Inevittable

PhD research: Doran Martell and you

34 posts in this topic

Doran Martell

1) In your own words, describe what Doran Martell looks like (eg his face, body, clothing, posture, anything else) and what his personality is like. What is your description based on? (for example, descriptions in the book, fan art, Alexander Siddig, another actor, other things)

It's been over a year since I last read Doran Martell's parts of the books. The impression that those scenes gave me was of an aging prince who suffers ill health but not any fatal illness (yet, at least). His personality is that of an aging, somewhat Machiavellian prince who feels isolated and lonely, and is newly bereft of the brother he loved and trusted. He is determined to both protect Dorne and strike back at the Lannisters for killing his sister and her children, and he's been proceeding very cautiously toward that goal for perhaps too many years. I don't remember the descriptions of what he wore, but I imagine his garb would be rich and fine but not overly ostentatious; he's not a peacock. I saw Doran as the flip side of Oberyn - both of them singularly intelligent men, but Doran has controlled and contained his emotions, and this repression has cost him.

2) Alexander Siddig will play Doran in the show, how does he compare to your own mental image of Doran before he was cast? (eg does he look the same? Is it hard for you to remember your mental image before he was cast? Did you imagine someone else playing the character? Anything else?)

It is hard to compare TV-Doran to my own mental image of the character in the books (before Season 5 of the TV show). Siddig is doing a fine job incarnating the Prince of Dorne. He's nailed Doran's quiet but unmistakeable authority. (the only problem is that the directors and writers have wasted Siddig's talent; he's not been given enough lines, while they waste our time with the Sand Brats acting, well, bratty; or Ellaria being the total opposite of what she was in the books) Other actors who could play the role? A younger Al Pacino, perhaps.

3) Have you seen Siddig in any other films or shows (eg Syriana, Reign of Fire, Clash of the Titans, Star Trek, 24, anything else)? How do those other roles affect your feelings about him being cast as Doran? (For example, did you like those other roles? Are you happy to see the actor in something else? Are you happy to see the actor in GoT in particular? etc).

I've seen Siddig in A Dangerous Man: Lawrence After Arabia, Star Trek: Deep Space 9, and in Kingdom of Heaven. He's a good actor (loved him as Bashir). Those other roles made me glad he was cast as Doran Martell; since I felt he was an actor who could convey the character's intelligence and usage of power. Yes, I am happy to see him in GoT, but I feel they should have given him a few more lines. He is far more compelling to watch than any scenes with the Sand Brats, or Trystane/Myrcella, or Ellaria. I like the character's rapport with Areo Hotah, which was also present in the books.

4) Have you read or seen any interviews with Siddig about his part in Game of Thrones? What have you learned about Siddig himself or his role as Doran? Where did you find this information? (for example YouTube, his official website, other websites, magazines).

I haven't seen any interviews with Siddig about his participation in Game of Thrones; or learned anything new about him or his role as Doran Martell.

Edited by Raksha 2014

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1) arab/mediterranean appearance, in a wheelchair, dark hair greying at temples, handsome but careworn. Disfigured extremities (I imagine gouty type lesions on hands and feet). Based on book but also on Dorne itself; it strkes me as a mediterranean cross arab climate and this is what I imagine its ruler would look like due to where he is.

2) I always thought of him as Doran since readin the books, but more of him as he appeared in Syriana. I think the way they have portrayed him on the show is sterner,crueler and somehow more of a short term thinker than I imagine Doran.

3) Yes, DS9 and Syriana. He was my favourite character in Ds9. Happy to see him in GoT, he is a marvellous actor who we don't see enough of. Watched Syriana many years ago, when i read the books for the first time his Syriana character immediately came to mind as Doran.

4) No, not interested in what the actor thinks of his character, just in the character itself.

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I would be grateful if you could take some time to answer these questions in as much or as little detail as you like, to help me gather data for my thesis. This is one of several research threads about the characters in ASoIaF and Game of Thrones. There is a thread here which you are very welcome to join to discuss the research project or ask questions.

Doran Martell

1) In your own words, describe what Doran Martell looks like (eg his face, body, clothing, posture, anything else) and what his personality is like. What is your description based on? (for example, descriptions in the book, fan art, Alexander Siddig, another actor, other things)

2) Alexander Siddig will play Doran in the show, how does he compare to your own mental image of Doran before he was cast? (eg does he look the same? Is it hard for you to remember your mental image before he was cast? Did you imagine someone else playing the character? Anything else?)

3) Have you seen Siddig in any other films or shows (eg Syriana, Reign of Fire, Clash of the Titans, Star Trek, 24, anything else)? How do those other roles affect your feelings about him being cast as Doran? (For example, did you like those other roles? Are you happy to see the actor in something else? Are you happy to see the actor in GoT in particular? etc).

4) Have you read or seen any interviews with Siddig about his part in Game of Thrones? What have you learned about Siddig himself or his role as Doran? Where did you find this information? (for example YouTube, his official website, other websites, magazines).

Reference material

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexander_Siddig

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0796502/?ref_=nv_sr_1

Some small print...

I am currently studying towards a PhD in Media, Culture and Communication at Keele University. My project title is An online ethnography of the fan community of the A Song of Ice and Fire novels and the Game of Thrones television adaptation and my aim is to investigate the history and current practices of the fan community of A Song of Ice and Fire and Game of Thrones.

With the permission of the owners of this website I am initiating this thread to try and encourage discussion about the topic described above. This topic is just one part of a much larger research project, and you may notice other threads around the forum.

An information sheet is available here, which will hopefully address any questions you may have about the research. The information sheet contains information about the research process, and also information about how your posts to this thread will be used. You are under no obligation to take part, however your help in the project would be much appreciated.

By posting in this thread you are agreeing to the statements on the consent sheet which is part of the information sheet linked to above. By posting in the thread you are agreeing that you are over 18.

If you have any queries please let me know.

Many thanks,

Inevittable

1) I always envisioned Doran as a fat man, with a rounded face, thick greyish-black eyebrows, white and grey hair (mainly white), small eyes, and tanned skin.

I think the description of the book made me feel those impressions, but I don't remember it, quite honestly, only the image of him. The clothes,. very similar to the actor playing him, maybe with more orange colours. But similar character to the actor portrayinh him.

2)It is not hard to remember him

3, 4), No, sorry

Edited by Meera of Tarth

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Hi everyone,



Thanks for contributing to the discussion. Just wanted to let you all know that I've gone a bit quite while I take some time off for health reasons, but I'll be in touch if I have any questions.


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What do you think of how do Doran’s looks and personality differ or compare to the Doran of the books?



Book Doran had gout is fat and has patchy skin. I’m thought he was a bit like Robert the Elder in Braveheart. Robert has leprosy but is very intelligent and strategic. I pictured Doran with less debilitating disease, stuck in one place but a thinker and strategic.




How well (or not) does Alexander Siddig embody the character compared to how you imagined Doran while reading about him.



He seems clever, he’s good, but the Dorne TV plots were silly and didn’t show his long term plans and thoughts. He seemed to weak and passive.



Do you think seeing Siddig acting in any other shows or films has informed your ideas or opinions about his playing of Doran? Please explain where else you’ve seen him etc.



I haven’t seen him in any other shows but I knew who he was because fans on this forum thought he would be a good Doran.



Can you can imagine any other actor playing the role since you saw Siddig in it? If so, who? If not, why not?



Yes, I expected him to be fat. I pictured Edward James Olmos




What interviews you have seen? What did you think of Siddig’s personality and attitude towards the show and the character. Did you seek out these interviews or come across links? Where did you find them?



On YouTube saw Comic-con introduce new characters. I saw the interviews with Siddig sand he seems really thrilled and happy to be on the show, so I liked him. I have faith in the GoT casting department, they have been very good so far and I think he should be good.



Do you think that you are likely to try and find out more about Siddig now that he is in GoT?



Yes, I will glance at wiki and IMDB. I do that for all the major cast members and anyone I find interesting.


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Oded Fehr was my dream Red Viper and Siddig was my dream Doran Martell, even tho I pictured Doran as more similar to Conleth Hill (the actor who plays varys.) 

Edited by The 999th Sword of Braavos

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1. I picture him fatter and swollen, splotchy skin, short hair, wouldve been handsome if not for gout and everything else, kinda like a handsome face that really let themselves go. But, i see him as intelligent and i think this would really be apparent in his eyes. The rest of him will look swollen and very tired and run down but not the eyes. Certian people you can tell they are very smart by their eyes, i think doran and petyr are two examples in my mind. His personality is kind, tired, but very patient and calculated. He is there for the long game, oberyn was all about short game in everything he did, pursuit of plesure and such, doran is the opposite. 

2. Siddig looks absolutely nothing like what i pictured. Everything about him is wrong. That being said i love the actor in everything, always been a fan. My thoughts on what the charchter should look like come solely from the descriptions in the books.

3. Ive seen him in deep s. 9 loved his character.  I liked him in Atlantis. And i liked his perfermonce in da vincis demons. I liked him in clash of titans, merlin, reign of fire and kingdom of heaven. I am glad he is in g.o.t. and think he is doing great but not how i pictured doran at all, that does make it a littleoff. But i think he is one of those actors that can overcome not seeming right for a role, like ian mcshane who will also be in g.o.t. in season six.

4. I havent really followed siddig apart from imdb. Im not a superfan going to his website or looking for articles but i like him. Overall im more a fan of the shows. G.o.t. in particlular.

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I don't know if this will be useful or not, but what the hell.

I don't image characters. I've never done so. If I'm given an image then I have an image to work with. Otherwise I have no real image. A shadowy figure of a certain height and weight and eye/hair colour. That's about the most I have.

So I view Doran as Dr. Bashir. Less the uniform and a bit more hair.

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1) Very often hunched, from pain. He isn't a short but not very impressive physically or with the impression that he ever was in the way that someone like Jaime is. Decently handsome but closer to Quentyn than Arianne. My opinion is from book descriptions, I have only ever seen 1 depiction of him, from the board game card. More in the next since they are related

 

2) Doran is pretty much completely grayed hair-wise and in general with entirely different, more square facial features. I didn't consider much casting before a character appeared on the show(though I finished all the books before season 2), though it did happen as with what I thought Oberyn for example would look like onscreen

 

3) I've never seen him in anything else as far as I know. I think he is perfect for the role and a great actor from what I've seen.

4) I've heard almost nothing about him in interviews aside from before he actually appeared, in regards to casting reviews before the showing.

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1) By reading the books, my perception of Doran Martell is of a person somewhat average in weight, who is affected by gout (swollen, chair-bound, with dark skin complexion. By comparing the perception I have received from the books to the visualisation of GoT, the only managed to get the skin complexion right. Based on the climatological depictions of Dorne, being at the very south of Westeros his clothing would have been very light and not of dark colours in order to minimise the effects of heat. Facial characteristics are bound by the fact of his illness and topography, namely a weathered face. Regarding posture, that would be no different compared to the average Dornishman. Regarding his personality, he appears to be calculating, and introvert, and in no need for caring and embracing the opinion of his peers. From his actions and inactions, regarding the murder of his sister Elia Martell, he appears to be pragmatic, as he did not openly challenge anyone who was involved in her and her childrens' killing, thinking of the greater good for the people of Dorne. His public stance on the killing does not demonstrate his private wanton revenge, but he is rational and knows that he can achieve more by plotting rather than warring. He does not try to protect himself, he does what he does for his people, in my opinion, but not in the way the others expect him to behave such as impulse.

2) Based on the book descriptions I would love to have seen for this role Toby Jones. Alexander Siddig as an appearance was very fancy compared to what he appears to be in the books. In one word "overaesthetic" for the role's age and troubles as depicted by GRRM.

3) I have seen most of these films and tv series, and I liked him a lot in Syriana. I did like his acting in GoT, and the portrayal of his character.

4) I have stumbled on a couple of interviews on youtube, and some articles, after I saw him on GoT. He appears to be down to earth, however since we are talking about actors, they can "act" their way and appear to be lovely, so from an interview I can never be sure about a person and his overall stance in life. I often ask myself, if it matters to me what kind of persons they are outside the set or the role, and I cannot find a convincing answer.

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I would very much like to participate in your survey. I particularly like the scene when darth vader fights obi wan kenobhi....is he really his father?

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1) In your own words, describe what Doran Martell looks like (eg his face, body, clothing, posture, anything else) and what his personality is like. What is your description based on? (for example, descriptions in the book, fan art, Alexander Siddig, another actor, other things)

He's older, maybe 40s or 50s, and heavy with white hair. His posture is strained due to gout, which also causes his limbs and digits to appear very swollen. His skin would be darker as he is dornish. Doran is a kind, thoughtful person innately, but he's also a proud highborn prince with duties to his family and people. He demonstrates patience, discipline, and intelligence throughout chapters where he is observed. Most of all, Doran is a thinker, and will not be spring to impulsive action.

2) Alexander Siddig will play Doran in the show, how does he compare to your own mental image of Doran before he was cast? (eg does he look the same? Is it hard for you to remember your mental image before he was cast? Did you imagine someone else playing the character? Anything else?)

Some of the actors on the HBO show have influence how I view characters when I reread the books (Arya, for one). Doran is not one of them as I feel he doesn't really fit my mental image of the character. I was expecting him to be older, fatter, and demonstrate a more contemplative attitude/manner. The actor was attractive, which I never associated with Doran (and Quentyn is called homely more than once and said to resemble his father). Unfortunately for the actor, the source material did not inspire the show in any of the right ways and the character literally became a throw-away.

3) Have you seen Siddig in any other films or shows (eg Syriana, Reign of Fire, Clash of the Titans, Star Trek, 24, anything else)? How do those other roles affect your feelings about him being cast as Doran? (For example, did you like those other roles? Are you happy to see the actor in something else? Are you happy to see the actor in GoT in particular? etc).

Have not.


4) Have you read or seen any interviews with Siddig about his part in Game of Thrones? What have you learned about Siddig himself or his role as Doran? Where did you find this information? (for example YouTube, his official website, other websites, magazines).

Nope, I don't really read anything about the show or the actors. If I have free time to explore something like that I'd rather just stick to the books. The only time I've read an interview was about Michelle Fairley's (Catelyn) experience filming her scenes in the Red Wedding. I thought she did a really good job.

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