Is the text worth it, besides the artwork?

[Ran]

Boycotts I've no problem with. Vote with your money.

Boycotts that depend on lies, misinformation, and slander strike me as ethically questionable at best, libelous at worst. They do have the benefit of making it easy to ignore, though.

[Caerl Targaryen]

It's a good book, a great book. But there are also reasons to boycott it.

Such as?

I don't doubt that some will not like the book. Its style certainly isn't for everyone. Disliking the style and the way the information is presented is certainly a valid criticism if they truly don't like it.

Most of the reasons being given in the bad reviews are just completely absurd, and it's very clear they either dislike GRRM or Elio and Linda. Or both. It seems that positive reviews and comments are being downvoted for similar reasons. The whole response on there right now is ridiculous. "Fanfiction" is one of the "criticisms" that has been popping up repeatedly. I think George's response to comments about that on his blog is spot on: "Calling it fan fiction is , well, moronic."

The amount of work that went into this book is incredible. I personally love it. I also love that the information is presented in the style of the point of view of a maester. It's a great stylistic choice that is consistent with how backstory and history are conveyed in the novels themselves. The uncertainty of the information presented is a great touch too. Even if you hate the text, the artwork alone makes it a worthy purchase if you're a fan of the book series, IMO.

Boycotts I've no problem with. Vote with your money.

Boycotts that depend on lies, misinformation, and slander strike me as ethically questionable at best, libelous at worst. They do have the benefit of making it easy to ignore, though.

Basically, this.

[Ran]

Reasons to boycott it, according to those who want to boycott it:

1) George should not be distracted with such things, should focus solely on TWoW (and better yet ASoIaF) until he's done with it before taking on other projects. These people believe that TWoIaF was a distraction. Yeah, maybe George is and has always been the sort of writer who keeps several projects on hand so that when one grows cold he can work on another, but maybe it'd be better if he stopped doing that and just stared at TWoW until he could get the words out rather than using precious time on anything else. (This includes traveling, posting about NFL games, dealing with business correspondence, etc.)

2) I have censored people who have negative opinions about George and his books and have unjustly removed people from the forum. Yeah, sometimes the people who've been banned have spammed or violated various rules of conduct repeatedly, but you know, they should get some leniency because they're angry.

3) Linda is a misogynistic, racist homophobe who laces her responses to the people who call her a misogynistic, racist homophobe with obscenities and is really just really, really mean to people who say she's a misogynistic, racist homophobe. Because calling someone a misgoynist, racist, or homophobe is okay if you really believe it, while telling people to go fuck themselves isn't the way forward to a civil society.

If any of the above three are reasons to boycott the book, by all means, one should vote with one's conscience and one's money.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

Such as?

Spend more then five minutes on any other forum or social media about this book and I think it'll come to light. Reddit and Tumblr are good places to start.

But what Ran says sums it up. The reviews based on lies, misinformation and written by people that haven't read the book are compltely disregardable.

[JonCon's Red Beard]

#3 mentioned by Ran is ironic. I can see why people don't like Linda's opinions, and to each their own about it, but it's always sad to see that she's accused of being misogynistic while called names that are borderline misogynistic as well.

[The Drunkard]

Price question: On the Book Depository it's about $35 USD, is that around about what it's costing elsewhere?

[Caerl Targaryen]

Reasons to boycott it, according to those who want to boycott it:

1) George should not be distracted with such things, should focus solely on TWoW (and better yet ASoIaF) until he's done with it before taking on other projects. These people believe that TWoIaF was a distraction. Yeah, maybe George is and has always been the sort of writer who keeps several projects on hand so that when one grows cold he can work on another, but maybe it'd be better if he stopped doing that and just stared at TWoW until he could get the words out rather than using precious time on anything else. (This includes traveling, posting about NFL games, dealing with business correspondence, etc.)

2) I have censored people who have negative opinions about George and his books and have unjustly removed people from the forum. Yeah, sometimes the people who've been banned have spammed or violated various rules of conduct repeatedly, but you know, they should get some leniency because they're angry.

3) Linda is a misogynistic, racist homophobe who laces her responses to the people who call her a misogynistic, racist homophobe with obscenities and is really just really, really mean to people who say she's a misogynistic, racist homophobe. Because calling someone a misgoynist, racist, or homophobe is okay if you really believe it, while telling people to go fuck themselves isn't the way forward to a civil society.

If any of the above three are reasons to boycott the book, by all means, one should vote with one's conscience and one's money.

I suppose if I agreed with any of the above reasons, I might boycott it too. I highly doubt I'd waste my time writing a review for it unless I intensely disliked the book itself. I guess they just have a lot more time to waste than I do, and if I dislike something or someone, I end up avoiding it/them.

Oh well. I think everyone involved with this project did an amazing job. I expect I'll be reading this for many years to come. :)

Spend more then five minutes on any other forum or social media about this book and I think it'll come to light. Reddit and Tumblr are good places to start.

But what Ran says sums it up. The reviews based on lies, misinformation and written by people that haven't read the book are compltely disregardable.

I have. I've found the responses in those locations to be just as ridiculous. It seems like a lot of the people complaining are very entitled, angry people that aren't happy with anything no matter what. They seem to especially hate that GRRM has the "nerve" to not be locked in a chair in front of his computer and forced to write until he's done without ever spending time doing things he enjoys. These same people would probably be incredibly pissed off if they were told they have to work 24/7.

At the same time, I've seen tons of really positive comments about the book. Those comments seem to be outweighing the bad.

[Caerl Targaryen]

Price question: On the Book Depository it's about $35 USD, is that around about what it's costing elsewhere?

It's $19.99 for the Kindle Edition and $29.38 for the hardcover edition on Amazon.com.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

The first reason is ridiculous... Patience won't kill you. Let the man write lest we forsake quality for quickness.

If anything, I think TWOIAF is a welcome respite for those waiting, and if it doesn't keep people happy then I'm not sure what will (besides tWoW).

Misogyny is not the only thing that has apparently been perpertrated by Linda.

[Ran]

Yes, there's also racism, homophobia, and apparently being a meanie.

There's a very nice and civil discussion awhile back at the Podcast of Ice and Fire forum (have to be a member to read it, I believe) where I weigh in (my handle is Balerion there) which is one of the few times I've bothered engaging on the topic. It's a nice little forum, BTW, for those who sometimes wish this forum were a much smaller and less rowdy place. We did a post-release podcast with Amin there, discussing the WoIaF in more detail than we have done anywhere else.

[Moondancer]

I loved it, it is very atmospheric - it sucks you in. A historical narrative, yes, but Yandel does have a grain of poetry in him, all for the better.

[chrisdaw]

I've found it very enjoyable so far, it's not poorly written.

To put things in perspective, I very much like the main series and the D&E stories, am so so on TPATQ and didn't much like Rogue Prince.

Oh and the artwork, I have no idea who is responsible for it, but they create fictional characters more beautiful than any in real life.

[Ran]

There's a full index of all the artistic contributors, with the pages of their contributions, at the end of the book. George insisted -- he wants artists to get credit for what they do.

[Linda]

Because calling someone a misgoynist, racist, or homophobe is okay if you really believe it...

Especially if you have just heard someone say that someone else told them that they believe it because they heard it from another person, because of course you base your beliefs on such matters on an internet game of telephone.

I admit, I am still scratching my head about the homophobe claim. I can see where the misogyny and racism claims come from (clearly, if you present a different opinion on Robert's and Cersei's marriage, you have to be a misogynist, not just someone with a different interpretation of the text and if you want to be a hardcore book purist about castings you are obviously a racist, not just a book purist) but that one is just baffling. It just showed up tacked on to the rest of the accusations at one point, but I've never seen it justified with anything I've said or even supposedly said.

I'd love to know, though!

[Ran]

I still laugh about your "racism" on the one hand, and the fact that you've been called a "race traitor" on the other.

[Lord Varys]

I don't follow this whole 'Linda is evil' thing, but perhaps it goes back to 'you don't like that Loras has sex with the first effeminate face he stumbles upon'? I seem to remember you guys had, rightfully, some issues with the lack of 'When the sun has set, no candle can replace it'.

[TheKingoftheSevenKingdoms]

I would say it's very obvious that GRRM did not write it but I don't care. Love the pictures and the history lesson!

:agree: That's what a lot of my mates who've gotten the book (book-readers and even purely show-watchers!) have said, though my show-watching mates have read the first book and that's it.

I have a friend who purchased the book and is lending it to me when he's done, and he's says the artwork and the actual history is awesome, but that the writing and prose of the text is fine but definitely not ASOIAF quality. He wished that some more houses like the Baratheons, Arryns, Greyjoys and Tullys were expanded upon with their own lineage-tree, since he hates House Targaryen and House Lannister. Which blows since House Baratheon and House Greyjoy are my favourite houses as well, though I do like the Targaryens and the Lannisters.

Overall, my friend said that he wished the book had been written by GRRM himself despite some excellent segments scattered throughout, and that the book was released after the series was complete (I agree with him on that point).

Since I trust my best mate completely, I'm going to agree with his opinion. A Youtuber named Redteamreview actually did an unbiased review of the book, and he sounds genuine with his complaints and rating. Though again, I have not read the book.

[Linda]

I don't follow this whole 'Linda is evil' thing, but perhaps it goes back to 'you don't like that Loras has sex with the first effeminate face he stumbles upon'? I seem to remember you guys had, rightfully, some issues with the lack of 'When the sun has set, no candle can replace it'.

Well, I certainly didn't word my issues with Loras's fling in that way and I hope it was very clear that my objections were all to do with it being out of character for him given his love for Renly.

I also believe the accusations of homophobia predate that complaint.

The only thing I can possibly imagine, and given that the accusations come from the Tumblr crowd with all their slash fiction I find it unlikely, is that (and I have no issues admitting this) I am one of those female readers who likes male/male relationships in fiction (though I have no sympathy for fanfiction's tendency to turn everyone and their uncle gay/bi against canon - as I've said, I am a purist).

[The One And Only]

It is like The Silmarillion for ASOIAF, only easy to read and missing "facts" due to it being an incomplete history. It adds even more depth to the main books.

The internet is a funny place. Groups of people getting together to bash something that they never even gave a chance to begin with.

[Ramsay's Penguins]

Another thing about the homophobia is one of your comments on your tumblr is something along the line of someone saying so much heterosexual sex without any homosexual sex is rooted in homophobia, and you dismissing it.
Which holds little water considering there is no characters with POV's that engage in homosexual sex, and an absence of homosexual sex isn't homophobic. Its also not a setting where homosexual sex is to common so the absence is most certainly not jarring.

It wasn't out of character for Loras... thats just how show Loras is. Mourning sex is very common, and Loras is only human. In the books he could have done the same, but we never get to see if this is so.

Isn't that the point of fanfiction? People can do what that want with it. Jon/Robb/Theon slash is very popular, but it doesn't chnage the actual characters sexualities in any way.

Besides that I find no indication of you being homophobic. There may be more though.
So homophobia can not be attributed, but racism and misogyny undeinably. Amongst other things.