Civil Unrest in Baltimore and the Freddie Gray Trial

[Mudguard]

It's breathtakingly naive to see the police literally figuratively say "Nice career your husband has there, would be a shame if something happened to it" and think it's not a threat.

No, they did not literally say what you claimed they said. Fixed your sentence for you.

If it was really intended as a threat, it's a toothless one because there's nothing the police can do to turn public opinion against him in his district. What are they going to say? If they try to directly harass him, his wife is the City Attorney. I'm sure that her office would shut any real threat down immediately.

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

That just doesn't make much sense to me. You think that Nick Mosby's district, which rioted, is going to be persuaded by Police campaigning against him? If anything, that's just going to make him even more popular in his district. I really doubt that they were thinking about going down this road. I think the recusal angle makes more sense. Still a long shot in my view, but not crazy. You really think they would make a blatant threat in an open letter?

I think that you don't really understand the dynamics of local politics. Everyone on the Baltimore City Council is a Democrat. These people are all fishing from the same pond. The guy that runs against Nick Mosby in the next District 7 election isn't going to be some white, Republican, retired cop shouting about the need for law and order. He's going to be a bright, fresh-faced, charismatic young black Democrat with political aspirations and he's going to be talking about pretty much the same core issues in the same style as Mr. Mosby. Except he's going to be eager to pick up a little extra cash and behind the scenes support from the Baltimore City FOP because he's assured the leadership that he wants to improve the relationship between the police and the populace by calming down all this fiery rhetoric that's been going on lately.

The 2011 Baltimore City Council Elections are, in terms of total number of votes cast, small potatoes. Nick Mosby won the Democratic Primary (which means he also wins the general, since Baltimore is a one-party town) with only 2,871 votes. His closest competitor lost with 2,218. That's not a hard margin to overcome.

**Edited to add - as a lawyer, I think it's also worth pointing out that their "conflict" argument, at least as it relates to the marriage between Marilyn and Nick Mosby, is absurd. It's not even close to being one. And moreover, the guy who wrote the "open letter" isn't an attorney and is using legal terminology and legal arguments without any serious basis. I mean, for fuck's sake, he refers to Maryland's "Rules of Professional Conduct" as the "Professional Rules of Professional Responsibility." Redundant much?

[Shryke]

No, they did not literally say what you claimed they said. Fixed your sentence for you.

No, they very much said exactly that. That's what:

Most importantly, it is clear that your husband's political future will be directly impacted, for better or worse, by the outcome of your investigation.

means.

If it was really intended as a threat, it's a toothless one because there's nothing the police can do to turn public opinion against him in his district. What are they going to say? If they try to directly harass him, his wife is the City Attorney. I'm sure that her office would shut any real threat down immediately.

They will campaign against him. Especially in local elections with such low turnout, this kind of thing can be important. There's a reason politicians court police unions (among other entities).

[Mudguard]

I think that you don't really understand the dynamics of local politics. Everyone on the Baltimore City Council is a Democrat. These people are all fishing from the same pond. The guy that runs against Nick Mosby in the next District 7 election isn't going to be some white, Republican, retired cop shouting about the need for law and order. He's going to be a bright, fresh-faced, charismatic young black Democrat with political aspirations and he's going to be talking about pretty much the same core issues in the same style as Mr. Mosby. Except he's going to be eager to pick up a little extra cash and behind the scenes support from the Baltimore City FOP because he's assured the leadership that he wants to improve the relationship between the police and the populace by calming down all this fiery rhetoric that's been going on lately.

The 2011 Baltimore City Council Elections are, in terms of total number of votes cast, small potatoes. Nick Mosby won the Democratic Primary (which means he also wins the general, since Baltimore is a one-party town) with only 2,871 votes. His closest competitor lost with 2,218. That's not a hard margin to overcome.

**Edited to add - as a lawyer, I think it's also worth pointing out that their "conflict" argument, at least as it relates to the marriage between Marilyn and Nick Mosby, is absurd. It's not even close to being one. And moreover, the guy who wrote the "open letter" isn't an attorney and is using legal terminology and legal arguments without any serious basis. I mean, for fuck's sake, he refers to Maryland's "Rules of Professional Conduct" as the "Professional Rules of Professional Responsibility." Redundant much?

OK, that seems plausible. I could see them trying to back another candidate. Since Ms. Mosby isn't backing down, it'll be interesting to see how Mr. Mosby's reelection goes, assuming he's running for office again.

[Dr. Pepper]

You really think they would make a blatant threat in an open letter?

Police murder people on camera. They have been reported to harass and arrest those individuals who catch them abusing their power on camera. In New York, they turned their back on the mayor right before they decided to stop doing their job, all because the mayor acknowledged that racism exists. Telling a prosector her husband's career could be on the line is sort of the least of it. Plus, it's not like making this threat is in any way illegal.

Well, to show a conflict of interest existing with her husband, they need to show that her husband would have something to gain or lose by the way the case is prosecuted. It's not enough to just say that she's married to the councilman representing the district and leave it at that.

Why wouldn't it be enough? There is a way to word what they said without making it into a very clear threat. Simply, her relationship with a councilmember who stands to gain from this trial is a conflict of interest. That address all the relevant points without turning it into a "better watch out, your husband won't have a job if you don't back down" sort of threat.

[Mudguard]

Police murder people on camera. They have been reported to harass and arrest those individuals who catch them abusing their power on camera. In New York, they turned their back on the mayor right before they decided to stop doing their job, all because the mayor acknowledged that racism exists. Telling a prosector her husband's career could be on the line is sort of the least of it. Plus, it's not like making this threat is in any way illegal.

Why wouldn't it be enough? There is a way to word what they said without making it into a very clear threat. Simply, her relationship with a councilmember who stands to gain from this trial is a conflict of interest. That address all the relevant points without turning it into a "better watch out, your husband won't have a job if you don't back down" sort of threat.

I'm coming around to the idea that it might be a threat. Nestor's argument that they could back another candidate is pretty good. I could see that happening.

[Littlefingers In The Air]

I've been seeing a lot of people (away from the forum) give Stephanie Rawlings-Blake grief because she vetoed a bill last year that would have put body cameras on the entire BDP. But her decision was the only right choice to make, because the bill passing would have been illegal. Here's a good article on it

City Solicitor George Nilson said the legislation backed by Council President Bernard C. "Jack" Young violates a city charter provision that prohibits lawmakers from interfering with the power of the police commissioner.

City Councilwoman Rochelle "Rikki" Spector, who cast the lone vote against the measure Monday, cited that opinion. "This is not a legal action," Spector said.

Last week, the attorney general's office declined to offer an opinion on the legality of the bill, but said in a letter that Nilson's argument appeared "complete and well-reasoned."

Nevertheless, City Councilwoman Mary Pat Clarke said she wasn't persuaded.

"When it comes to legal opinions, they're a matter of opinion," Clarke said. "The citizens feel that it is a step in the right direction."

[kairparavel]

The FOP are alleging conflict of interest with a local media person as well:

http://www.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/tv/z-on-tv-blog/bal-freddie-gray-media-conflicts-of-interest-20150501-story.html

“These conflicts … include the lead prosecutor’s connections with members of the local media. Based on several nationally televised interviews, these reporters are likely to be witnesses in any potential litigation regarding this incident.”

Janice Bledsoe is the deputy state's attorney who led the Freddie Gray investigation. Jayne Miller, investigative reporter for WBAL-TV, confirmed to a Sun reporter Friday that she is in a relationship with Bledsoe.

[Ser Scot A Ellison]

Mudguard,

No, they did not literally say what you claimed they said. Fixed your sentence for you.

If it was really intended as a threat, it's a toothless one because there's nothing the police can do to turn public opinion against him in his district. What are they going to say? If they try to directly harass him, his wife is the City Attorney. I'm sure that her office would shut any real threat down immediately.

Given that the police are the enforcement arm for any action taken by the Baltimore Government, how do you propose the city Government "act" to "shut any real threat down immediately"? Even worse what can the city government do given that the threat is political?

[eyenon15]

Is that a normal thing for police to write a letter to the A?

Couldn't they just use a phone?

it's laughable for anyone employed in law enforcement system to preach about conflict of interest.

[Larry of the Lawn]

Is that a normal thing for police to write a letter to the A?

Couldn't they just use a phone?

it's laughable for anyone employed in law enforcement system to preach about conflict of interest.

Yup, especially since they mention the other lawyer that donated to her campaign. I imagine pretty much every police union in the country backs a DA.

[jagilki]

Wow. When I turned on the TV this morning it was on Fox news, so I was treated to the most blatant a**-kissing of the Fraternal Order of Police I've ever heard, it was sickening.

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

The FOP are alleging conflict of interest with a local media person as well:

http://www.baltimoresun.com/entertainment/tv/z-on-tv-blog/bal-freddie-gray-media-conflicts-of-interest-20150501-story.html

I really don't even understand the claim being made by the FOP that reporters are likely to be witnesses in the criminal trial. Why? Unless a reporter was an actual first-hand witness to the police's treatment of Mr. Gray, and to my knowledge none of them were, I don't see why they would be called to testify.

Maybe I can find the answer in my "Professional Rules of Professional Responsibility." It just sounds like nonsense to me.

[Michael Seswatha Jordan]

Where I'm from, we have ALOT of Baltimore natives. They migrate here so to say, to get away from the endless cycle of poverty and hardship. Here they can find work, not great paying work, but at least its honest work and can raise a family. I've talked to a few Baltimore natives who, obviously, have many, many family members still in Baltimore.

One, they, along with I, blame the media for focusing purely on the violent protests. A friend said he spoke with his mother, and said that 90% of the people starting the trouble are teenage boys. I asked why that is, here is a basic summary of what was said to me.

"Do you think its just a coincidence that most of our Military is from the inner city? No, these kids grow up in a "war", a war for their life. They don't know where they will get their next meal, have to walk in "gangs" wherever they go for fear of getting robbed or worst yet, murdered for their shoes or clothes! They are awoken most nights of their life because of gun shots or sirens, its a perpetual war-zone. No wonder, the smart ones, join the military, risk a few years of their life serving, just so they have a chance to get the hell out. Its an endless cycle of poverty, unemployment and violence otherwise."

Look these are scared young men. Scared they might be the next fall victim to police brutality. And what my friend made clear about the police brutality was this. They have enough fear of the gangs and general violence that goes on in their communities, that, police brutality is the stake in their heart. The one people who's job it is to protect them, are targeting them, for no good reason, and using excessive force. I asked if this happens a lot, he looked at me with that look that answers the question. He said routine stops usually end with someone being slammed to the ground and searched with no probable cause at all.

A lot of people on my Facebook feed are making this about race. Well, have you been to inner city Baltimore? I have, and besides the inner harbor, I felt a minority in the city. I walked into stores and usually was the only white person. So, its only normal for the ones to be rioting and peacefully protesting to be black.

I don't really know what is to be done about this recurring situation in America. But, something sure as hell needs to be done. It doesn't matter if Freddy Gray died at the hands of the police or because of injury to himself, it was just the tipping point.

[The King in Black]

Police always weren't like this. Things have all gone to hell ever since they decided to 'enforce law' instead of protecting citizens.

[eyenon15]

Ah, those wacky 4chaners

http://thedailywh.at/2015/04/prank-day-4chan-users-troll-fox-phoenixs-live-coverage-baltimore-riots/

[NestorMakhnosLovechild]

Police always weren't like this. Things have all gone to hell ever since they decided to 'enforce law' instead of protecting citizens.

It's true, the police weren't always like this. In fact, there was a time that the police didn't even feel the need to hide their physical abuse of minorities. It used to be that they would just unleash the dogs and fire hoses right in front of the media. Can you imagine?!

[eyenon15]

He must have been talking about the police from Norman Rockwell paintings

[DireWolfSpirit]

Many communities should go through some

downsizing of their police forces.

"To make the streets safer" for civillians!

I know I certainly fealt that way when I lived in the Vegas Valley.http://nvcopblock.org/1030/lvmpd-killer-reputation-fear-and-loathing-in-las-vegas/

[The Iceman of the North]

I made this post in the other thread responding to Summah wondering about any effect on international pressure:

The Northern Mariana Islands have been conspicuously quiet on this subject. What other allies that Americans like and respect are there out there? Bibi is hardly the right man to address this.

Seems like the latter have similar problems with his citizens of African decent:

Ethiopian Israeli clash with police as anti-racism rally turn violent

I really like this massively naive statement:

“Our parents were humiliated for years. We are not prepared to wait any longer to be recognised as equal citizens. It may take a few months, but it will happen,” another demonstrator told Channel 10.