Casting, News, and Speculation while waiting on Season 5 (Book & Show Spoilers)

[FireAndBlood.]

That's more of a simple cause and effect - not a backstory.

I disagree 100%. A character hearing of the murder of their beloved family members and then wanting to get revenge on the people who did it is not poor storytelling. Quite the opposite in my view. Anyway, it's likely that you're going to get the backstory you want in spades in season 5. She'll be present to witness the Boltons in her family's ancestral home, defacing it with Bolton sigils and she might even get married off to Ramsay.

If you don't want her to do it, as I said earlier, that's totally fine, but I just think you're jumping through hoops to try and justify why it would suck and I don't think your logic makes any sense.

[boojam]

I heard that Faye Marsay were going to portray the Waif. Anyone got any information on this or is it just a hoax?

If I remember correctly, the Waif were going to be asian from the casting call, but I guess they could've changed their minds.

Where did you hear that?

I think The Waif from the casting call is one of the few actors unidentified.

I guess we will know who it is in episode 2.

[boojam]

That's more of a simple cause and effect - not a backstory.

That sounds like a distinction without a difference. (In this case.)

[Le Cygne]

I see what AdmiralKyrd is saying, it's not a story.

And Sansa would appear to be making the choice to marry Ramsay on the show. They are portraying her as Littlefinger's willing, equal partner. She's not aware of his own crimes against her and her family, but I suspect she won't be resisting his kisses, and then she will seduce Ramsay at his direction.

She will be seen as winning Winterfell for Littlefinger, so the audience may even perceive her as a villain. I suppose they may have her appear in over her head at some point, and then she will be a victim again. Someone will rescue her, Theon or Brienne, or even worse, Littlefinger (the real villain).

It's all very muddled this way.

[LordImp]

Escape to where?

Stannis?

That would mean Stannis would definitely win Winterfell, give it to Sansa and make a play for the Iron Throne with the support of the Vale, North & Riverlands. This would mean LF would also support Stannis. That seems weird.[/quote

Well she can escape south to Riverlands. But i have no idea.

[Cas Stark]

I see what AdmiralKyrd is saying, it's not a story.

And Sansa appears to be making the choice to marry Ramsay on the show. They are portraying her as Littlefinger's willing, equal partner. She's not aware of his own crimes against her and her family, but I suspect she won't be resisting his kisses, and then she will seduce Ramsay at his direction.

She will be seen as winning Winterfell for Littlefinger, so the audience may even perceive her as a villain. I suppose they may have her appear in over her head at some point, and then she will be a victim again. Someone will rescue her, Theon or Brienne, or even worse, Littlefinger.

It's all very muddled this way.

Is it confirmed that Sansa will be marrying Ramsay in the show? LOL. Alrighty then.

[Le Cygne]

Is it confirmed that Sansa will be marrying Ramsay in the show? LOL. Alrighty then.

Not confirmed, speculation, but there are many indications, from trailers, interviews, etc.

It's so wrong on so many levels, presumably they knew there would be controversy, and wanted it. They certainly didn't have to do it this way, not at all

[Cas Stark]

Not confirmed, speculation, but there are many indications, from trailers, interviews, etc.

It's so wrong on so many levels, presumably they knew there would be controversy, and wanted it. They certainly didn't have to do it this way, not at all

I still find this hard to believe, even for D&D. Though I have to say I laughed my ass off at the ET review where the reviewer said that some of the new characters ,e.g. Sand Snakes and the HS and his 'cult' seemed like they came from another show, because they were [paraphrasing] a little cartoonish, and over the top. You don't say?

I can only see this working at all if (1) They have Stannis take or about to take WF at the end of the year and Ramsay dies, e.g. Sansa stays in WF or (2) She escapes with Theon in place of Jeyne, which would leave the WF story in place but totally change everything about Sansa's story. I'm sure I have missed other permutations, but it seems like these are the basic thrusts, no? She stays in WF, which must mean the Bolton storyline is vastly speeded up or she serves as fake Arya and that story stays basically the same, minus the consumation w/Ramsay. Or what else can they do?

[Mister Stoneheart]

Not confirmed, speculation, but there are many indications, from trailers, interviews, etc.

It's so wrong on so many levels, presumably they knew there would be controversy, and wanted it. They certainly didn't have to do it this way, not at all

It's like they said 'let's create a little controversy'..then they go ahead and give us a whopping dollop of it--show seems to lack for subtlety recently. Who needs shades of grey when you can have neon magenta?

[ADanceWithCats]

She will be seen as winning Winterfell for Littlefinger, so the audience may even perceive her as a villain. I suppose they may have her appear in over her head at some point, and then she will be a victim again. Someone will rescue her, Theon or Brienne, or even worse, Littlefinger (the real villain).

Why winning Winterfell "for Littlefinger"? Right now, it's more that Littlefinger intends to deliver Winterfell to her. Just like that quote in the books that goes more or less, "here's my gift for you: Harry, the Vale and Winterfell". Only, y'know, without Harry or the Vale.

He's like those birds that deliver presents to their females to mate. :D ...do mockingbirds do that?

[Jack Bauer 24]

Making of Game of Thrones Day 6 #MonthOfGOT 6 days to go http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/the-faith-of-the-seven

[Arkash]

Just to fuel the conversation (and to eventually open another topic than Winterfell - though I understand it is the most interesting to discuss), I just wondered if Ghost will be a part of the expedition at Hardhome.

Last year, we didnt see him at all from the promos (both to keep him under wraps and because the rendering wasnt done) so we cannot expect to see him in the promos this year as well, but I truly hope he'll be at Hardhome as well, ripping wights right and left (unlikely to happen considering the downplay of the direwolves so far but one can wish !)...

But I think my hopes are vain cause I dont think he's gonna fit in the boats. ^^

[boojam]

Making of Game of Thrones Day 6 #MonthOfGOT 6 days to go http://www.makinggameofthrones.com/production-diary/the-faith-of-the-seven

Man looks like no third trailer! Don't think that's happened before?

[iheartseverus]

A whole season has passed after the red wedding, storylines have progressed.

Why on earth would D&D bring a now pointless character like Lady StoneHeart?

Why people want her? For the satisfaction of stark vengeance?

Lady StoneHeart is never happening, get past it already.

Actually, I wasn't referring to Stoneheart, at all. I was referring to whatever scheme Littlefinger has going on, with his bringing Sansa to Winterfell in the first place. We've all speculated on what in the world D&D have planned for LF in this whole scenario. So what I meant was, whatever that plan might be, I hope it involves a plot to bring down the Boltons. LF was obsessed with Cat Stark all his life, so it makes sense that whatever devious plans he has going on now, they involve retribution for her death.

[ADanceWithCats]

Just to fuel the conversation (and to eventually open another topic than Winterfell - though I understand it is the most interesting to discuss), I just wondered if Ghost will be a part of the expedition at Hardhome.

I think that S6 will be the year of Ghost. :)

[AllOfTheHours]

I don't know about anybody else, but I'm sort of poised between, I don't know.. dread? Outrage? Disappointment? Whatever, about the Sansa in Winterfell deal. My only hope is that its somehow been kept quiet all this time, but that it actually ends with...

the Starks send their regards.

Yes, I feel all those things. To be honest, partly because I don't trust HBO to do the Winterfell arc and Sansa's arc justice. I know saying this is blasphemy. But I was left disappointed by the changes they made in season 4 that fell flat; they either created needless shock (turning Jamine/Cersei in the sept into rape) or were plain anti-climactic (Locke's death after doing nothing to move the plot forward on the Wall).

The reason this bothers me, is that after season 1, I thought D&D could do anything and have it be awesome. Adding that Robert and Cersei dialogue was inspired IMO. They knew the characters and the story inside and out and all the cuts/changes/additions they made were fun and awesome. But as the seasons have progressed and they have had to make more structural changes (to keep the show to 7 seasons) their changes have gotten less awesome and more WTF.

If I knew they were merging Sansa-fArya-and whoever (Manderly? Alys Karstark?) in season 1 I would have been excited to see how amazing they would make it. After season 4 I'm worried we will get more empty shocks that fall flat and bigger plot holes from trying to justify these changes.

I would love to be proven wrong. Part of the reason I feel critical of D&D is because I think they are super talented and are able to do better. So I want to love their changes, and hopefully I will, but I am also apprehensive.

It's so wrong on so many levels, presumably they knew there would be controversy, and wanted it. They certainly didn't have to do it this way, not at all

Yep.

I still find this hard to believe, even for D&D. Though I have to say I laughed my ass off at the ET review where the reviewer said that some of the new characters ,e.g. Sand Snakes and the HS and his 'cult' seemed like they came from another show, because they were [paraphrasing] a little cartoonish, and over the top. You don't say?

I can only see this working at all if (1) They have Stannis take or about to take WF at the end of the year and Ramsay dies, e.g. Sansa stays in WF or (2) She escapes with Theon in place of Jeyne, which would leave the WF story in place but totally change everything about Sansa's story. I'm sure I have missed other permutations, but it seems like these are the basic thrusts, no? She stays in WF, which must mean the Bolton storyline is vastly speeded up or she serves as fake Arya and that story stays basically the same, minus the consumation w/Ramsay. Or what else can they do?

Yeah, I agree. We're definitely on uncharted ground plot wise. They can take Sansa is a dozen different directions, but only a few (like you mentioned) would actually be satisfying. I am really tired of seeing Sansa abused. And if she is just going to Winterfell to be fArya I will be pissed, because it would be a giant plothole just so we can see more violence against the Starks. "Oh, I got beaten and abused by the guy responsible for my dad's death, time to get beaten and abused by the guys responsible from my brother and mother's deaths too, lol!" If she becomes a seducing, revenge-getting machine that would be OOC too, but at least we get to see a Stark doing something about Winterfell/the North who isn't bound to the Wall.

[Le Cygne]

She stays in WF, which must mean the Bolton storyline is vastly speeded up or she serves as fake Arya and that story stays basically the same, minus the consumation w/Ramsay. Or what else can they do?

I suspect they will go there with the consummation, too. Just based on things various actors have said in interviews, and the way they do things.

Unless she has an ironclad plan to kill Littlefinger in the works, if the two of them end up alive and in Winterfell, she would be placing Littlefinger in control of Winterfell. No one is going to think she'll be the one calling the shots.

[Chebyshov]

I still find this hard to believe, even for D&D. Though I have to say I laughed my ass off at the ET review where the reviewer said that some of the new characters ,e.g. Sand Snakes and the HS and his 'cult' seemed like they came from another show, because they were [paraphrasing] a little cartoonish, and over the top. You don't say?

I can only see this working at all if (1) They have Stannis take or about to take WF at the end of the year and Ramsay dies, e.g. Sansa stays in WF or (2) She escapes with Theon in place of Jeyne, which would leave the WF story in place but totally change everything about Sansa's story. I'm sure I have missed other permutations, but it seems like these are the basic thrusts, no? She stays in WF, which must mean the Bolton storyline is vastly speeded up or she serves as fake Arya and that story stays basically the same, minus the consumation w/Ramsay. Or what else can they do?

According to Turner, the way her arc ends this season is "the most ambiguous thing ever," so take that with what you do.

I love that these changes are turning GOT into the kind of series Martin is consciously trying to avoid scripting: shocks for the sake of shocks without thought to narrative function, hollowed out characterizations, and overused tropes (looking at MyrcellaxTrys there).

[Cas Stark]

According to Turner, the way her arc ends this season is "the most ambiguous thing ever," so take that with what you do.

I love that these changes are turning GOT into the kind of series Martin is consciously trying to avoid scripting: shocks for the sake of shocks without thought to narrative function, hollowed out characterizations, and overused tropes (looking at MyrcellaxTrys there).

LOL, that isn't very helpful. I had originally thought they would never use Sansa as fake Arya who escapes w/Theon because that turns her whole story this season into a bunch of nothing, so once it was confirmed she was going to WF, I assumed this was a book 6 skip, where Sansa and LF go to WF at some point...after the Boltons lose to Stannis. But, who knows at this point.

I don't want the thread to go crazy again, but I really feel the show is causing Martin to lose his mind and is now driving him to start to tweak his own story in order to further differentiate it from HBO, rather than simply sticking with whatever he has had in mind, so it's lose/lose as far as I can see.

[FreeParking]

I see what AdmiralKyrd is saying, it's not a story.

And Sansa would appear to be making the choice to marry Ramsay on the show. They are portraying her as Littlefinger's willing, equal partner. She's not aware of his own crimes against her and her family, but I suspect she won't be resisting his kisses, and then she will seduce Ramsay at his direction.

She will be seen as winning Winterfell for Littlefinger, so the audience may even perceive her as a villain. I suppose they may have her appear in over her head at some point, and then she will be a victim again. Someone will rescue her, Theon or Brienne, or even worse, Littlefinger (the real villain).

It's all very muddled this way.

The new Alayne chapter:

And many of these things are eerily similar to the new Alayne chapter.

As far as the audience having trouble rallying around Sansa for revenge, if the book readers can cheer on a guy who tossed a leech into the fire to kill Robb (which as far as he know is what led to Robb's death), then I don't think there will be any problems. In fact, if Roose and Stannis ever meet, they should discuss how they both wanted Robb dead. Could be a bonding moment.