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How will Jon 'survve' the stabbing


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I obviously haven't as my posts have proven, but you don't seem like you have bothered to read any of it, because you had nothing to say about Jon's or Dany's dream. Is this the way you debate? Is this the best you can do? And say hello to your mate who has put you up to this. I'm only open to an exchange of arguments and respect for other posters. If you cannot do that, don't expect it in return. When you come up with a respectful argument that doesn't hide sarcasm, disdain and ganging up mentality, I'll be happy to debate. Until then, cheers to both you and your mate.

lol. What mate? Put me up to what? What on earth are you talking about?

I am not debating anything. I'm pointing out how you've taken a line completely out of context to form a theory. You seem to have taken me pointing that out very badly.

You have then proceeded to use a scene from the TV show to drive home your point, that was derived from a faulty assumption in the first place.

So, to sum it up. One quote taken out of context and one non canon source. There is no debate to be had. Your conclusions may or may not be true but your thought process to get there is simply wrong.

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Well, now.

1. Because this was where Jon was going before he was attacked. She has lots to give Ramsey if he wants a trade (Shireen and Stannis' wife) and Winterfell may have a bit of magic. Ned does tell us that all starks must return to winterfell.

2. Mel sees stuff in the flames.

3. Burning Jon she will think is a ritual sacrafice that will make her rise from the flames more powerful. But, she's wrong. Going into the flames is the magic that brings Jon back. We have been graced with a powerful flawed character, and it is glorious if her being wrong brings Jon Snow to his true calling/strength.

4. Only to us as readers. She has more of the Northern nuances. It makes her a more believable companion for Stannis.

5. Equals because they both will have been reborn from flames. There is no instance in real human life where what Dany did would result in anything but extra-crispy death, so we have to go with divine intervention or magic of some sort. Jon would also benefit from the same powers.

6.Dragon egg is optional. It may be that egg is already with the FM. More important is the Mormont sword, that from this becomes "Lightbringer"

7. "death pays for life" was a big part of the rising of Dany. The BWB also use this theme. Since it is a fantasy series, it does not need to be consistent or literal in bringing everyone back.

1. I still don't see why and how Mel would drag Jon's body to Winterfell. She does not know what Ned Stark thought about Starks being buried there. Also, Jon is a bastards and they are not buried in the crypts of Winterfell. How long will it take Mel to get to Winterfell? What would happen to Jon's body in the meantime? Jon and Tyrion traveled to the Wall when the weather was fine and it took them a while, more than a week. What does she have to gain from being in Winterfell? The Wall is also magical. Why would she trade her staunchest follower Selyse and her daughter? What would she gain by that? Have you forgot about the Pink Letter? Whoever wrote it, wanted more hostages than just two of them.

2. As we saw, she sees things unclearly and it all boils down to her interpretation. She never ever mentioned Dany.

3. Did I get you right? Are you assuming she would want to hatch dragons like Dany? Is Jon to be playing a part of Drogo? Is she playing a part of both Dany and the witch? If so, how do you make a comparison? Drogo was Dany's husband and her love. Jon is nothing to Mel. There is no connection. Or is Jon playing the role of the witch in your scenario? But even then, he is already dead, so there is no sacrifice. I'm totally at loss here. And what's the whole point without dragon eggs?

4. Not clear what you mean. Mel is not a northerner, nor is she described as looking like one.

5. Dany was never dead, so she was not reborn. Dragons were born. I don't see any parallel.

6. How can Mormont's sword just turn into a Lightbringer?

7. I'm sorry, I do not understand this at all. If you are leaning on that concept, wouldn't Mel be aware that, by entering the pyre, she will die and her death will bring someone back to life? Did we ever see her inclining towards that option? Did any other Red Priest attempt such a ritual?

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Here's the entire dream, all of the context, with the people Bran is 'sees':

Page 112:

He looked east, and saw a galley racing across the waters of the Bite. He saw his mother sitting alone in a cabin, looking at a bloodstained knife on a table in front of her, as the rowers pulled at their oars and Ser Rodrik leaned across a rail, shaking and heaving. A storm was gathering ahead of them, a vast dark roaring lashed by lightning, but somehow they could not see it.
He looked south, and saw the great blue-green rush of the Trident. He saw his father pleading with the king, his face etched with grief. He saw Sansa crying herself to sleep at night, and he saw Arya watching in silence and holding her secrets hard in her heart. There were shadows all around them. One shadow was dark as ash, with the terrible face of a hound. Another was armored like the sun, golden and beautiful. Over them both loomed a giant in armor made of stone, but when he opened his visor, there was nothing inside but darkness and thick black blood.
He lifted his eyes and saw clear across the narrow sea, to the Free Cities and the green Dothraki sea and beyond, to Vaes Dothrak under its mountain, to the fabled lands of the Jade Sea, to Asshai by the Shadow, where dragons stirred beneath the sunrise.
Finally he looked north. He saw the Wall shining like blue crystal, and his bastard brother Jon sleeping alone in a cold bed, his skin growing pale and hard as the memory of all warmth fled from him. And he looked past the Wall, past endless forests cloaked in snow, past the frozen shore and the great blue-white rivers of ice and the dead plains where nothing grew or lived. North and north and north he looked, to the curtain of light at the end of the world, and then beyond that curtain. He looked deep into the heart of winter, and then he cried out, afraid, and the heat of his tears burned on his cheeks.

He very clearly is seeing what is happening at the present time. He's seeing it as it's happening.

Now, let's see what Jon is doing 10 pages later:

Page 123:

Inside, Jon hung sword and scabbard from a hook in the stone wall, ignoring the others around him. Methodically, he began to strip off his mail, leather, and sweat-soaked woolens. Chunks of coal burned in iron braziers at either end of the long room, but Jon found himself shivering. The chill was always with him here. In a few years he would forget what it felt like to be warm.

We can see that it echoes back to exactly what Bran saw only a few pages before. Bran did not have a prophecy about Jon's death. Bran saw Jon sleeping in his bed. He was cold, and his skin is growing pale because he's further North where the sun hardly shines. It's growing hard because he's becoming a man...physically and mentally. That's what Bran saw. There's absolutely nothing there to indicate that he was seeing what happens to Jon years into the future.

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He had to set aside the memories of his family so he could be more of a NW man, which is what the getting colder is about. ;)



I never interpreted that as anything else, as it's literally in the book that it's happening.




Lol @ character x has to go to place y because it's foreshadowed. Jesus.


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