another Malaysian Airlines flight story...

[The Iceman of the North]

Given the number of airlines now announcing that they wont fly over this area, it appear that apart from American airlines, there were quite a few who had not changed flight paths since the start of the conflict.

[Snowy89]

Wow, they were just showing some Dutch passports on that russian stream and did not do a particularly good job at blurring the details...

I could tell every detail from every single person. One was from a boy who just turned 17

[Fez]

WSJ is reporting that US intelligence agencies have confirmed it was a SAM that brought the plane down, but that they aren't sure of its origin yet.

[Fragile Bird]

I have seen on tv a video that is focused on the sky, and then there's a vapour trail and black smoke. I don't know exactly what was going on, but I kind of feel that someone with a cellphone perhaps heard the missile being launched, whipped out their cell phone and just started shooting. That seems like the logical conclusion.

[Shryke]

More information posted in the Ukraine thread. It's looking more and more likely the rebels shot it down with their Buk SAM system.

[Altherion]

This is terrible. The conflicting sides have predictably blamed each other (complete with all sorts of preliminary evidence ranging from Spanish air controllers to video of missile trails), but damn, there were 300 people on that plane...

This has to be either a colossal screw-up or a monstrous provocation and I would not put either past any of the sides in this conflict. I don't understand why anyone would be flying civilian planes through a warzone though -- surely the small financial edge wasn't worth the risk when they knew that at least two of the three sides definitely had the firepower to do this and the third one probably did too.

[Littlefingers In The Air]

RIP to the victims...

[Pod The Impaler]

I guess we will have to wait and see what the US and NATO have to say after they investigate this a bit.

They'll conclude it was whatever they need their investigation to say, to justify whatever actions they want to take. That's how this stuff works. I put no faith in any of the parties involved; anyone's "facts" are questionable, given their motivations.

[Impmk2]

[quote name="Altherion" post="6036601" timestamp="1405632532"

I don't understand why anyone would be flying civilian planes through a warzone though -- surely the small financial edge wasn't worth the risk when they knew that at least two of the three sides definitely had the firepower to do this and the third one probably did too.

[Paxter]

Woah, terrible news to wake up to here in Australia.

It does seem such a shame when this could have been avoided by a more prudent flight path, but I agree that pointing the finger squarely at Malaysian may be a bit harsh.

[Frey Filet]

I see that people are saying the flight was likely at 30,000 feet, meaning it must have been a SAM, a surface to air missile, if not a military jet that took it down.

And comments being made - does Malaysia not know how to run an airline? Why would you choose a flight path over a part of the world where people are shooting down aircraft?

Point taken but I believe their rationale for flying over this area was due to inclement weather. Pretty weak, I know..

[Frey Filet]

http://aattp.org/pro-russian-militant-bragged-about-shooting-down-a-plane-moments-before-mh-17-crashed/

http://mobile.reuters.com/article/worldNews/idUSKBN0FM2LO20140717?irpc=932

http://www.kyivpost.com/content/ukraine/separatists-admit-downing-a-civilian-plane-in-tapped-conversation-full-transcript-356545.html

'NUFF SAID!!

[DreamSongs]

According to a report on FoxNews, they located a memo dated June 29 stating that Pro-Russian forces had taken a Ukranian military base with SAM technology. Just because the equipment was of Russian make doesn't mean that this wasn't the decision of the inept with a dangerous weapon in their hands.

[Horza]

Indian PM Narendra Modi's plane was an hour behind in the same flightpath

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Horza,

What would that have happened to the plans for a BRICS bank if that plane had been shot down?

[Horza]

Scot, I suspect that you might be able to work out the answer to that question on your own.

[White Walker Texas Ranger]

Would his plane has had any countermeasures against radar or heat guided missiles? Or is that just Air Force One? (the movie)

[Fez]

It doesn't make it any more of tragedy than it already is, no matter who was on that plane they were important to some one and now they're gone, but it turns out that a number of prominent AIDS researchers were on the plane on their way to the International AIDS Conference in Australia.

[Horza]

Would his plane has had any countermeasures against radar or heat guided missiles? Or is that just Air Force One? (the movie)

Nope. Israeli commercial airlines have countermeasures but for other carriers the risk doesn't justify the expense.

[AndrewJ]

Hmm... from the article re the Indian PM (see excerpt below).

So... planes in the area can go either over the Black Sea or over the war zone. The UN gave control of the Black Sea to Ukraine. Russia dispute that control and, presumably, direct planes through that area as well.

The Aviation Safety Authority deems two bodies controlling one air-space is too great a risk and so all flights should go through the warzone.

Hard to fault Malaysian Airlines for complying with recommended flight paths (along with most other airlines).

All trans-europe flights used two air corridors or Flight Information Regions (FIRs) over the Ukraine- the Lviv FIR, and the Simferopol FIR. But in April this year, UN aviation agency ICAO announced that the right to provide air navigation services in international airspace over the Black Sea within Simferopol flight information region belonged exclusively to Ukraine, something Russia has contested since it now controls the Crimean region of Ukraine.

On April 3 European Aviation Safety Agency issued a safety bulletin – accompanied by recommendations from both ICAO – that airspace controlled by the Simferopol FIR should be avoided as more than one air traffic control agency controlling flights within the same airspace could have serious safety implications.

As a result, all flights have been using the Lviv FIR only

ETA: and yeah - I'm probably over-simplifying things in saying flights are directed through the warzone. I assume it would be more like "a corridor which includes the warzone".