Houndhelm Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Gene Wolfe is probably the most universally acclaimed sci-fi author I've ever heard of. People whose literary opinion I really respect always talk about how great he is. So every couple years I sit down and try to read the Severian the Torturer series. And goddam if I just can’t do it. I can sit there and read it for an hour, put the book down and have no coherent memory of what just happened. I always get to the part where the main characters are passing through some kind of massive labyrinthine wall... with guardians living in it or something..? And then I give up until a couple more years have gone by. Even now, after having read it a few times over the years, I still can't tell you what the opening chapters are about.I love unreliable narrator stories and mind benders but something about Wolfe's writing just loses me. I really want to understand it though. So for the Gene Wolfe fans here, is there a trick to reading his stories? Did you have to try a few times to really get into his style? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kephv Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 No. The difficulty of reading the book has been entirely overstated. Understanding some of the symbolism and themes is more challenging, but that's why his books are so much better the second or third time through. It sounds like it's just not your cup of tea. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
polishgenius Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Neil Gaiman has your back.But yeah essentially what you need to do is get through to the end taking each scene as it comes and enjoying the immense quality of the prose. Then the next time you re-read the beginning things should start becoming more clear in light of things learned later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Try one of his stand alones or Latro in the Mist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 As Kephv says, everyone has different tastes, and some books you will like better than I will and vice versa. But like you, I have some Gene Wolfe books that I have read but not enjoyed, while at the same time finding that some of his other works are truly amazing and enjoyable. For instance, I have read The Wizard Knight and not enjoyed it at all, finding that the symbolism overwhelms any actual story and blots out any interest I might have in the protagonist. While at the same time I found Soldier of the Mist and Soldier of Arete to be among the most enjoyable books of the 1980s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eponine Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Heh, I enjoyed Book of the New Sun and hated Soldier of the Mist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hello World Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 And then I give up until a couple more years have gone by. Even now, after having read it a few times over the years, I still can't tell you what the opening chapters are about. It has nothing to do with how smart you are. On a first read, there is a very good chance that you’ll find the first half (if not the entire series) very boring, to say the least. Personally, I was very intrigued by the mysteries regarding the Autarch and the citadel, the visions and dreams etc, in addition to question of just who the fuck Severian is. That’s what had me hooked early on, not that series the didn’t have its annoying bits. Is the supposed greatness of the prose alone enough to get you through Gene Wolfe’s sorry excuse for a plot? I don’t know, but If I were you I wouldn’t feel bad if I can’t get into it. The whole you need to re-read it several times to appreciate it might be true, but for many it is a downside, not a plus, and understandably so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houndhelm Posted April 21, 2015 Author Share Posted April 21, 2015 For instance, I have read The Wizard Knight and not enjoyed it at all, finding that the symbolism overwhelms any actual story and blots out any interest I might have in the protagonist. While at the same time I found Soldier of the Mist and Soldier of Arete to be among the most enjoyable books of the 1980s. Wizard Knight is the only other Gene Wolfe book I’ve read. I found it fascinating because it captured the feeling of someone narrating a dream. The way the protagonist doesn't remember very well his past before the story begins, the multi-tiered fantasy world, the friends and foes that appear out of nowhere, it all makes sense within the context of the dream (or story) but when but when I finished the book I was hard pressed to describe what it was about. I admired it more than I liked it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterbound Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 I'll second DR in this one (well, we agree on most things), and say read the Latro series. This also runs true with the 'Ep hates everything I like' narrative that has dominated my life for the past 5 years. I love wolfe, but some of his stuff can be inaccessible. Try reading that shit in the early to mid 90s when there was no fucking internet to help you understand what the fuck was going on. Pirate freedom is pretty good as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 Wizard Knight is, from what I recall Some guy dying/is dead from PTSD/possibly during some sort of 9/11 like hijacking? It's been a while. But there are definitely direct allusions to both 9/11 itself and the War on Terror, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lily Valley Posted April 21, 2015 Share Posted April 21, 2015 I have There Are Doors. It's a stand alone and aside from occasionally being sure the narrator was crazy, the story was easy to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 There we go - inaccessible. As Peterbound says, reading some of Wolfe's stuff in the 80's and 90's by yourself, without any other person to ask, "What in the world is going on in this book?" was part of the reason that his stuff was pretty oblique to me. And the other part is that he does tell stories by telling separate, highly unrelated stories. As Darth Richard II notes above, my least favorite Wolfe story is actually telling a completely different story. (And neither one of them works for me.) The first time I heard or read about this, I literally thought that the person using this interpretation was [choose one]: actively pulling my leg, trying to defend an (in my eyes at the time) indefensible novel, or currently stoned. So I had to go back and read a story I didn't enjoy the first time, this time using a filter of another set of circumstances to try and understand the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AverageGuy Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Wizard Knight is the only other Gene Wolfe book I’ve read. I found it fascinating because it captured the feeling of someone narrating a dream. It's literally the dream of a dying boy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 A good rule of thumb for Wolfe Standalones is 1. Someone is a Werewolf 2. There's a time loop. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houndhelm Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 Wizard Knight is, from what I recall Hm, interesting. I didn't pick up on that at all so maybe it's worth a reread. Did Wolfe come out and say this in an interview somewhere? It seems to be relatively common knowledge based on the replies in the thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterbound Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Hm, interesting. I didn't pick up on that at all so maybe it's worth a reread. Did Wolfe come out and say this in an interview somewhere? It seems to be relatively common knowledge based on the replies in the thread.No, we're just smart enough for Gene Wolfe :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 Actually I think he might have. He's done a lot of interviews though, and, as you might expect, he's bit odd. I'll see if I can dig it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth Richard II Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 There's actually a wizard knight companion, which is pretty interesting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seiche Posted April 22, 2015 Share Posted April 22, 2015 ..what you need to do is get through to the end taking each scene as it comes and enjoying the immense quality of the prose. Then the next time you re-read the beginning things should start becoming more clear in light of things learned later. I've seen a similar sentiment in advice about how to approach Gravity's Rainbow for the first time. I haven't read Wolfe or Pynchon to judge if it's good advice in either case but it's not something people say about every author. Is the supposed greatness of the prose alone enough to get you through Gene Wolfe’s sorry excuse for a plot? I don’t know, but If I were you I wouldn’t feel bad if I can’t get into it. I feel this way about Jonathan Strange & Mr Norrell with respect to both the writing and the pacing. I think the plot is quite compelling but it takes forfuckingever to progress through that plot. I happened to enjoy Clarke's writing, and therefore the book, quite a bit but I totally get it when I hear that some folks hate it. I admired it more than I liked it. This is exactly how I felt about The Wind-Up Bird Chronicle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Houndhelm Posted April 22, 2015 Author Share Posted April 22, 2015 No, we're just smart enough for Gene Wolfe :)Clearly SOMEONE didn't read the thread title. :dunno: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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