Who do you think will be the 13 POV characters at the start of WINDS?

[ChillyPolly]

9. Cersei

10. Jaime

11. Jon/Mel(if jon will actually die)

12. Davos

13. Samwell

14. prologue- Devan lannister

15. epilogue- Bran (not a typical prologue/epilogue character but I feel that the book will end with him with some sort of connection to the others).

I guess I am one of the few readers who likes Dany as a character and didn't entirely hate her adwd povs and character development but i think that in this book there's no need for her pov. we know where she is psychologically, there are already 3 pov characters in slavers bay and it would simply be better if we get to see her ending the battle of fire on drogon's back with jahqo's khalasar behind her from tyrion or barristan's point of view.

We'll need her POVs when she'll finally reach westeros.

I'll let you get away with Devan Lannister as a "one-off" pov, not counting toward the total, but classifying Bran with the "one-offs" to give an excuse to increase the count to 14 is cheating.

I'm shocked that you are predicting that Dany will not reach Westeros in WINDS. So, is there really NO hope that he will finish the series, then?

[born amidst snow and corn]

I'll let you get away with Devan Lannister as a "one-off" pov, not counting toward the total, but classifying Bran with the "one-offs" to give an excuse to increase the count to 14 is cheating.

I'm shocked that you are predicting that Dany will not reach Westeros in WINDS. So, is there really NO hope that he will finish the series, then?

it's not that hard to believe that george would include bran as an epilogue pov character who doesn't die at the end to end the winds of winter with somethings that ties the starks,the cotf and the others together, but if not maybe someone else can(hmmm benjen hmmmm).

as for dany i predict that she will sail to westeros at the end of twow when aegon is already king so that the second dance will happen at the same time as the invasion of the others at the start of ados, and there would be plenty of room for the final clash in this book, but sadly no matter what george will do he'll never finish this book before season 7 of the show airs and bypass the books (as for winds and season 6 i'm optimistic).

[ChillyPolly]

it's not that hard to believe that george would include bran as an epilogue pov character who doesn't die at the end to end the winds of winter

Not at all. He already did that in Book 2. The last chapter was a Bran chapter.

What is hard to believe is that he would not count Bran as one of the POVs in the volume, merely because it was the last chapter in the book, or merely because he decided to change the chapter title from "Bran" to "Epilogue". Bran is one of the "big 6" main characters. If he appears he appears; and if he appears, he counts. Why would GRRM change the chapter title from "Bran" to "Epilogue" merely to give himself an arbitrary excuse to say Winds will have 13 POVs instead of 14?.

[born amidst snow and corn]

it is possible that he meant 13 pov characters who are recurring throughout the book so one chapter characters like melisandre,oakhart and hotah were in the last two books as well as the prologue and epilogue POVs simply won't count.

but if it won't i withdraw bran as a pick.

[ChillyPolly]

it is possible that he meant 13 pov characters who are recurring throughout the book so one chapter characters like melisandre,oakhart and hotah were in the last two books as well as the prologue and epilogue POVs simply won't count.

That does not seem likely, based on precedent. Here's a quote from his 5/19/11 Not-A-Blog about DANCE:

Once, a few years back, I said that I only meant to introduce one new viewpoint character in the book. Which just goes to show why I should never sound off about these things before the book is done. In the end, I wound up with.... hmmm, let me count 'em... one, two, three... ah... FOUR new viewpoint characters. And that doesn't even include the Prologue and Epilogue. So...

So there's a precedent for not counting prologues and epilogues (they are what GRRM calls 'one-offs' - POV characters eliminated in the same chapters that introduce them) - but there is no precedent for not counting recurring characters - or even non-recurring characters like Mel - merely because they only appear once in the volume.

EDIT: And the total POV count for DANCE he gives (in the same NAB post) is "sixteen". That excludes Varamyr & Kevan ("one-offs", from the prologue and epilogue), but includes Jaime & Mel, both of whom only appear once.

[shavedquaithe]

Melisandre, for sure.

[ChillyPolly]

Melisandre, for sure.

I'd have thought she'd be the first character most people would cross off their list, upon realizing GRRM's current count is only 13.

[I_Might_Be_God]

I don't think we will get any Jon POVs in the next one unfortunately

1. Arya
2. Tyrion
3. Dany
4. Sam
5. Cersei
6. Jaime
7. Sansa
8. Davos
9. Theon
10. Arriane
11. Victarion
12. Melisandre
13. Aeron

With a prologue involving Jeyne Westerling and an epilogue involving an Other killing somebody south of the wall that we are familiar with.

[Skore]

I'm hoping for another Melisandre POV and I'd love (love love love!) a Varys POV.

[Carey Snow]

Well, if there are only 13, these 13 would make the most sense to me:

1. Theon - confirmed

2. Arya- confirmed

3. Selmy- Confirmed

4. Tyrion- Confirmed

5. Sansa- Confirmed

6. Victarion- Confirmed

7. Dany- Obviously

8. Melisandre- we will need a POV at the wall

9. Davos- He is going to come back from Skagos

10. Jaime- Need a point of view in the river lands

11. Arriane - confirmed

12. Samwell- Need a point of view in Old Town

13. Cersei- Need a point of view in King's Landing

That leaves Jon Snow (dead, may become undead), Brienne (almost dead with half her face gone, soon to die in Jaime's POV), Areo (not sure what to do with him), Jon Connington (we can hear about his and fAegon's exploits as they march toward Kings Landing by Ravens), Asha (Not sure how her story is going to end), Bran (we may see his arc though interactions with animals and the Godswoods trees- I may want him switched out for Cersei though because his chapters were some of the best in aDwD). Aeron (hopefully George decided to simply drop him if there is only 13.)

[Other May I?]

Confirmed:

1. Sansa
2. Arya
3. Tyrion
4. Theon
5. Arianne
6. Barristan
7. Aeron
8. Victarion
9. Bran
10. Davos

My bets on the other three would be:
11. Dany (Strongly hinted at by GRRM)
12. Cersei (Need a KL PoV, will likely see her trial)
13. Jon [snow] (Main Character, PoV at the wall)

In addition, I wouldn't be surprised to see one-off chapters focusing on:
A. Melisandre (Need a Wall PoV pre-Snow-rez)
B. Brienne || Jaime (Dangling plot thread)
C. Sam (Oldtown PoV, dangling plot thread)
D. Areo (Dorne PoV)
E. Jon [Connington] (Battle of Storm's End / Aegon PoV, although this could be subsumed by Arianne).

[ChillyPolly]

Confirmed:

1. Sansa

2. Arya

3. Tyrion

4. Theon

5. Arianne

6. Barristan

7. Aeron

8. Victarion

9. Bran

10. Davos

Though both are on my own list, I would not count Bran or Davos as "confirmed".

[Ser Eric]

Bran is almost as close to confirmed as it gets. There's no way he doesn't have at least one chapter in the Winds.

Davos on the other hand is likely to miss out I think. I don't see any pressing need for him to have a PoV. That said, that's purely based on where I think the plot might be heading and I could be really wrong on that.

One thing's for sure though, if the 13 number is correct then a few prominent PoV characters from previous books may no longer have their own chapter.

[nickdt]

Bran is almost as close to confirmed as it gets. There's no way he doesn't have at least one chapter in the Winds.

Davos on the other hand is likely to miss out I think. I don't see any pressing need for him to have a PoV. That said, that's purely based on where I think the plot might be heading and I could be really wrong on that.

One thing's for sure though, if the 13 number is correct then a few prominent PoV characters from previous books may no longer have their own chapter.

Davos is also nearly confirmed, since GRRM has said Rickon and Osha will be in WOW.

[Ser Eric]

Davos is also nearly confirmed, since GRRM has said Rickon and Osha will be in WOW.

I don't doubt they will be in WoW but I doubt we will see them from Davos PoV. If GRRM wanted to expand on Davos' search for Rickon he would have done it in the last book but he didn't. More than likely that when we next see him it will be from Theon's PoV.

[ChillyPolly]

I don't doubt they will be in WoW but I doubt we will see them from Davos PoV. If GRRM wanted to expand on Davos' search for Rickon he would have done it in the last book but he didn't. More than likely that when we next see him it will be from Theon's PoV.

Yes. Personally, I think we could see a Davos POV, but there are just too many holes in the argument that it has been CONFIRMED. It hasn't been.

[Aetta]

I don't think we will get any Jon POVs in the next one unfortunately

1. Arya

2. Tyrion

3. Dany

4. Sam

5. Cersei

6. Jaime

7. Sansa

8. Davos

9. Theon

10. Arriane

11. Victarion

12. Melisandre

13. Aeron

With a prologue involving Jeyne Westerling and an epilogue involving an Other killing somebody south of the wall that we are familiar with.

BBM

You dirty dog, you've enticed me.

[nickdt]

Yes. Personally, I think we could see a Davos POV, but there are just too many holes in the argument that it has been CONFIRMED. It hasn't been.

Well, that is why is said NEARLY. But i believe he will be a POV, cause i think he will be trying to convince the Skagosi join there sides, because Rickon is a Stark. I know, its a bad argument since the Skagosi and the Starks are on bad foot, but i have a feeling the Skagosi hate the Boltons more. And also, it is rumored that among other possibilites, a member of House Magnar of Skagos (No relation to Magnars of Thenn), can be the Nights King. But if this rumor is true, maybe the Skagosi have some ways to deal with the White Walkers.

[SkylerWhite]

1. Theon

2. Arya

3. Selmy

4. Tyrion

5. Sansa

6. Victarion

7. Jon C.

8. Melisandre

9. Davos

10. Jaime

11. Arriane

12. Samwell

13. Cersei

Epilogue Bran

No one needs Dany and Jon Snow in TWOW

[ChillyPolly]

In addition, I wouldn't be surprised to see one-off chapters focusing on:

A. Melisandre (Need a Wall PoV pre-Snow-rez)

B. Brienne || Jaime (Dangling plot thread)

C. Sam (Oldtown PoV, dangling plot thread)

D. Areo (Dorne PoV)

E. Jon [Connington] (Battle of Storm's End / Aegon PoV, although this could be subsumed by Arianne).

Isn't a "one-off" a chapter where a character appears only once as a POV, and then gets "offed" by the end of the chapter? That's what I always took it to mean. Or are you predicting these characters will die?

In any event, GRRM's count for Book 5 was "sixteen" POVs. This does not count the "one-off" at the beginning (Varamyr), and the "one-off" at the end (Kevan), but it does count the Melisandre chapter and the Jaime chapter.