MissMatchedEyes Posted September 17, 2014 Share Posted September 17, 2014 Any ideas as to why (in the show) Cersei tells Tywin about her and Jaime? And Tyrion leaves without telling Jaime about Cersei and Lancel. Just seems a weird way to leave things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ummester Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 It wasn't actually about Cersie, I thought, it was more about setting up Tywin's character for a more uncomfortable death - before he died, he got to learn all the truths that would upset him, kind of thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMatchedEyes Posted September 19, 2014 Author Share Posted September 19, 2014 It wasn't actually about Cersie, I thought, it was more about setting up Tywin's character for a more uncomfortable death - before he died, he got to learn all the truths that would upset him, kind of thing. That makes sense. Thanks. I always thought of this point in the books as Jaime turning against Cersei. But the show makes it seem that they are closer than ever and he doesn't know that she was sleeping with Lancel. Maybe next season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jaimereborn Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 That makes sense. Thanks. I always thought of this point in the books as Jaime turning against Cersei. But the show makes it seem that they are closer than ever and he doesn't know that she was sleeping with Lancel. Maybe next season? I reckon they'll use him freeing Tyrion as the main reason for the disintegration of their relationship now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ummester Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I haven't finished the books yet - but I have noticed that the show simplifies the character interaction for dramatic impact. It has has to, it's a different medium. The effects generally end up the same but the causes are plotted more directly, if that makes sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolsimir Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 It's because they wanted to give Cersei a ''strong'' moment, where she steps up and is ready to defy the man who tailored her life so far. Obviously such a confession would only be negative for Cersei. Either Tywin shuts her up somehow before she could talk, or he just ignores her threat and nothing happens. Because if she confesses she dies and her children aswell. They knew Tywin dies at the end of the episode and he can't do anything about it. And Cersei doesn't have to worry about that either. Which makes the scene completely pointless except for showing that Cersei somehow got ''stronger''. In general the showrunners seem to portray Cersei in a much better light then in the books. I read somewhere that the producers are great friends with Lena in real life, which would explain a lot. Though it is kind of bad for the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ummester Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 In general the showrunners seem to portray Cersei in a much better light then in the books. I read somewhere that the producers are great friends with Lena in real life, which would explain a lot. Though it is kind of bad for the show. I don't find her that different - I was expecting book Cersie to be nastier than show Cersie, based on what I'd read and heard but she 'feels' almost the same to me, overall. Also, neither book or show Tywin would ever kill his legacy - even if that legacy was inbred. Show Cersie knew this and I thought she was just saying, 'confront the truth dad, everything you have lived for is a lie', because she was spiteful about having to be married off a second time, which served to add impact to Tywin's death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolsimir Posted September 19, 2014 Share Posted September 19, 2014 I don't find her that different - I was expecting book Cersie to be nastier than show Cersie, based on what I'd read and heard but she 'feels' almost the same to me, overall. Also, neither book or show Tywin would ever kill his legacy - even if that legacy was inbred. Show Cersie knew this and I thought she was just saying, 'confront the truth dad, everything you have lived for is a lie', because she was spiteful about having to be married off a second time, which served to add impact to Tywin's death. Just some differences: - In the books she orders the death of Robert's bastards, while in the show Joffrey does. - In the books she is oblivious to Joffrey's cruelty and claims he is just ''strong-willed'', while in the show she knows Joffrey is a monster, yet still she must love him. - In the books she is using her body to gain favours constantly, while in the show it was only Lancel and then they kinda forgot even about that. - In the books she also wants to use Jaime to kill Tyrion after having sex with him, and when Jaime refuses she shows her true colors. Meanwhile in the show Jaime rapes her? These are just some of the differences, I am sure I missed a lot of them but those are some of the more obvious ones. Also I agree that Tywin would never kill his legacy, which is why it made even less sense that Cersei admitted the incest to him. Tywin would prioritize the throne over Cersei 100%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ummester Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 Tolsimir, yes, the differences you have noted are actual. I think the impact of the differences depends on whether your introduction to Cersie was book or show. re the point about her thinking Joffrey is just 'strong willed' and turning a blind eye in the book - I found that far less realistically maternal than her speech about loving your child, even if you know it is bad that she gave in the show. Besides, our interpretation of her in this area is only from Tyrion's POV in the book, which may be biased against her anyway. re the using her body to gain favors - she is a character in the show that admits to using the 'weapon between her legs in the same way a woman can use tears'. This could be because I saw the show first - but I find the actresses' presentation of Cersie (at least for the first 3 books/4 seasons) is better realized overall than Martin's. Martin is a good writer, with very intricate plotting skills - though some of the female characterization rings less true to me than how the show's cast has interpreted it - with Cersie being the most notable for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
larastone Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 Tolsimir, yes, the differences you have noted are actual. I think the impact of the differences depends on whether your introduction to Cersie was book or show. re the point about her thinking Joffrey is just 'strong willed' and turning a blind eye in the book - I found that far less realistically maternal than her speech about loving your child, even if you know it is bad that she gave in the show. Besides, our interpretation of her in this area is only from Tyrion's POV in the book, which may be biased against her anyway. re the using her body to gain favors - she is a character in the show that admits to using the 'weapon between her legs in the same way a woman can use tears'. This could be because I saw the show first - but I find the actresses' presentation of Cersie (at least for the first 3 books/4 seasons) is better realized overall than Martin's. Martin is a good writer, with very intricate plotting skills - though some of the female characterization rings less true to me than how the show's cast has interpreted it - with Cersie being the most notable for me. I very much prefer book!cersei over show!cersei but yeah I agree with you to an extent, cersei in the books was just a stereotype of an icy evil queen in the first 3 books so it was shocking for book readers when she's revealed to be so unhinged, paranoid and vulnerable in book 4. now i dont think that cersei going crazy next season will be as shocking since the show has focused on her more in the first four seasons than GRRM did in books 1-3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MissMatchedEyes Posted September 20, 2014 Author Share Posted September 20, 2014 I reckon they'll use him freeing Tyrion as the main reason for the disintegration of their relationship now That's what I was thinking too. I really hope they don't leave out the Kettleblacks. I look forward to what I know is coming for Cersei.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tolsimir Posted September 20, 2014 Share Posted September 20, 2014 Tolsimir, yes, the differences you have noted are actual. I think the impact of the differences depends on whether your introduction to Cersie was book or show. re the point about her thinking Joffrey is just 'strong willed' and turning a blind eye in the book - I found that far less realistically maternal than her speech about loving your child, even if you know it is bad that she gave in the show. Besides, our interpretation of her in this area is only from Tyrion's POV in the book, which may be biased against her anyway. re the using her body to gain favors - she is a character in the show that admits to using the 'weapon between her legs in the same way a woman can use tears'. This could be because I saw the show first - but I find the actresses' presentation of Cersie (at least for the first 3 books/4 seasons) is better realized overall than Martin's. Martin is a good writer, with very intricate plotting skills - though some of the female characterization rings less true to me than how the show's cast has interpreted it - with Cersie being the most notable for me. She doesn't turn a blind eye in the books. She really thinks Joff is strong-willed and not a cruel monster. And the point is not that she is maternal, but that she is delusional. That Cersei is a good mother is purely a show invention. I agree that the impact of the differences depends on what you saw first though. So for me they are quite jarring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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