WHEEL OF TIME officially optioned for television

[SpaceChampion]

I agree with showing the weaves similar to how the magic looked in Doctor Strange.  This is Fire.  This is Spirit.  etc.  I've seen this sort of thing in a webcomic I read too, "The Chronicles of Zona", where it is used sparsely but effectively.

The advantage of making it visual is you can show how difficult it is to unravel a weave, instead of hearing the character grunt in effort at fighting something invisible only they can see.  Slicing through a weave would also be good to see visually.

Inverted weaves could be detected by probing the weave with the One Power carefully, so you see the negative image of it, if you know what I mean.

The books are long enough without devoting time to characters trying to "act" magic like Gandalf battling Saruman in Fellowship of the Ring, which looked like an awful wrestling match.  Visible weaves would shorten the time spent conveying the information that magic is happening.  Story-wise, this is a must.

 

[Astromech]

8 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

I agree with showing the weaves similar to how the magic looked in Doctor Strange.  This is Fire.  This is Spirit.  etc.  I've seen this sort of thing in a webcomic I read too, "The Chronicles of Zona", where it is used sparsely but effectively.

The advantage of making it visual is you can show how difficult it is to unravel a weave, instead of hearing the character grunt at something invisible only they can see.  Slicing through a weave would also be good to see visually.

Inverted weaves could be detected by probing the weave with the One Power carefully, so you see the negative image of it, if you know what I mean.

The books are long enough without devoting time to characters trying to "act" magic like Gandalf battling Saruman in Fellowship of the Ring, which looked like an awful wrestling match.  Visible weaves would shorten the time spent conveying the information that magic is happening.  Story-wise, this is a must.

 

Not to mention the relative skill and power of various characters.

[SpaceChampion]

Actually, a yellow weave should be used for Spirit, probably, since the Yellow Ajah are the healers, and will tend to be using Spirit more than others.

White weaves should be unrefracted / undifferentiataed One Power.

Black weaves for the True Power.

• Red for Fire.
• Blue for Water.
• Green for Air.
• Yellow for Spirit.
• Orange or Violet for Earth?

[fionwe1987]

19 hours ago, Gertrude said:

Fionwe, out of curiosity, what type of things do you think we really need to see the weaves for it to be effective? Do you think there needs to be weaves shown in big scenes like Dumai's Wells, or just the effects?

Well, I think Dumai's Wells would be way cooler if we can see the weaves AND the effects. Parts of Dumai's Wells, like Rand breaking through his shield, NEED weaves shown. The Asha'man and Aes Sedai fighting... there it isn't strictly necessary but can add to the effect.

The Cleansing of Saidin will obviously need to show weaves. I'd say weaves make sense when someone is making cuendillar too. Another place where weaves would be good is when Healing is done.

Another thing to consider is how to show a character embracing the Power. The women are supposed to have a silver-gold nimbus. I'd make this common for men and women, to avoid confusion, but it needs to be done well, or it will just come across as tacky.

I agree that Dr. Strange was a great model for how to make weaves, except the weaves need to be more 3D. As for the colors of the Five Powers, RJ has already told use what they are:

Red for Fire, green for Earth, blue for Water, yellow for Air, and white for Spirit. These are just supposed to be tints, not solid colors. The base is the silvery glow of the One Power. I'd add these colors as light tints, and add diseased black spots or something for saidin till it is cleansed. 

 

[felice]

44 minutes ago, fionwe1987 said:

I agree that Dr. Strange was a great model for how to make weaves, except the weaves need to be more 3D.

And actual threads being woven together, not geometric patterns and runes appearing from nowhere. This is the best example I can find, though there should be more of a discernible pattern to how the threads come together. Weaves affecting an area rather than a point effect (eg wrapping someone in air) would look more like a loose net, with the sorts of patterns you can make with actual weaving on a loom.

[Which Tyler]

I think the obvious thing to separate Saidin for Saidar is how the thread is modelled - model Saidar on water flowing through tubes, with water-type movements in the air; whilst Saidin would be modelled on fire, crackling in it's weaves; then chaning the colour depending on what weave is used.

I choose water and fire that way due to the descriptions; of channelling water versus burning your emotions in the flame; surrendering and channelling rather than fighting and forcing etc.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

They just need to make sure they have lots and lots of episodes that focus on the Circus.  Best part of the entire series.  Also, an entire season where we have 20 hour long episodes of Mat whining about his clothing.

[Gertrude]

Scot is not allowed anywhere near the creative team, in fact, we should disable his email, ban him from forums where this is discussed and take away all forms of social media, just to be safe.

[Rhom]

19 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

They just need to make sure they have lots and lots of episodes that focus on the Circus.  Best part of the entire series.  Also, an entire season where we have 20 hour long episodes of Mat whining about his clothing.

There should be much braid tugging.

And the big twist at the climax of your Mat  episode should be him ordering a shirt with extra lace from a tailor.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Oh, and we need a season of Perrin debating about what he should do about Faile.

[SpaceChampion]

Well, at least spell her name correctly.  It's Fail.

 

What they should do is figure out what they actually want to put into the final season (because they're not going to do 13 episodes on the Last Battle) and work it backwards from there to the climaxes of each season, and who from each faction in play will need story arcs.  Discard everything else, but leave room for great guest roles.

 

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

35 minutes ago, SpaceChampion said:

Well, at least spell her name correctly.  It's Fail.

 

What they should do is figure out what they actually want to put into the final season (because they're not going to do 13 episodes on the Last Battle) and work it backwards from there to the climaxes of each season, and who from each faction in play will need story arcs.  Discard everything else, but leave room for great guest roles.

 

Will correct.  You aren't looking foward to that season?

[Gertrude]

5 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Oh, and we need a season of Perrin debating about what he should do about Faile.

Only one season? Seems like there is enough material there for at least two if not more. And they need to make sure they get across how Perrin loves her so very deeply but doesn't understand her at all. That's essential. It adds drama and depth to their relationship.

And now I've got a serious question, speaking of relationships. Rand's harem - how does that play out? It always seemed so weak to me and as there was never any actual reason for it, could it be dropped or would it screw up anything?

I wouldn't mind having the girls love Rand, and he could have trysts with each, but it's the agreeing to share that I particularly don't find palatable. Avi should be cool with it based on her background, but the other two - nope. Personally, I've always thought Min was the one best suited to him as she is devoted to him. That's sounds like horrible, conservative, stand by your man crap, but Elayne and Avi have other priorities and loyalties (Andor, Wise Ones) whereas Min's top priority is Rand, and he really, really needs someone to be there for him and care for him - not the Dragon, just Rand.

And I am spending way too much time thinking about this than I should.

[fionwe1987]

1 hour ago, Gertrude said:

And now I've got a serious question, speaking of relationships. Rand's harem - how does that play out? It always seemed so weak to me and as there was never any actual reason for it, could it be dropped or would it screw up anything?

I wouldn't mind having the girls love Rand, and he could have trysts with each, but it's the agreeing to share that I particularly don't find palatable. Avi should be cool with it based on her background, but the other two - nope. Personally, I've always thought Min was the one best suited to him as she is devoted to him. That's sounds like horrible, conservative, stand by your man crap, but Elayne and Avi have other priorities and loyalties (Andor, Wise Ones) whereas Min's top priority is Rand, and he really, really needs someone to be there for him and care for him - not the Dragon, just Rand.

And I am spending way too much time thinking about this than I should.

I don't know how they'd handle it, either. I agree the three agreeing to share him is weird. But as someone else pointed out, if you can actually show straight up brother-sister incest on GoT, and no one gets super judgy, I guess they could find a way to handle this too.

In some ways, the books do work to make this work. Frankly, Elayne spends more time with Aviendha than she does Rand, so it isn't like she agrees to this purely for Rand's sake. Min does, it feels like, though she spends a lot of time with Elayne too. 

Frankly, things would be easier if they just paired up Elayne and Aviendha. Have them hook up with Rand, but then fall for each other. Then nothing major changes, except that Rand and Elayne have kids...

[Gertrude]

10 minutes ago, fionwe1987 said:

But as someone else pointed out, if you can actually show straight up brother-sister incest on GoT, and no one gets super judgy, I guess they could find a way to handle this too.

In some ways, the books do work to make this work. Frankly, Elayne spends more time with Aviendha than she does Rand, so it isn't like she agrees to this purely for Rand's sake. Min does, it feels like, though she spends a lot of time with Elayne too.

Well, the incest is a pretty major driver of the plot, so it has an actual purpose. And who's NOT judging that? Are there a big contingent of people out there defending their love and calling it beautiful? We're supposed to think it's creepy. We've just become accustomed to it. The harem serves no real purpose. You can keep the Elayne/Avi relationship. In fact, I would be upset if they didn't because as strange as it is, it's refreshing to not see it devolve into just jealousy and competition. Keep all the aspects of the female relationships and how their love for Rand affects them, but just don't have them all agree to share him because ick. In the books it's all too clean and happy and yay - Rand gets to sleep with all of them! It should be more messy than that.

Trust me, I was waiting to see why the harem was relevant to the plot and expecting some sort of payoff. Since it never came, it's a lot harder to swallow.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

49 minutes ago, Gertrude said:

Well, the incest is a pretty major driver of the plot, so it has an actual purpose. And who's NOT judging that? Are there a big contingent of people out there defending their love and calling it beautiful? We're supposed to think it's creepy. We've just become accustomed to it. The harem serves no real purpose. You can keep the Elayne/Avi relationship. In fact, I would be upset if they didn't because as strange as it is, it's refreshing to not see it devolve into just jealousy and competition. Keep all the aspects of the female relationships and how their love for Rand affects them, but just don't have them all agree to share him because ick. In the books it's all too clean and happy and yay - Rand gets to sleep with all of them! It should be more messy than that.

Trust me, I was waiting to see why the harem was relevant to the plot and expecting some sort of payoff. Since it never came, it's a lot harder to swallow.

I still think the harem was fanwankery.

[Rhom]

16 minutes ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

I still think the harem was fanwankery.

Or personal wankery on Rigney's part.

Lets not forget that the climax of all Rand's love for his harem was him wandering off in another man's body wondering which of the three would be the first to chase after him.   

[Corvinus85]

There is one tiny purpose the harem serves, but it has nothing to do with love, but practicality. All 3 women form the Warder bond with Rand. Therefore, all 3 can find him, even if the 3 are separate from each other. So, it serves the plot, in that the 3 women can be part of individual plots (Min in Tear, Elaine in Andor, Aviendha wherever) and they can re-connect with the main plot that has Rand at the center. 

But I still wouldn't want to see it done in the TV series. 

[williamjm]

3 hours ago, Gertrude said:

And now I've got a serious question, speaking of relationships. Rand's harem - how does that play out? It always seemed so weak to me and as there was never any actual reason for it, could it be dropped or would it screw up anything?

TV does love its love triangles (or love quadrilaterals in this case), so I bet they'd keep that. I certainly wouldn't mind if they dropped it, or at least put less emphasis on it.

I wouldn't mind having the girls love Rand, and he could have trysts with each, but it's the agreeing to share that I particularly don't find palatable. Avi should be cool with it based on her background, but the other two - nope. Personally, I've always thought Min was the one best suited to him as she is devoted to him. That's sounds like horrible, conservative, stand by your man crap, but Elayne and Avi have other priorities and loyalties (Andor, Wise Ones) whereas Min's top priority is Rand, and he really, really needs someone to be there for him and care for him - not the Dragon, just Rand.

The way it is written Rand has far more of a genuine relationship with Min than either of the others. It might not have been too bad if he ended up with Aviendha either, but Elayne always seemed more in love with the idea of Rand than the man himself

4 hours ago, Ser Scot A Ellison said:

Will correct.  You aren't looking foward to that season?

I think the most important thing is to spend an entire season on the material from Crossroads of Twilight, since it's so crucial to the overall story.

[Astromech]

Bela should be the pov for the series.