. You see, the driver they hired had been given the equivalent of a Congressional Medal of Honor by the ruler of Galea. So, Zedd and Addie and their driver are halted by one of Kahlan’s patrols. Doubtless, they would have been killed if not for the driver’s Deux Ex Machina. When the driver flashes his medal, the soldiers hesitate and they send someone back to camp to ask Kahlan if they should kill these innocent travelers as per standard practice. Well, Kahlan is at first somewhat annoyed that these travelers had not been given the “special treatment,†but she eventually changes her mind when she hears about the driver’s medal, whereupon she grudgingly allows the carriage and its occupants to pass. When I read this, bile rose into the back of my mouth. It was bad enough that Goodkind, through Kahlan, was advocating the cold blooded murder of soldiers who had the gall to object to Kahlan’s command style, but then he didn’t have the moral f*cking courage to take this behavior to its logical conclusion. I actually might have respected Goodkind, if he had had Kahlan order the deaths of Zedd and Addie. It would show that he knew he was advocating a brutal, murderous philosophy, but that he was prepared to accept the consequences, both good and bad that it would produce. In addition to that, it might have added some genuinedrama to the series. Imagine this scene: the soldiers have killed Zedd and Addie and they are about to bury and conceal the signs of the fight. Kahlan walks onto the scene and she sees the bodies and finally realizes what her actions have brought about. Kahlan would either be forced to lie to Richard or to tell him that she has killed his grandfather! This would actually force Richard to question whether his entire philosophy of no mercy was actually such a good idea. But God forbid, that might require a bit of character development, instead of fifty page speeches on why it is now moral for Richard to eat meat. But Goodkind didn’t do this. Goodkind apparently thinks that you can order the deaths of anyone who disagrees with you and somehow it will magically turn out that everyone you killed was utterly evil, and the people who are really innocent will miraculously escape. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaxom 1974 Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Oh I'm not suggesting it's good or perfect, Zap, but look at the QotD in context as JUST the QotD. It almost makes a small amount of sense. Add it to the bigger picture, as you have done, and it's writing on so much more toliet paper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
theMountainGoat Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 I imagine the scene went something like this: Captain Ryan having captured and killed all 67 of the people who thought they were being allowed to avoid the certain death of a futile battle against overwhelming odds, counts them up again. 'Sixty seven, we only have sixty seven bodies. Are you sure there are no more?' His soldiers are certain that every one of the traitors has been accounted for and killed. 'I dare not go back nine bodies short, that crazy bitch will have my head. Lads I need nine brave volunteers to lay down their lives so that the rest may live, well for a little while longer yet. At least until the Mother Confessor leads us into the next foolish shenanigan.' The soldiers shuffle their feet. 'Come on we'll make it quick and painless, I promise you won't feel a thing. This is the only morally right thing for us to do. We can't point out her error because as we all know the heroine of this story never makes a mistake so we have to do whatever is in our power to make it seem correct. I know what you're all thinking, but this would be to choose death, but no this is to choose life for others and is thus a noble act.' Still the soldiers refused to offer up their lives for the cause. 'Right then, I never liked Squad 3 - you guys suck! Everybody butcher them!' Screamed the Captain. The nine men of Squad 3 were brutally hacked to death so that the other soldiers might live and thus the full allotment of 76 traitors were returned to the camp for Kahlan's inspection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Starkimus Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Zap is my new hero. That is all. Oh...umm and the Quote of the day deservers this :sick: :sick: :sick: Just three because, well compared to other QotDs...it aint that bad. Hasta! Stark Out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lightsnake Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 I say we compile the most brutal, vile, dictator acts of SoT and slam the Goodkind fanboys with them. Y'know what's even funnier? The scene where Richard gets all pissy his brother might be visiting brothels... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosicus Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 "We've rounded up all the orphans in the city Mother Confessor. What shall we do with them? Feed them? Find loving homes for them?" Captain Ryan looked at Kahlan with an eyebrow raised. "No Captain. I want you to tie each one to a stake and set it on fire. I want to hear them screaming til they die." Captain Ryan was appalled at the thought. "But Mother Confessor, they're just sweet innocent children who haven't harmed anyone!" "No arguments Captain! Just do it. I have a hunch." <Later, after all the children are on fire.> "Well, all the children are burning Mother Confessor, what shall we do now?" Captain Ryan's face had turned a shade of green and tears streamed freely from his - oh, lets say brown - eyes. "Just wait." <suddenly amid the screaming is the sound of tearing flesh. From the bellies of the screaming and burning children burst forth.....CHICKENS THAT ARE EVIL INCARNATE!!!!> "Wow Mother Confessor....how did you know? How could you even suspect that the children would be possessed by evil chicken-things?" Favouring the captain with one of her 'special smiles'. "Don't you know by now Captain, that when you are steeped in moral clarity - as I am - that barbarism of the worst sort always turns out to be for the best?" She giggled slightly. "Had it not been chickens, then no doubt these children would all have turned out to have dreams of joining the Order when they grew up, or any number of things that would justify my killing them." Her giggle grew into hysterical laughter. "Here, I'll prove it to you. Guards! Seize the captain and cut off his head!" Captain Ryan's scream was cut short by the blade cutting cleanly through his neck. "Let's see, ummm, take off his soldier pants." The guards hasten to obey, fearful that they may be the next to fall prey to the Mother Confessor's "clarity". Once his soldier pants were removed the men were shocked to see that instead of the manhood they were expecting, was something huge and shiny-black, covered with barbs and spikes. "How about that." Kahlan said, unsurprised. "A big barbed Namble cock." She glanced at the other men. "I told you it would all work out. Now round up those chickens." Kahlan laughed maniacally, some of the soldiers joined in the laughter. Others threw horseshoes around the Namble cock and laughed, soon all the soldiers were laughing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLU-RAY Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Never read GK, but i completely bought that as being from one of the books, MM, right until "I have a hunch." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VigoTheCarpathian Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Horse shoes around a namble cock? Damn, Moose... I don't have SoT available to me right now, or I'd do a little dedication to Zap right now for the wonderful idea. Here's the vague plot outline: - Zedd and Adie get stopped by Kahlan's "nuke'em all" army and are killed - Kahlan finds out about it and orders their bodies burned and drawn and quartered. - It turns out that Zedd was the Creator, and Adie was the Dark One, and Kahlan managed to kill them with logic. - Richard gives a speech about the evils of old people: no matter their previous contribution to society (the Barriers, genetic material, saying "Bags!" a lot), they drain your country of resources, are not typically strong enough to fight, and have a propensity for wanting to be comfortable. - Richard orders all old people to report to the his army camp, where they will serve as firewood and plant fertilizer after being "processed". -Kahlan and her army smear their lithe, young, armorless forms in the ashes of the old and feeble, and ride out to defeat Jagang. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosicus Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Never read GK, but i completely bought that as being from one of the books, MM, right until "I have a hunch." Looks like I'll have to try harder next time. Horse shoes around a namble cock? Damn, Moose... I don't have SoT available to me right now, or I'd do a little dedication to Zap right now for the wonderful idea. Here's the vague plot outline: - Zedd and Adie get stopped by Kahlan's "nuke'em all" army and are killed - Kahlan finds out about it and orders their bodies burned and drawn and quartered. - It turns out that Zedd was the Creator, and Adie was the Dark One, and Kahlan managed to kill them with logic. - Richard gives a speech about the evils of old people: no matter their previous contribution to society (the Barriers, genetic material, saying "Bags!" a lot), they drain your country of resources, are not typically strong enough to fight, and have a propensity for wanting to be comfortable. - Richard orders all old people to report to the his army camp, where they will serve as firewood and plant fertilizer after being "processed". -Kahlan and her army smear their lithe, young, armorless forms in the ashes of the old and feeble, and ride out to defeat Jagang. Concentration camps are bound to show up in the next book. It an inevitable result of Dick's philosophy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Werthead Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Hmm, the guys on Dragonmount are actually engaging in a reasoned debate about TG. I find this...unexpected coming from TG fans, but strangely life-affirming. Then I took at a look at the state of the ongoing TG Wiki War and lost the will to live. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moosicus Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Please update us on the wiki war, I'm not up to speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TerraPrime Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 I'd guess so. If the Dalai Lama was a real hero, he'd take all those Shaolin monks and go kick the Chine's arses to Nirvana and back until they get their aforementioned arses out of Tibet. And then he would kill them anyway, of course. Shaolin is Chinese. Or am I missing a Tairy reference here? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xray the Enforcer Posted August 29, 2006 Share Posted August 29, 2006 Hmm, the guys on Dragonmount are actually engaging in a reasoned debate about TG. I find this...unexpected coming from TG fans, but strangely life-affirming. Then I took at a look at the state of the ongoing TG Wiki War and lost the will to live. please explain? also, you people will bleed on yourselves in envy when you see the brilliant piece of Tairy jewelry that Regina gave to me at WorldCon this week. I'll post pics soon, but all I got to say is: REGINA PWNS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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